The Worst Decision by a US President in History – by David Horowitz

khalid

The Obama administration has taken a giant step in its march to throw in the towel  in the war against radical Islam. On FoxNews this morning, Peter King said of the decision to try the soldiers of al-Qaeda — who by their own account have no country but their cause — as civilians

“may be the worst decision by a U.S. president in history.”

It certainly is. It sends a signal to terrorists everywhere to attack civilians.

The administration is justifying its decisions on the grounds that because the 9/11 attackers targeted civilians they should be tried as civilians. This makes no sense unless you are a Democrat who believes that the “holy war” that Islamic jihadists have formally declared on us is no different from the acts of isolated individuals who have decided to break the law. This is the approach to the war on terror that John Kerry championed in 2004. Now that Americans have had the poor judgment — the suicidally poor judgment — to make a leftist their president, this is the strategy our nation is set to pursue.

The decision to try the jihadists in a civilian court is also a decision which will divulge America’s security secrets to the enemy since civilian courts afford defendants the right of discovery. It is also a propaganda gift to Islamic murderers who will turn the courtroom into a media circus to promote their hatred against the Great Satan — a hatred shared by their apologists at the American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU) and the pro-Castro Center for Constitutional Rights who have pioneered the campaign against Guantanamo and whose influence in the Obama Administration is pervasive. (BTW, The newly appointed lawyer for the president is the husband of Obama’s recently departed Maoist communications director Anita Dunn.)

Finally, this move continues and enlarges the refusal of the President and the American Left to recognize that:

  1. We are in a war that has been declared on us — in which we, in other words, are the victims.
  2. That the war is conducted by religious armies whose war is inspired by their reading of the Koran.
  3. That the number of Muslims who support their war plan is in the tens of millions
  4. That they are aided and abetted by many Islamic governments and by the international Left.

  • clark81

    The trials are almost certain to result in convictions and death sentences: what more can you ask? Why do you hate freedom so much, Dave?

  • Name

    Because you're about to lose your freedom Clark81

  • pneville

    Ask OJ Simpson about the certanty of justice in US civilian courts. One crooked or terrorized juror can cause a mistrial. I wonder if clark 81 would volunteer to serve on this jury. Obama truly sees the US Constitution as a suicide pact. Nuremberg was good enough for German facists Guantanimo is good enough for Muslim facist.

  • codefender

    I have to agree with Mr Horowitz. As a retired AF officer, if I were guilty of a crime on the battlefield, I would face a Military Court Martial, under the UCMJ. This decision by the law firm of Obama and Holder is the equivalent of spitting in the faces of all of those who serve, and have served honorably…these terrorists receive a trial with all the rights afforded to citizens by our constitution, but those citizens who serve don't receive those rights? Come on people…wake up—I fear it's already too late.

  • BS77

    Hey Clark81…think before you write. Even FDR, the liberal's favorite President did not oppose a miltary tribunal from trying non uniformed enemy combatants ( German saboteurs) who were subsequently hanged. Now we are taking some of the worst mass murdering vermin…and putting them on a show trial that could drag on for months, even years..FDR must be rolling in his grave…..The terrorists should have been tried by a military court and executed….but NOOOO….now we live in the PC world of Kumbiya.

    Mr. Horowitz does not hate freedom, you idiot…. These creatures do not warrant a trial in a criminal court..these are enemy combatants…not US civilians, but foreign nationals. Surely you can understand this. The real agenda here is this: To put the CIA and the US military on trial, to dissect the Bush security and intelligence services……to put waterboarding and tough treatment before a bunch of dodo jury members… …to perhaps make evidence inadmissable…perhaps making a liberal judge declare a mistrial…and then what?? These terror vermin are going to be coddled and pampered by the most left leaning ACLU types….in an effort to make the jury sympathetic!!! Just like cop killer Mumia. Moving this trial to New York is crazy…there is no justification for this. We live in a sick PC liberal atmosphere now…..and it seems we must give Constitutional rights to thugs, not even US citizens, who killed thousands of US citizens on 9-11. Pathetic.

  • BS77

    You got that right COdefender…good post.

  • http://twitter.com/Qitman Frank Kitman

    “the defense calls mr. van jones to the stand”

  • USMCSniper

    Here us the can od worms that Obama and Holder have opened by this decision.

    “The 6th Amendment guarantees the accused the right to a speedy and public trial by an impartial jury. Althiugh the exact phrase “jury of one's peers” is not included in the Amendment, however, the courts interpret peer to mean equal, i.e., the jury pool must include a cross section of the population of the community in terms of gender, race, and national origin following precedence. The jury selection process must not exclude or intentionally narrow any particular group of people.”

    The defense will insist on and get several Muslims to be included in the main jury and as alternates for the jury, and the trial will be lengthy, and result in a hung jury with no convictions worse than the O.J.Simpson trial. And then they will repeat the process with the same result and all the lawyers will get rich because justice is not what they are there for. It is for feathers in their caps and for lots and lots of government monies.

  • chisco1

    “Now that Americans have had the poor judgment — the suicidally poor judgment — to make a leftist their president, this is the strategy our nation is set to pursue.”

    I would have to exchange the words “a leftist” for the name “barack hussein obama”…Bill Clinton and Jimmy Carter were both leftist Democrats but NEITHER of them were EVER STUPID ENOUGH TO MAKE A MOVE THIS MORONIC AND TREASONOUS!

    Only Da Wun has ever let his own ego and megalomania control to the point of making decisions that will result in the coming disasters that will result DIRECTLY from these “trials”…….

    The only thing that this decision WON'T do is supply the actual physical weapons and ammunition; but not to worry, the terrorists already have those, and they're smart enough to be able to get them here too….”money talks” and the southern border is WIDE OPEN…..

  • dka

    I guess these Muslims are aided and abetted by Obama as well. He helps them every chance he gets!Perhaps impeachment is in order, because a president of the USA takes an oath, and this one is not living up to it!

  • chisco1

    “The Worst Decision by a US President in History”…….well, this “decision” is definitely in keeping with the title of the article…..obama is now officially the WORST “prez'dint” in US history……..and NO, I will not dignify him by associating the title President properly spelled and capitalized with this POSEUR……..

  • A.J.Oakleys

    After hearing attorneys discuss these Terrorist being brought to NYC, they agree that these man could “walk”!

  • http://twitter.com/Qitman Frank Kitman

    After a parade of truthers, they will probably all agree that bush did it,
    …and try him.

  • BS77

    Interesting that the AG is willing to allow the terrorist behind the USS Cole bombing receive a military tribunal trial….but not KSM and his four insect associates…no, they are to be given a “civilian” trial on US soil, in New York, just blocks from ground zero. This is INSANE. The security situation will be a nightmare. Jurors and their families will be at risk. The whole thing is wrong. These insects deserve a military tribunal and the firing squad. Interesting also that one of the most vociferous supporters of this trial in NY is that scag Romero from the ACLU…he applauds the decision.

  • carl

    if that was the point you might have a point……

  • omar2

    Clark.

    It IS conveibale that one or more of these vermin will be acquitted. What willl Obama do then? Of course you can keep trying them 'til you run out of charges, but really, if the de facto point of all this is to never let them see the light of day, no matter what the verdict, why not admit the whole thing is a sham? The purpose of detention for people who levy war against us is to keep them OFF the field of battle, not to assess “guilt” or “innocence” in a sham trial in order to please the hard left. If our policy is intended to keep these guys detained no matter what (as is appropriate for enemy combatants), why not simply admit it's a war – as opposed to an overseas contingency operation – and proceed accordingly?

  • migtex1234

    what does one expect from the first Anti-American president.
    zero does not care about anything American except using tac dollars
    to fund his play. He is a total disaster. Just wonder how long it will
    take for most Americans to get it. He will also pull out of Afghan &
    leave a trail of terror not seen since ww 2. He is just the front man
    for Soros. Soros paid for election & now he is running the show.

  • josephkuehl

    Obama is painting a target on the back of more innocents; I can only wonder how imaginative the Jihadists can be in using this trial as an opportunity. Will we see suicide bombers in lower Manhattan, or coordinated takeovers of elementary schools demanding KSM's release, or assassinations of participants in the trials?

    The list of possibilities is endlessly long and tragic, and for what? To give self confessed murderers, who have already demanded execution, a stage for their rantings, or, more likely, to provide bread and circuses to distract the public from the terrible damage the Obama Administration is doing to our country?

  • pete

    ABC News showed a very high quality film clip on their news Wednesday night, I think it was. The clip was taken from a Taliban position overlooking an american humvee at a rural compound or house in Afghanistan. It told how the taliban were attacking the American soldiers from 4 sides. The humvee was a sitting duck – all the taliban positions were in the hills above it. The film was quite a propoganda tool for the Taliban. Did ABC do the filming? Did they buy it from the Al Jezerra or the Taliban. I can't imagine any American news network showing a film from the viewpoint of the enemy during WWII or the Korean or VietNamese wars.

  • DemocracyFirst

    If DH is right and the trials will prove disastrous for the US, justice and the defensive war against Islamists, then it may also prove disastrous for Obama's re-election chances. One will be hard pressed to find an independent who will vote for him in 2012 amidst the 2nd ongoing year of nauseating OJ-style trials.

  • DemocracyFirst

    Obama is using far more Predator attacks on “suspected” Taliban Islamists in Afghanistan and northern Pakistan than did Bush. How can he authorize the killing of these people, and often family members with them, without trial first to confirm their guilt?

  • Pythagoras

    They WANT convictions and death sentences! They are thrilled to be martyrs who, through discovery, will expose our intelligence methods.

    The 1993 civilian trial of the blind sheik revealed that we were tapping Osama's satellite phone. He immediately stopped using it.

    Gee, did that matter?

  • TalkinHorse

    There's a terrible irony in having a government structure that no longer recognizes any Constitutional restrictions on its authority with respect to domestic control of American citizens, but pulls out all the stops for the benefit of foreign genocidal maniacs. This intolerable madness is pushing the nation toward internal discord the likes of which hasn't been seen since the Civil War. God help us all.

  • DaphneeLee

    I am just wondering what the “solution” to these people is. Do we continue to make all there rhetoric true about ourselves, fueling there religious zealotry and murdering hatred OR do we somehow change enough to give them the space to back up. Do we keep them cornered and just blow them all away until alas we finally find Bin Laden. Do we continually become the MONSTER and give fuel to their misguided beliefs. Just like Hollywood and the media creates an Image of Americans, what really plays out by our lack of real concern for our impact on others. What if we had not embraced fossil fuels and nixed them 40 years ago, forcing ourselves to develop another means that is not limited. What if we stopped invading others homes and taking the best of what they have all the while handing them a bill of goods. None of that really matters to people like u here though. I think what Obama has decided takes enormous GUTS, WISDOM and a SHOW OF FAITH IN A NEW AND DIFFERENT WAY TO LIVE WITH ONE ANOTHER.

    I am just in favor of acting like the bigger person and setting examples and being A ROLE MODEL. That is how humans LEARN. To make change, you have to be the change. I know it is not crushing vengeance, but ya know that is not for you to pass judgment on, really. EGO maniacs!

  • jackhampton

    DaphneeLeeYour naive is about as politely as I can put it. They are not going to take any space to back up because they believe that this is what God has directed them to do. It has nothing to do with our use of oil just as it had nothing to do with oil when Churchill was fighting them in the River Wars See the book at that time oil was not an issue no more than it is the issue now. Your reference to fossil fuels is absurd had we not used fossil fuels we would look much like Afghanistan does to day not hardly a stick of wood left in the country because most of it would have been burned to facilitate daily living warmth from cold to cooking food. Guess what there is nothing that is going to replace these fossil fuels at this time in history as well because the very thing that would the left has fought tooth and nail against and that is nuclear energy. We will one day have cars running on hydrogen but for now they are to expensive and the infrastructure must be in place to support it. But these terrorist are bombing and killing to follow the path set down for them by the murderous pedophile they worship. You really need to grow up.“I think what Obama has decided takes enormous GUTS, WISDOM and a SHOW OF FAITH IN A NEW AND DIFFERENT WAY TO LIVE WITH ONE ANOTHER”Mercy talk about an egomaniac Obama is your guy.

  • jackbelias

    They hate us because we do not believe as they do. Islam is a totalitarian culture, not a victim group to feel solidarity with. Unlike any leftist brat in America Ive been deployed to Islamic nations, I am in fact still in Iraq. You moronic MTV “educated” wealthy leftist brats wouldnt believe the things Ive seen. There is no way we need to “change” so they can see that we have embraced their way of life. Being female and able to write makes you deserving of public execution in an Islamic society. Disagreeing with men is an even more unforgivable sin against the sociopathic lord god.

    Your religious pop culture icon in the white house has his own agenda. He is well liked by the international community, most importantly the international radical muslim community. He grew up muslim and still seems to identify with their views and actions. This last decision of his was treason, he hopes for hung juries and not guilty verdicts. Most of all he hopes for total exposure of all CIA agents, special forces operatives, FBI agents, etc… who happen to be monitoring muslims within the international community. Obama will become a god to the entire international community as soon as the first agent is exposed. Starstruck mindless fans like you will of course see him as a gift from the lord god and praise him, his international popularity being proof of his divinity for the progressive obamabot population. Only the remaining human population will see him for the traitor he is.

    We are at war, working class AMERICANS like myself were doing just fine blasting them away until your extremist revolutionary pop star came along. We had arrested dozens of radical revolutionary leaders, exposed hundreds of weapons caches, and even managed to allow all of the people to vote, go to school, and conduct business. The bill of goods we hand to arabs right now is more than they have ever had under progressive radical revolutionary islamic rule. Many of the arabs like us, but MTV forgets to mention that over its Obama messiah worship day. The arabs here are mostly friendly people who just want to be allowed to educate their children and conduct business. You have some nerve suggesting it was immoral to set them free. Islam was immoral for dominating them!

    America and its pop culture absurdity hates the military, while I find myself shocked to be better liked here than at home. When we go out on missions they line up along the street with smiles and wave at us. Several Arabs Ive spoken to want to join the US military and live where I do. I was honest with one a while back, I told him that living in MTV inspired Obamaland isnt what its all cracked up to be. America was great, but Obamaland will only force him to go back to the way things were as a way of tolerating progressive revolutionary muslim extremists. He thanked me for my honesty and said he would have to look into other things.

    Your global warming religion is absurd too. Faith based BS and its dogmas excite the mindless mob a bit too much. There are no better alternative fuels, the earth is getting cooler, and socialist nations like China and the former Soviet Union did far more damage to the environment than our capitalist evil empire America could ever hope to do.

    Obamessiah doenst have tremendous guts. He says the popular thing and does the popular thing as a way of gaining more starstruck fans like you. It takes iron balls to say the unpopular thing, and do the more difficult unpopular deeds. Obama has no balls at all.

    This “bigger person” spiritual Jesus Christ syndrome you have is disturbing. You are the kind of little victim that apologizes to its rapist or murderer.Being limp wristed and agreeable at all times is not a winning strategy. Radical revolutionary muslims will easily run right over a society dominated by the likes of you. You dont have the strength to fight, the abiltity to know fear while not being dominated by it, nor do you have any sense of honor.

    These are your golden years as Obama is going to make all of your life decisions for you. hes going to tell you what you want to do, how much you make, and how much you will want. You will be free from making decisions and even from feeling offended given his intense hatred for free speech. The minority human population gets more and more angry by the day however. We do not want to be free from feeling offended or be walked through life like a dog. These golden years for your mindless robotic progressive population will be short lived I promise you.

    I will also say that the sociopathic lord god and his holy messiah in the white house are guilty of being ego maniacs. The messiah has a weak self esteem and doesnt like it when radio talk shows dsagree with him. Disagreement hurts feelings, disagreement is hate, disagreement is unAmerican. Instead we all have to boost his ego by marching lock step and praising him loudly with religious sounding pop culture catch phrases. His ego is important.

    America was a better nation for the human population, the Obamabots were too thin skinned and weak to survive in it so you all developed an intense hatred. It was nature that screwed you over, not fossil fuels, global warming, capitalism, free speech, firearms, or anything else.

  • BS77

    Daphne…your spelling and grammar are atrocious. Please get some help.

  • swathdiver

    When its all over, this decision by Comrade Presidente Obama will seem like he was an American Patriot. It's going to get worse folks.

  • KingofNorway

    Deeply appreciate your work David, and your statements here, which are entirely true. This President seems incapable of making good decisions for all his celebrated 'intelligence.' My thoughts here, if I may:

    http://www.examiner.com/x-27672-Portland-Politi

  • KingofNorway

    Preserving and promoting freedom is the entire point but this President and this AG seem hell bent on destroying it. Codefender and USMC Sniper below make excellent points. If you treat an enemy combatant as a civilian you have spit in the faces of the American soldiers who risked their lives to capture these killers, and you have opened the door to the killers to use our system against us in a furtherance of the 9/11 attacks, all of it destructive to our republic, and therefore threats to freedom, not to mention the encouragement other jihadis will receive from watching their brothers make fools of us. Wake up!

  • jackhampton

    Kingof Norway
    Your point is well taken I hate to have to say it but if I was back in uniform I assure you I would take no more prisoners. Next they will be allowing the captured terrorist to file compliants and charges against individual soldiers. This is a nightmare.

  • jackhampton

    TalkinHorse you are correct this nation is a tinder box all that is needed is a tiny spark. The marxist fools in control at this time have a tin ear. It is scary out there.

  • jackhampton

    BS77
    I am not suprised at all the ACLU was founded by a devout comunist named Baldwin that openly admited he wanted to do away with all private property. The Blowhard O'Reilly is right about one thing the ACLU is the most dangerous organization in the country.

  • jackhampton

    pete
    ABC, NBC and CNN are on there side. they are openly cheering the terrorist on. I have often stated that the only thing that might change the minds of Hollywood and the liberal left is if the terrorist start bombing Hollywood and the leftwing organizations but they are not about to attack there supporters. The safest place in this country to be from a terrorist attack is at the Academy Awards audeince or at the New York Times office building. Hell they are not going to kill them thay are saving these fools till last then they will take there heads.

  • jimboellis

    only 3 more years of this Marxist fool president. Can the nation survive it?

    After voting for Hitler, Germany spent a generation apoligizing for their collosal mistake. We will be doing the same.

    Pray for this nation.

  • Kevin

    We are at war with radical Islamic Extremism. It is not with a uniformed army so the Geneva Accords don't apply, but it is a war nontheless. Why can't leftists in this country understand that as they do so much to help our enemy……at our peril???

  • oldwhiteguy

    you folks do have the second amendment and i assume you are well armed. you will also have to fight well armed muslims but what the heck the is a price for freedom.

  • mrstarry

    How much is this lovely trial going to cost us, money-wise? Oh I forgot, money is no object for Obama because it's our money being so wisely and wonderfully spent.

  • JeromefromLayton

    Sadly, it did occur during the Vietnam War. Just check out what Walter Cronkite did during the Chicago Riot and the coverage of the traitors Kerry, Fonda, Hayden, and others. That's how our victory in 1973 was turned into a defeat in 1975.

  • concretemaker

    Why the heck are we even fighting a war in Afghanistan if we're going to send the 9-11 mastermind to civilian court?

  • KingofNorway

    Jack,

    Can't blame you. It was hard enough knowing the enemy two days ago. Now our own leaders make it harder on the military and appear to go so far as to stand against us. Their policies actually diminish battlefield mercy. Once these killers take the stand, watch the morale at CIA drop, enlistment drop, and our ability to defend ourselves drop. Who would step up to risk his life to defend us with a commander in chief like this?

  • KingofNorway

    Mr. Bush alwasy struck me as a good man, honest, forthright, courageous, steady, a man of integrity, not perfect, but you knew where you stood, and he did a great job protecting the country. He looks better and better, daily.

  • markom

    I have agreed and disagreed with Presidents we have had in the past, but I have never felt that a President from either party was intentionally not doing what he felt was in the best interests of the country.

    I am convinced that Obama is a wolf in sheeps clothing – trying to draw the U.S. into a one world system.

    By creating this media circus in New York, Obama assures Islamofascists that he does not believe He is at war with them. He shows that he regards 9/11 as an isolated criminal act and not part of a larger war.

    I do not understand the immediate, thoughtless, and inappropriate response by Bloomberg.

    I also believe that THIS act will be Obama's and the Democrat's Waterloo in 2010 and 2012.

  • OneWayJesus

    PLEASE WAKE UP America! This guy is NOT OUR President!!!! He is a JIHADIST Terrorist in the White House that is a MUSLIM and HIS AGENDA is OUR DESTRUCTION!! Sorry for the Use of Capitals, but this is a WAKE UP CALL!
    This Usurper is a Demon from the Pit of Hell!! He is a Liar, a Deceiver, a Usurper, a Wolf in Sheeps clothing – EVERYTHING about this guy IS FALSE!!
    WE MUST INDICT HIM NOW, IMPEACH HIM, TRY HIM FOR TREASON! And Ultimately, he must face a DEATH SENTENCE! That is the extent of the CRIMES he has committed so far, and those he has secured in the pipeline. The Demise of ALL of Your Freedoms! Enough is Enough. It is time for YOU and ME to TAKE TO THE STREETS and TAKE OUR COUNTRY BACK – BEFORE THEY TAKE OUR WEAPONS AWAY!! The Hour is at Hand – It is NOW OR NEVER!!.
    Custers Last Stand – Well He was Slaughtered! LET US NOT GO the SAME WAY!!
    LIVE FREE OR DIE!! The Motto that I see on many Bikers Colors. But it is the Motto for Freedom Fighters One and ALL!
    God Bless America, The Land of the Free!!
    May She be FREE Once More!
    In GOD WE TRUST. America IS a CHRISTIAN NATION. It Will NEVER Be a MUSLIM Nation. The God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob Rules Over this LAND, the God of the JEWS and the CHRISTIANS, NEVER!!!
    The Fallen One, called Satan, better known to the Muslims, THEIR God “Allah”, will NEVER rule over this Land. Allah/Satan will be cast into the pit along with Satan and his creation, his Death Cult Islam, and burn in Hell forever!

  • Bee

    I don't know why the news media is cheering on the Jihad. They will be the first ones marched in front of the firing squads when the Islamists take control of the flow of information.

  • R.A. Smith

    There is another aspect to the Administration's move to try these terrorists in criminal court that is equally insidious. Part of their plan is to open up the torture issue once again in another attempt to indict the Bush Administration before the Nation and the World. Note the selective nature of those selected for trial. These creeps will never stop their Chicago brass knuckle thuggery until they are defeated. In the meantime we are all in jeopardy.

  • Bee

    Daphnee…they do NOT back up when you “give them space.” They sense your weakness, come for you, and CUT YOUR HEAD OFF WITH A DULL KNIFE. Read the Koran, it's all there…

  • DemocracyFirst

    You'd think that, and yet left wing NYC is their prime target. In Canada 13 were arrested for a plot to kill the prime minister, bomb the parliament buildings AND bomb the Toronto headquarters of the left wing, perfectly politically correct, moral equivalence/relativism supporting CBC (Canadian Broadcasting Corporation).

    Islamists don't share our nuances. They target what they see as our sources of power and national symbols.

  • DemocracyFirst

    I've assumed all year, as Obama revealed himself to be the far leftist he denied during the campaign, and brought in similarly minded people to government, that he'd be re-elected anyhow – Americans would be loathe to appear racist or stir up racial tension. Instead, they'd take it all out on the Democratic Party, which would lose big time.

    But now i see independents, who decide elections, being pushed too far as these trials descend into OJ-style farce. Angry and embarassed for the nation, they may well vote againsty not just the Democrats, but Obama himself.

  • Ruckweiler

    After serving in the Army during Carter's entire administration, I didn't think anyone could top him for being the worst. The Kenyan has done the deed before the first year is up. Wonder when the Democrats will argue for his impeachment.

  • Ruckweiler

    DaphneeLee:
    The solution to these Moslem crazies is a 5.56mm or 7.62mm round. Sorry that this is the solution but they will never stop their murderous ways. They die or we do. I told my students on 9/11 that the answer was to kill these bums in numbers that will scare us but that will ultimately be the method required for peace.

  • mojobebop

    i never imagined the idea of a civil war might bring comfort.

  • mojobebop

    don't look now. (rome is burning).

  • allahwins

    One can only “hope” for a “Change” in the next victim list of the terrorists. Only dunderheaded politicians, am I being redundant, are to be targeted. We have to start our recovery somewhere, right?

  • BS77

    One of President Bush's failings was in not pushing to expedite the trial of these dirtbags….a military tribunal in Gitmo would have been fine….then firing squad. End of story. Now we are facing a multi year civil trail, with continuances, delays, appeals, objections, calls for further evidence, more appeals….a total friggin nightmare. I cannot believe what this Administration has done. This is recklessness of the worst kind. These are not US citizens, not ordinary criminals…these are agents of war, mass murdering combatants…and they deserve a military court.

  • margota1

    So in this civilian trial these terrorist are to be judged by a jury of their peers. Are we going to bring their fellow terrorist from their home country? How is that going to work?

  • anitaisaia

    I grieve for the people who lost loved ones on 9/11 and for New York, my hometown. The decision to have a trial there was made by men who have never been in the military and have no idea how to go about bringing these terrorists to justice. This all aided and abetted by a president who was a community organizer. What a travesty for those who gave their lives and for my wonderful city!

  • Robert Wargas

    The terrorists will turn the courtroom into a UN-style harangue against the United States, which leftists everywhere will fall for. At the first mention of the word “torture,” the Soros-backed media will start their propaganda.

  • Nelson W. Lentz

    2. the war(that the Muslims have declared on us) is conducted by (Islamic)religious armies whose war is inspired by the Koran (not just by”their reading of the Koran”, whatever that means.).
    3. The number of Muslims who support their war is not “in the tens of millions” but in the hundred of millions; about 80% of the world Muslim population of 1.4 billion.

  • clark81

    “Hey Clark81…think before you write. Even FDR, the liberal's favorite President did not oppose a miltary tribunal from trying non uniformed enemy combatants ( German saboteurs) who were subsequently hanged.”

    The circumstances were wildly different. The German saboteurs were members of the German armed forces (i.e. uniformed services) operating in civilian garb, an activity explicitly forbidden under the Geneva Conventions, combatants (such as partisans and civilian resistance fighters) who are not members of state military/security forces have much more leeway to act without uniforms under international law.

    Moreover, Roosevelt's actions were made during a time of actual, declared war, a state which has always been understood to grant the President greater leeway in such matters. But we aren't, legally speaking, at war right now, and a Congressional “authorization of force” cannot, legally speaking, absolve the President of his duty to abide by both domestic and international legal constraints on his power.

    Finally, Roosevelt's decision to try the German saboteurs before a military tribunal took place in the midst of a war against a coalition of powers capable of putting tens of MILLIONS of trained soldiers in the field. The Axis represented a direct and existential threat to the United States and her closest allies. Sorry, but al Qaeda doesn't even come CLOSE to representing an existential threat to the United States. The minimal threat they represent simply doesn't justify abandoning the US Constitution or continuing to thumb our nose at international law.

    “Mr. Horowitz does not hate freedom, you idiot…. These creatures do not warrant a trial in a criminal court..these are enemy combatants…not US civilians, but foreign nationals.”

    We try foreign nationals in US criminal courts all the time, and have for the entire history of this country. Do swarthy men with beards frighten you so much that you feel that the only option is to abandon 250 years of legal precedent in favor of banana republic kangaroo courts? What a pussy.

  • clark81

    “Ask OJ Simpson about the certanty of justice in US civilian courts. One crooked or terrorized juror can cause a mistrial. I wonder if clark 81 would volunteer to serve on this jury.”

    Then why try people at all? I mean, guilty folks might get away and all. Maybe we should replace jury trial with something more…efficient. Perhaps with “military tribunals” where the accused are not allowed to see the evidence against them and their 'defense counsel' consists of military officers whose careers could be jeopardized by allowing their 'clients' to be acquitted. Yeah, that's the ticket. And maybe we could first torture confessions out of them. That's how we defend freedom in a real free country.

    You and Horowitz would have served Stalin well.

    “Obama truly sees the US Constitution as a suicide pact. Nuremberg was good enough for German facists Guantanimo is good enough for Muslim facists.”

    I didn't know Germans hated faces!

  • clark81

    “They WANT convictions and death sentences! They are thrilled to be martyrs”

    Then how much more would they be thrilled to be martyred in rigged military show trials that give the lie to all of our pious claims about freedom and democracy, you raging retard.

    “through discovery, will expose our intelligence methods.”

    Except that any evidence that exposes “sources and methods” will almost certainly be barred from defense discovery under the state secrets act. You're a moron.

  • clark81

    “If you treat an enemy combatant as a civilian you have spit in the faces of the American soldiers who risked their lives to capture these killers…”

    So? Better that than to spit on the Constitution, which is what advocates of military kangaroo courts are pushing for. Why do Judeofascists hate freedom with such a burning passion?

  • wss25

    The real problem is these people may receive justice rather than presumed guilty.

  • shanecomeback

    Kudos to Daphne for airhead post of the year. Clark,don't you get out of breath chasing those ambulances?

  • martha

    Ca'nt happen soon enough, if you ask me.

  • BS77

    This change of venue is an insult to our CIA, our military justice system, our troops and our intelligence and security systems. These are foreign nationals, enemy combatants who have killed thousands of US citizens….in a brazen act of terror and war. They should be tried in a military tribunal…not a US civilian court….This is unbelievable!! Of course this civil criminal trial is supported by the ACLU and other far left subversives. This trial will cost tens of millions of dollars; it will be constantly delayed by calls for evidence, questions about waterboarding and interrogations, outbursts from the defendents, objections, continuances, for classified evidence be made public…that highly classified individuals be sub peoned by leftist lawyers and their rotten backers. You will see leftist and CAIR financing pit bull defense counsels….you will see a mass media circus unfolding, unlike anything since that theatrical OJ trial. This is a nightmare for the relatives of the victims of 9/11. Thousands of 9-11 victims are lying in their graves…and the terror insects are given all the privileges and protections of a civil trail…un-friggin-believable.

  • JungleCogs

    This has nothing to do with “fairness”; military tribunals are just as fair and just as protective of the rights of the accused as any US trial. This is all about the lefties plan to put America on trial. That could never happen with a military tribunal. Obama knows well what he is doing. Once the trial starts it will be all about how evil America is.

  • Nina Del Senno

    How much can NYers take? We are dumped upon again by having the terrorists in our city.

  • wss25

    Where were you when the judge denied the 9/11 truthers access to the ballot?

  • DaphneeLee

    You will NEVER convince me that violence committed on others creates PEACE. You are the idealist to think such a thing could really be, all your advocating for is annihilation of an entire sector of human beings that don't agree with us on basically all levels. I won't ever support your view because it only feeds hatred, suppression and intimidation among people and even if u killed them all, others would come together against us, FOREVER THIS WILL HAPPEN, not because they are all evil, some of it is related to OUR ROLE IN THEIR LIVES AND THE WORLD STAGE AT LARGE.

  • DaphneeLee

    I am not clear what u mean. Are u saying that America is not evil at all and has nothing to atone for, grow from, learn about, make mistakes from, redo. Amazing. I don't see America as evil, yet I am honest enough to admit my country has committed many EVIL ACTS. It amazes me how many people comment as if they have first hand knowledge. You are all just projecting your OWN FEARS into this situation, as for reality, we will all just have to wait and see. Maybe then you can write, “I told ya so”, but until then, no one really knows how this “fairness” will all play out.

  • Javid

    Thanks to those of you stupid enought to have voted for Obama. This is the result of your decision. Is there any doubt that more is to come. God help us all, I fear this is only the beginning.

  • KingofNorway

    I suppose one could turn the question around. Why do progressofascists think everyone who disagrees with them is a fascist. Do you realize how ridiculous you appear invoking an idiot term like “Judeofascist”? Apparently not. Clueless one supposes further. Otherwise, the real fascists, the jihadis, hate freedom, and say so, quite boldly. They also want your head on a spike, that is, after they cut if off with a dull kitchen knife. The point is you hammerhead, the U.S. Constitution applies to U.S. CITIZENS, not vowed enemies of the U.S., people devoted to our destruction. Furthermore, did you know Mr. Obama at one time assured everyone the best route was military tribunals? Oh yes. Here is the video:

    KMS will get full military trial:

    http://www.breitbart.tv/bombshell-uncovered-oba

    If you think this president has core values perhaps you should change your mind, if facts and logic have an sway.

    If you think American military personnel deserve to be insulted and humilitated, then I'd suggest you take some self-defense courses as you will likely need them with the jihadis come a knockin'.

    And if you think our military holds kangaroo courts then you are so far removed from reality it's doubtful there's hope for you in any case.

  • DaphneeLee

    I might be NAIVE, but I still don't agree with you. You have no way of predicting what u said about fossil fuels, it is only conjecture. You are basing those comments on a history that you know of, since. I am referring to a strength we have as human beings, that strength being REINVENTION. Many times when there are NO solutions, we humans sometimes come up with REALLY REALLY GOOD ideas. Many of these IDEAS came at the expense of something else or came from great suffering. I was referring to that originality spirit, for lack of a better term. I was saying that if we had forced ourselves to seek alternatives, we could have prevailed. But yes, with a country populated with the likes of people like you, I guess u are right.You have made your opinion known and noted.

  • Jack

    Since his transferring the 9/11 Terrorist case to the US Criminal Court in NYC now manifests, as nothing has to date, that Obama is, or is acting as, Commander-in-Chief of a Fifth Column rather than of the United States of America, Robert Bauer's becoming White House Counsel is more than pivotal as to Obama's legal representation in the only remaining Constitutional Eligibility case (for damages by Keyes), Keyes v. Obama, USDC, CA — that is, the only remaining Obama Constitutional case addressing the dual loyalties prohibition under the Article 2 “natural born citizen” (two citizen parents) requirement inserted in the Constitution to avert the very threat manifested by Obama's latest 9/11 actions.

    Assuming the Alan Keyes suit or cause of action for tort fraud against Candidate (Pre-President) Obama survives in Judge Carter’s court (e.g., leave to file second amended complaint), Bauer, in his official Government capacity as White House Counsel (as well as the Justice Dept. for that matter) cannot appropriately represent Obama in a Government capacity.

    Although service of process on Obama occurred the day before the 1/21/09 valid Oath of Office, even if service occurred after Oath of Office, Obama would not have Presidential immunity for personal torts. (Any Presidential immunity is even less than Congressional immunity.)

  • KingofNorway

    KSM freely admits guilt. Should have faced a firing squad long ago.

    Now they will put him on the stand to say whatever he wants, you raging retarded moron. You really think Holder has no political interest in this show trial?

    (BTW, it's politically incorrect to use the term 'retard,' you retard.)

  • ron norman

    Don't you think that this is being done on purpose? To gain complete control you first must have complete anarchy so that the people think anything is better than what is happening. The Government is tilting towards Marxism and the People don't realize what that means; Communists have murdered over 200 million of their own citizens world wide and that most people in the United States will have to go into re-education camps in order to see the 'light.'

  • JeromefromLayton

    The Judge will make a huge difference. Remember, OJ faced three different courts, two criminal and one civil. The first one turned into a farce because of the Judge who allowed some really wierd stuff to go on. Yes, it was great for TV ratings, but not for justice. The second trial was a civil action and that Judge ran an orderly court that allowed enough evidence to come out proving OJ being financially responsible for the losses. Then, OJ went on a “golf trip” and got away for a while. His third trial was in Las Vegas, NV. This was another no-nonsense Judge and the whole case didn't take too long. The result is that OJ will either die in a Nevada penal institution or leave as a really old man with no assets.

    So, who will get the dubious honor of trying this mess? By the way, David is absolutely right about the choice of Venue. OJ's first trial was in downtown LA when it should have been in Santa Monica and this case should be tried in Quantico or some other Military Court with charges of War Crimes on the docket which won't be available in the District Court.

  • clark81

    And if KSM “freely admits” guilt and “says whatever he wants” on the witness stand, why should we worry? Did your mother never tell you about sticks, stones and words? Let him say what he wants. Let him rage like a madman. WHO FUCKING CARES? You'd throw away 250 years of the rule of law just so some guy can't say nasty things on the way to the needle? Do you have an extra chromosome, or are you just another impotent sociopath with a tiny dick who can only feel like a real man when he's loudly calling for a descent into barbarism?

  • Robert Wargas

    This decision has nothing to do with justice or legal expediency; it is pure politics: Obama is trying desperately NOT to be George W. Bush. This means ditching everything associated with his predecessor, including military tribunals. This may seem absurd; that's because it is.

    Plus, Obama is contending with pressure from leftist advocacy groups (namely, the ACLU) who want to stop the War on Terror, close Gitmo, and prosecute the CIA. David Horowitz makes a great point when he brings up disclosure. The trial will turn into a public trial of the CIA and its interrogation techniques. This brings the radical Left ever closer to destroying America.

  • clark81

    “I suppose one could turn the question around. Why do progressofascists think everyone who disagrees with them is a fascist?”

    I see that satire is entirely beyond your ken. Not that I expected better of a mongoloid like you.

    “Do you realize how ridiculous you appear invoking an idiotic term like “Judeofascist”?”

    Do you realize that this is just a parody of all the absurd “Islamofascist” talk from pinheads with an ethnic axe to grind like Horowitz and Daniel Pipes? Of course you don't: you're as immune to irony as any other sociopathic loser trying to compensate for insufficient masculine endowments with empty calls for more violence. When you dig up a clue, call me. Until then, toodles!

  • Pythagoras

    Thanks for the brilliant ripostes but I need you to weigh in on my last point about the 1993 trial of the blind sheik. We lost essential intel the last time, no?

    Oh, and sorry about being a raging retard and a moron. I'll at least try to rage less next time. The other two are incurable.

  • JungleCogs

    I stand by my comments and added a bit more above. Further, your response proves my point. Lefties want this trial be be all about America.

  • clark81

    We were also operating under a totally different legal regime as far as state secrets are concerned. Post-9/11 legislation has given federal prosecutors enormous leeway to deny defense counsel access to materials that might reveal sources and methods of intelligence gathering. Those laws have already been upheld by SCOTUS, so there's virtually no chance of a repeat of 1993. In KSM's case, in particular, the man has made enough public boasts concerning that there really is no need for the prosecution to delve too deeply into evidence developed by US intelligence. Obama very carefully chose to go to civilian trial with the cases that are easy slam dunks, reserving the military tribunal option for people who would be harder to convict in civilian courts (because, for instance, the bulk of the evidence against them was acquired through torture). What he's set up is a system where the state always wins, no matter what.

  • Jeff

    Your use of terms like “worst”, along with your conclusions, belie the standards of journalistic commentary.

    While I agree with most of what you said, I'm more interested in how you reached your conclusions. Less so with the Beckian, Palinesque disregard for truth exemplified by your broad strokes.

    If this war is to be won, it must be done in a smarter way.

  • Rob_W

    Oh my achin' head.

    This president and his left wing cadre have got to go.

    1: from his left wing cabinet, to Acorn, to Holder speaking this week to unindicted co-conspirators (CAIR) as if they were somehow legitimate partners for progress.

    2: from his bowing before the Saudi king to his refusal to acknowledge an America under attack from hostile fascist forces.

    3: from his lunacy of treating the Cole bombers as enemy combatants – but the 9-11 hijackers as mere criminals.

    4: from his insistence in cautioning America not to “rush to judgement” about Fort Hood being a terrorist act – then to his self-same rush to judgement to claim only a “mystery” can explain major Hasan's motives.

    5: to his soon to be watered down military deployment in Afghanistan while missing the golden opportunity to catch the Taliban in a once in lifetime vise between Helmand and the Pakistani forces now finally enraged as they've never been before.

    6: to his saddling America with 1 Trillion dollar year on year deficits.

    7: to his exalting the most heinous war criminals in world history to simple “alleged criminals” worthy of due process.

    8: to his failure to understand both the trauma of a country just devastated by the world's worst financial crisis – with half the country out of work and the other half losing their homes – as if we somehow have the mental capacity to watch a theater of the absurd unfold in a lower Manahattan courthouse for the next 3 years – with endless appeals, endless spillover to Dick Cheney (who gives a crap about him anyway) to the additional endless spillover to how terrible and heartless America has become in trying poor Khaled Sheik Mohammed and his band of freedom fighters.

    9: and now he wants to create a media circus with Khaled Sheik Mohammed that will weary us more than Watergate ever could.

    10: and we'll have to sit and watch these guys have 75% of their evidence tossed out of court due to water boarding – when these guys should never be in court to begin with – because their's was an act of war – not an act of crime.

    11: Giuliani was right last night on Fox – Obama would grant the attacking Japanese fighter pilots over Pearl Harbor a tax-payer funded trial in downtown Honolulu – with all the attendant morbid introspection over Japanese internment that we should all flagellate ourselves over in a never ending grotesque display of self loathing.

    12: to his elevating all Jihadi's everywhere to legitimate freedom fighters – who won their right to stand trial in New York – and to give them a stage to declare their cause before a world filled with people like Sudan's president Bashir who unapologetically murder a million Darfurian refugees – and dances around the street like he hasn't a care in the world as he thumbs his nose at the UN.

    Lets cut to the chase – Obama is an idiot – who neither understands himself and his own weird need to apologize to the whole world for what a horrible country America is – and he doesn't even understand that he is making this country a whipping boy for crimes it isn't even guilty of.

    I AM VOTING REPUBLICAN NEXT ELECTION EVEN IF GENGHIS KHAN RUNS FOR OFFICE. I AM VOTING THIS IDIOT OUT OF OFFICE AND OUT OF MY MIND.

    RobW

  • Pythagoras

    Clark81

    Good to see your writing style has picked up.

    I think our real disagreement is on whether this is predictable. I'd have to agree that Obama and his advisors must have thought this through extensively. However, I think they greatly underestimated the uncertainty.

    For example, this trial will presumably involve a jury. The uncertainty there is huge — not to mention all the securty concerns. Also, how are we going to pick unbiased jurors? What is the likelihood of a conviction being overturned on appeal? Only ONE juror needs to be “discovered” to be tainted and we're back to square 1.

    There are so many uncertainties that, in total, it's hard to imagine this process being completed cleanly. Something big is going to go wrong. Either:

    1) The US justice system will look bad (remember, lies propagate easily in the middle east — e.g. the killing of al Dura, the Sadr bullets hoax, the Jenin massacre, etc., etc. — so the thing that makes us look bad doesn't have to actually happen. It only needs to work as a story-line.)

    2) There will be a significant security breach (a la Jack Ruby or something even larger).

    3) A judges ruling will go horribly bad (in the trial or on appeal — lots of chances for that).

    4) A juror will insist on acquittal.

    5) The trail set-up and/or the change of venue will lead to a series of protests that'll make the tea-parties look like a love-in.

    Here's one I'll predict right now. KSM will change his announced plea from “guilty” to “innocent”. Is that not a setback?

  • MarkR

    As usual David an excellent response to the indefensible. We now are living in the age of Orwell. Surely Communism was and remains a horrid example of Orwellian double speak and post modernism. The biggest difference is that in the past the West was a bulwark against this insidious disease. Now the west has drunk the kool-aid. The most perilous aspect of your commentary was the statement alluding to the tens of millions of jihadist adherents worldwide. The horror of this also lay in the fact that unlike Nazi Germany and the Axis powers or the USSR and its satellites this army of evil lives in the shadows and is far more deadly in that for the true believers among them they look upon death as a welcome and glorious entrance in to eternity. Its the equivilant of having a # of countries all trained and believing in Kamikazi raids. The real travesty is that the people of this country turned a blind eye to facts and evidence as regards Obama and went instead by blind emotion. This is a tragic turn of events in our history and it may already be too late. Its laughable if it werent so tragic that the first to perish in this potential world conflagration will be the leftists among us who slavishly defend the Islamists. Take for instance the feminists who ignore the grotesque way women are subjected to every cruelty in Islamic countries and sharia law. Its the ultimate in idiocy and a suicidal urge among those who probably truly believe they are somehow going to pacify the lions of Jihad- what a pathetic and horrible joke!

  • MarkR

    Hi David. An excellent post on a subject that the far left has highjacked from reason and debate. Post modernism and Orwellian double speak are now part and parcel of American life. Enough Americans are mesmerized by it to allow acceptance of evil Islamism to sprout as a viable alternative to American exceptionalism. We are in other words admonished to turn a blind eye to reality to pacify a deluison. The far left sees Bush and Cheney as the agents of death while the real agents of death play upon this delusion to gain a foothold in American society under cover and in cells and will revel in the opportunity to exploit this.

  • Pythagoras

    Clark81,

    Good to get into a real debate here. Basically, you think that the Obama admin won't screw up this prosecution as bad as the Clinton Admin screwed up theirs. You are right that there are some laws in place to help but I think the situation is MUCH worse now and the screw-ups will be worse too.

    Your original post used the words, “almost certain” about conviction. I'm less confident. If they manage to find a venue (which may change from NY) and if the can get past the protests (which could make the tea-parties look like love-ins) and if they manage to pick an untainted jury pool. . .

    OK, I'm going to stop right there because any juror who is really untainted is totally unpredictable. What would an untainted juror, who could not be successfully challenged on appeal, be like? How could someone not be tainted? How could someone that stupid be counted on to deliver a logical verdict?

    Anyway, after all this, they have to handle security (a big terrorist attack to disrupt the trial is a possibility — then there's the Jack Ruby scenario), handle whatever the defense throws at them, and not get a hung jury and not get overturned on appeal.

    Even if the process completes successfully, KSM doesn't look healthy enough to live that long.

    What are the chances that KSM will enter an innocent plea now? Would that count as a significant setback?

    Obama is, once again, being naive.

  • clark81

    Pythagoras, keep in mind that these trials are going to be conducted AT THE FEDERAL LEVEL. Federal district court judges don't typically allow the sort of jury packing schemes you seem to fear, and, frankly, federal judges just don't make procedural errors. These are the finest legal professionals in America, not country bumpkins who have to stand for election (which is typical at the state level). Also, it would be a mistake to forget that the appeals process is…highly abbreviated when cases are tried originally by the Feds. Remember, any appeal will go first to a Circuit Court of Appeals and then to SCOTUS and that's it. The current Court (and any conceivable Court that might hear the case) has staunchly pro-prosecutorial biases. This one is in the bag, so to speak.

    “There are so many uncertainties that, in total, it's hard to imagine this process being completed cleanly. Something big is going to go wrong. Either:

    1) The US justice system will look bad (remember, lies propagate easily in the middle east — e.g. the killing of al Dura, the Sadr bullets hoax, the Jenin massacre, etc., etc. — so the thing that makes us look bad doesn't have to actually happen. It only needs to work as a story-line.)”

    Lies (and truths) are going to circulate in the Middle East anyway: that's not a good reason to circumvent the rule of law. NOTHING that can happen at these “trials” could possibly damage the image of the US justice system more than the near decade of torture, rendition, indefinite detention and secret military kangaroo courts already have. We have absolutely NOTHING to lose in these cases, and a lot to potentially be gained (which, of course, is why Obama decided to go ahead with this).

    “2) There will be a significant security breach (a la Jack Ruby or something even larger).”

    That's not going to happen again, either. You can count on security being absolutely air tight for this one, and al Qaeda simply lacks the capability to take on “hard” targets.

    “3) A judges ruling will go horribly bad (in the trial or on appeal — lots of chances for that).”

    Not going to happen in Federal court. There are no Lance Ito's to fuck things up at that level.

    “4) A juror will insist on acquittal.”

    And? At that point, you have a hung jury, and we just play the game until we find 12 Americans willing to convict the 9/11 operational planner, which – trust me – ain't gonna be too goddamn hard.

    “5) The trail set-up and/or the change of venue will lead to a series of protests that'll make the tea-parties look like a love-in.”

    And? Again, avoiding controversy and unpleasantness isn't sufficient justification for suspending the rule of law.

  • Pythagoras

    First of all, let me apologize for an approximate double post. I got a server time out message and had to start over from scratch. Now I see that the “lost” post wasn't lost after all. C'est la vie.

    Some of this we'll just have to agree to disagree on and just wait and see. One of us is right and one of us isn't. I hope and pray you are right and I am wrong. Actually, I think there's about (wild guess) an 80% chance that you are right. But 20% is way too high for what my being right might entail.

    But our biggest disagreement is over point 1. The lies are more common if they simply have more material to work with. Also, if you think we had almost a decade of torture and secret military kangaroo courts, then lies must propagate pretty good in the west too. I collected on a bet (for one soda) with a colleague over whether half of the detainees at Gitmo would be executed. When over half had been released, he had to pay up. He had the “decade of torture” point of view.

  • ScotchIndian

    David, what do you really think about this decision? :) Don't sugar coat it.

    In our local paper, a gang banger who shot a non-ganger 5 times, was seen be witnesses, was convicted and sentenced to 25 years to life was just reversed on appeal. Apparently one of the witnesses (one of several) lived in the neighborhood and was able to testify without publicizing their identity. For this reason, the killer was released.

    Coming to a neighborhood near you –

  • martha

    You seem to be a little too preoccupied with every other man's penis size. What's up with that?
    By the way, I'm a woman so that 3rd grade slur wo'nt work with me.
    I think it's the size of your dick that bothers you “little boy”

  • KingofNorway

    Pretty oblivious of you, criticizing another for having personal issues when you choose a user name like that. Real classy. BTW, in case you missed it, Giuliani is no longer mayor of NYC. An operational intellect does rely on timely information. War for Oil! Cheney Rocks! GWB is the man! You've been preempted meathead.

  • KingofNorway

    Just as suspected, clark81: raging lunactic residing in his own echo chamber. Thanks for strapping on the straight jacket Pythgoras.

  • KingofNorway

    I think you've been sufficiently thrashed by most everyone in this thread so I'll leave well enough alone other than to say the hysterics and the misrepresentations and toddler tongue indict you. May an Islamofascist fluff your pillow.

  • clark81

    LULZ! King of Norway registered a new name to defend the honor of his almost inconceivably tiny penis!

  • Mjamme

    Please! What a stupid post! Obama wants peace, and peace start with in! Get real!

  • martha

    I'm with you. I came to the same conclusion 6 months ago, that if the Republicans put Daffy Duck up for President in 2012. Daffy would get my vote.

  • martha

    Honey, is the Kool-aid Grape or Chery flavored today?
    Really! That's not even an opinion.

  • clark81

    “Some of this we'll just have to agree to disagree on and just wait and see. One of us is right and one of us isn't. I hope and pray you are right and I am wrong. Actually, I think there's about (wild guess) an 80% chance that you are right. But 20% is way too high for what my being right might entail.”

    I'd say that it's more in the realm of 98% and 2%, and chalk the risk up as simply the cost of democracy. Ultimately, that is the nature of the beast: the price of living in a free society is that you surrender some degree of safety. If you believe security is more important than liberty, then perhaps you should consider living in a different, less free society.

    “But our biggest disagreement is over point 1. The lies are more common if they simply have more material to work with. Also, if you think we had almost a decade of torture and secret military kangaroo courts, then lies must propagate pretty good in the west too. I collected on a bet (for one soda) with a colleague over whether half of the detainees at Gitmo would be executed. When over half had been released, he had to pay up. He had the “decade of torture” point of view.”

    This is ludicrous. It is a FACT that we used techniques that would be classified as “torture” if used against, say, American military personnel against detainees, including, it should be pointed out, Khalid Sheikh Mohammed (the fact that we are proceeding with a criminal trial against a man whom we tortured is sickening enough). It is a FACT that we delivered detainees into the temporary custody of nations who use torture techniques so brutal that even our own CIA interrogators wouldn't use them. It is a FACT that we have kept many detainees in custody for years without any charges and, in fact, without a shred of evidence against them (which is why so many of them finally ended up being released once the Courts forced the issue, a fact you conveniently ignore). These aren't “lies,” these are realities that the last two Presidential administrations willfully and knowingly created. Sorry, pal, but we've got no one to blame but ourselves for the terrible press our judicial system has gotten over the last 8 years.

  • martha

    I'm not him.
    Again, what is with your obsession with other men's dicks?
    That closet getting stuffy Junior?

  • martha

    Thanks,
    Glad I could help-he was getting really tiresome with that nonsense.

  • clark81

    Riiight. I mean, you just share an IP address and a room temperature IQ. Nothing to see here. Drive on by.

  • martha

    Still doing the 3rd grade insults. Do you have anything of any substance to say?
    I was in NY on 9/11. Walked home to the Bronx with an 80 year old woman and a girl who's fiance was on the 102nd floor of Tower 2. She had just come into town for the final fitting of her wedding dress.
    What were you doing sweetheart?
    I would like to see KSM gutted and have hot bacon fat poured into the wound.
    And you need to take off the High Heels, they are obviously cutting off the circulation to you “brain”

  • angelofdeath

    Hey, Clark81 — you said:

    “Except that any evidence that exposes “sources and methods” will almost certainly be barred from defense discovery under the state secrets act. You're a moron.”

    Ignoring (for now) your need to resort to ad hominem attacks (e.g., “You're a moron”) — which, of course, is no shocker, since you & your ilk (leftists) always do, when you begin to see that you're losing arguments which are based on facts and logic — you've conveniently ignored the statement (of FACT) which immediately followed the statement that you sought to mock, and which contradicts your contention; specifically:

    “The 1993 civilian trial of the blind sheik revealed that we were tapping Osama's satellite phone. He immediately stopped using it.”

    So, I guess the “State Secrets Act” didn't quite work the way you're claiming it works, in that case — but, no biggie — after all, it was SO VERY RUDE of us, to be tapping Osama's phone in the first place — wasn't it? How horrible of us to do that, without first getting his permission to do so! We are SUCH barbarians!

    Like I said in a separate articles' Comments section the other day, in response to another terrorist-lover: I'm just glad that the country is starting to awaken to the fact that people like you do not sincerely desire to preserve or improve our country, traditions, and to protect our legitimate hard-working citizens (and yes, that latter category WOULD include white males, much to your protests and chagrin!) and therefore, your pretending to “uphold the Constitution” is disingenuous (at best). Rather, your only goal is to destroy this society, which you so detest, and your S.O.P. is to employ misinformation, disinformation, outright lies, deceit, and other forms of propaganda to achieve your goals (a la Saul Alinsky's “Rules for Radicals” — for those who are unfamiliar with this radical author and his text, get it, and read it: it will open your eyes as nothing else will! and remember, IT IS THEIR BIBLE! No matter WHAT they tell us to the contrary). Consequently, more and more decent citizens are coming to realize, daily, that to attempt to debate with you in sincerity is to slit our own throats effectively, since nothing you say or promise or agree to is done with anything even close to what we would call “good faith” — yup — you'll lie in a heartbeat, with a perfectly straight face and an abundance of theatrical crocodile tears, while you're planning all along to achieve your socialist utopia — at OUR expense and loss. The only thing left is to start hanging you folks from the nearest trees (after a quick, spontaneous trial, of course — what a wonderful, old-fashioned pastoral setting! nothing quite like getting “back to basics,” huh?) BEFORE we stupidly give you a chance to do likewise to us. Thankfully, the sun is now setting on the days (well, decades, actually) of moronic, suicidal political correctness. Test the branches, and order the rope! Praise the Lord, and pass the ammunition! We're gonna have a party! EVERYONE'S invited!!

  • clark81

    So, you've stopped pretending that you're not actually the King of Norgay? Good for you. You still have a room temperature IQ and a cock the size of a grain of rice, Jewboy.

  • montanalady

    Go to impeachobama.org and sign the poll

  • JungleCogs

    Obama wants to force his Marxist ideals on this free country, period. Keep pushing Obama; pretty soon you be tried for high treason!

  • martha

    Wrong-It's Jewgirl.
    Nice to see you're showing your real self sister.
    Again this preoccupation with the size of other man's dicks.
    I think the sister doth protest too much!
    BTW you never did answer my question of what you were doing on 9/11. My guess is raiding your mother's make up bag.

  • montanalady

    I think the way this is going to play out in the middle East is atrocious. These people are barbarians and only look for reasons to hate more. We are playing right into their hands with this fiasco. I see nothing but harm coming from it and hope all of you who want to baby these terrorists know ,any one who dies because of it you have their blood on your hands.

  • clark81

    “So, I guess the “State Secrets Act” didn't quite work the way you're claiming it works, in that case — but, no biggie — after all, it was SO VERY RUDE of us, to be tapping Osama's phone in the first place — wasn't it?”

    If you actually possessed the industry and intelligence to follow the discussion at hand, you'd know that the ability of the government to claim national security privilege has been vastly expanded since the trial of Omar Abdel-Rahman (and particularly in the immediate aftermath of 9/11), but you've named yourself after Slayer's most overplayed song, so I suppose that was a bit much to ask of you.

    By the way, have you ever heard of paragraph breaks? Formatting is your friend, motherfucker.

  • Mjamme

    Sorry Martha! Drinking French Champagne tonight! :-) and I have an opinion.
    The guy wants peace, why people always see the worst on this him!? He is trying his best to take us out of war and hate. We are hated outside the US, for once people are starting to listen to us. He is being diplomatic but firm. Again the world needs a peace! Cheers!

  • martha

    Back it up with some evidence honey, because I've learned that when dealing with Obama, do'nt listento what he says-watch what he does. And I haven't seen anything good coming from this guy.
    I did not vote for him because I could see what a lying sack of shi* he was.
    Enjoy the Kool-Aid
    Stay well.

  • Mjamme

    The Evidence is everywhere, shame you cannot see it. If you have lived in and out the USA for years with an American Passport in your hand, traveling between Abu Dabi and Saudi you will understand what I mean. You not trusting him is irrelevant to this friendly conversation we are having ! I am judging him based on what he has done so far! He has not lied, why would he do that!? He is a Human being after all! He is sorting out the Mess he has found on his Desk. This will not make him popular, but at least he is trying Martha!
    People should be judged on their actions! He is acting on what he thinks is Best for our Country! PEACE! Would you come to the World Peace Festival in Berlin in August 2010, that will open your eyes, big time!

    Cheers!

  • martha

    Honey, I got 2 jobs so no, traveling to Berlin is not on my agenda next year,
    And I am a 2nd generation American Brooklyn born, Bronx raised. More than I can say for our Communist in Chief.
    I am watching, and what I see is an appeaser in the best tradition of Neville Chamberlin, and frankly me and a lot of other passport holding Americans are getting real close to our Maginot line, however you have no idea what I'm talking about do you?
    I graduated school in 1974, before the great Liberal Indoctination took place so yes I do think for myself.
    You however just go on enjoying your dreams and fantasies, and sing a verse of Kumbaya for me while you're at it.
    Take care

  • Mjamme

    Ah I see, I was just born in 1974! So yes I have no idea about what you are talking about! :-)
    Fair point!

    Take it easy!

  • mamapajamas

    I have yet to see anything about what former Mayor Giuliani said about this trial…

    The simple fact is that the AG Holder has already stated, ahead of the trial, that even if these men are found “not guilty”, they are NOT going to be released. They will continue to be held on other charges, and tried for those in time.

    And he thereby just HANDED the Defense team REASON for a mistrial… even if found babe-pure innocent, the men are going to continue to be held. They aren't going to be released.

    That makes a NYC civilian trial a kangaroo court, with the Entire World Watching.

    And everyone will know it because Holder has already SAID it is.

  • martha

    Google Neville Chamberlin and google the Maginot line,
    I'm sorry you're education was so shabby, you can however fix that.
    Stay well

  • BS77

    another liberalista hiding behind intellectual arguements….military tribunals are the best venue for trying terrorists….WE ARE AT WAR, but you liberals call it a “foreign contingency” or a “criminal problem”….we have been attacked….our soldiers have been killed by the thousands…but you don't think it's a war. Military tribunals are not banana republic kangaroo courts….they will prosecute these vermin with great deliberation…..what you don't like is that the ACLU does not approve.

  • Lary9

    I am appalled by all the hue and cry against the 9/11 conspirators at Gitmo being tried as civilian criminals in NYC and not in a military court. Did I.Q.s just drop overnight? This atrocious act against humanity was a war crime in their eyes but not a war crime in mine. [And I've read all the books by Gabriel and Spencer and Phares]. Aside from the obvious like rejecting legal precedent and the rule of law, the worst thing we can do is co-sign their jihadist status by associating their crimes with a military trial. We should resolutely avoid anything that legitimates their Islamist world view by treating them as soldiers of any kind. This would greatly please al Qaeda’s minions worldwide. We must try them in criminal court by U.S. District Attorneys. They are murderers, not clandestine partisans. [Does anybody remember George W. Bush? He proposed the EXACT same process in a June 6, 2006 speech…bringing the detainees over and trying them in federal court!]

  • Lary9

    PS:
    Jumpin' Judas! Republicans are such a bunch of thick lumps! They have a chance to get on the right side of history and support the smartest, most well-prepared president we’ve had (by pure luck, I venture) in decades. But instead of praising this president’s nuanced judgment, his warm, genuine personality and energetic ‘can-do’ style (not to mention what he represents to history-at-large), they’re finding every little thing they can to criticize him. What a bunch of crabby old ladies you guys are on the other side of the Congressional aisle…especially when it's your turn to ride the bench! For shame!

  • bushlikesdick12

    Do we turn everyone into an enemy combatant who commits an act or terrorism or just the ones who are not Christian or Jewish?

    By these standards, Timothy McVeigh should have been waterboarded and held indefiently at Gitmo and therefore denying the victims families closure through the his death penalty.

  • bushlikesdick12

    Regarding Bush's proposal to try them in a Federal Court, I believe Cheney's broad influence within his party and conservative constituents made him probably the most powerfull VP ever.

    There are a lot of things George W. and Cheney didn't meet eye to eye on and it should be obvious to you that George W. isn't the sharpest tool in the shed which leads me to believe that he would not have ever been elected president if it wasn't for the massive force behind him to make him the first real puppett President in U.S. history.

    By legitimizing torture and Gitmo, These Cheney constituents can point the finger at anyone in the world and accuse them of being a terrorist, torture them and hold them indefinietly that doesn''t meet them eye to eye in regards to their colonial ambitions.

    Though history, this tactic is nothing new.

    For example:
    The British did it to the Chinese when they took Hong Kong from them and started the Opium Wars.

    Has less to do with not making Jihadist more legitimate and more to do with securing more influence.

  • bushlikesdick12

    You got two jobs?

    My trailer trash x-wife use to go around telling everyone she had four full time jobs. One was her part time waitress job, another was cleaning our 2 bedroom apartment, and finally the other was caring for our only child.( she doesn't know basis math either — that would only be three fulltime jobs).

    Don't take it wrong because I believe you are at least one step above her — she could only tell you what time the liquor store closes.

    At least you graduated high school.

  • Pythagoras

    If I was a US soldier and I was captured by the likes of KSM's buddies, I'd play Braer Rabbit and say, “Please, please don't waterboard me!” If got lucky (miraculously lucky) they would “torture” me the way we “torture” them. More likely, they would torture me the way torture is depicted in a typical torture museum.

    That would be real torture — instead of the stuff the bed-wetters on the left call torture.

  • angelofdeath

    No, the formatting is fine — just perfect; and the grammar is correct, as well (not that you would know, one way or the other, anyway).

    As for paragraph breaks, first: Cf.: the above; second: no, I don't compensate for those with challenged attention spans; if the grammar is correct, then the idiot reader (you) should be able to follow, without the crutch of paragraph breaks (oh, I forgot — you're a socialist, so you support the use of crutches of ALL kinds — too used to big government handing everything to you without you needing to do any work for it, eh? Too bad, scumbag: force yourself to follow a LOGICAL train of thought — for once. Oh hell, it don't matter: you'll be hangin' like a rotten fruit from a tree soon enough, anyway — keep lookin' over ya shoulda, Comrade: it's healthy for ya!!

    XOXO

  • KingofNorway

    Rudy Giuliani strongly objects to the decision to bring KSM and the boys to NYC. He says it puts New Yorkers at greater risk and serves notice to Islamic terrorists we still don't get it. Apparently Obama could care less what most Americans think about all this. Apparently he is more interested in posing the prince of political correctness and capitulating to his brother Muslims. Sober individuals know military tribunals for Islamic terrorists are entirely appropriate and effective and their usage hardly portents destruction of our entire justice system and certain hysterics would have it. However, sponsoring months of televised proceedings will most certainly give these madmen a platform to wage propaganda jihad. Given the predisposition of world opinion goaded by media to think the worst of the USA, the madmen will have a light year's headstart, and then, there is the problem of security, intelligence, our people in the field, and the fight ahead. From any angle this decision is self-serving, and stupid, and Obama 'the all knowing' has yet to realize he will pay an enormous price politically for forcing this along this path.

  • KingofNorway

    There's a sucker born every minute.

  • coyote3

    As we say, “boolsheet”. Partisans and “enemy combatants” are “not” given any leeway. The rules purposely don't even apply to them. There is a reason for that. The military, any military, is not supposed to “target” civilians. If you allow fighters without uniforms, whether they are in the military or not, and give them protections, then you are putting the otherwise innocent civillians at risk. The military will not be able to diferentiate and justifiably target the civilian population, because they can no longer assume that the civilian population is not trying to kill them.

  • bushlikesdick12

    Mjamme,

    The first mistake you made was posting a picture of what appears to be a black woman with your screen name. That gives people like martha the reason to construe or miscontrue that you are someone other than white.

    That is why she calls you “honey” and refers you to singing “Kumbaya”

    The despise martha has towards Obama is not only his race and roots but the justice he stands for towards humanity as a whole.

    I don't understand why you can not see the bigotry in the FPM articles and the flies (maggots) that these articles attract?

    Don't you realize that you and I are sitting in a heap of shit by visiting this shithole?

  • coyote3

    Military trials occurr all the time, and the defense lawyers are most often military officers. In fact, those trials, for major crimes, don't have a real good conviction rate in recent history, e.g. the Marines and Soldiers tried and found not guilty for crimes they were accused of in Iraq. There is no evidence that military defense lawyers would not aggressively defend their accused. The fact is we do not have criminals in these cases. We have people who could have been legally summarily executed. We have done it in the past.

  • KingofNorway

    Weird how he thinks you are me, and I am thee. Where did he/she get that idea? Poor clark81. Must be static in the cortex.

  • coyote3

    You must not have tried many federal trials. Federal judges make procedural errors all the time. As for security, there is no security that can protect someone, if someone “really” wants to get them. I am not knocking the security apparatus, it is just a fact.

    The biggest risk is that we have to realize we are not dealing with “people” who are wired like we are. If they do something that may seem stupid to us, it could put a whole city at risk.

  • KingofNorway

    Here's a clue. Didn't have to dig real hard.

    Google: ISLAM-What the West Needs to Know 99 min. scholarly documentary.

    PS: the only ones calling for violence are jihadis. Can anybody say 'authoritative Islam'?

    “…ethnic axe to grind…” ? What a toon.

    I'm immune to stupid and therefore immune to you.

  • coyote3

    More “boolsheet” no one is going to come together against us, because no one would care. You think WWII was fought because of the Jews? We cared less about that issue. That is just a fact, and our conduct of the war proved it.

  • bushlikesdick12

    Here are 9 good things coming from “this guy”:

    1. cleared an important hurdle in the health care reform debate when it appropriated $19 billion in the stimulus package to help implement an electronic medical record system. The money is paltry compared to the hundreds of billions set aside for an overhaul of the health care system in the budget. But officials inside and out of the White House say its significance is hard to overstate.

    A presidential campaign built on innovative messaging and advanced technology has, naturally, become a White House defined by similar characteristics. As such, the reach of the administration's new media efforts – from hosting online question-and-answer sessions with the president to publishing the first White House blog – has been as expected as appreciated. It's unfortunate, said one tech savvy Democrat, because the new policies have had tangible impacts. “The White House streams every event with the president on its website, even press events,” he said. “It's remarkable because, this Sunday they held a swine flu press conference that ordinary people [including many who may have been personally nervous about the topic] were able to watch online… Before you had to wait for a readout or hope that CSPAN would cover it.

    3. Transportation: Since the passage of the economic stimulus package in mid-February, the Obama Department of Transportation has approved 2,500 highway projects. The movement of stimulus money out the door has been as swift as it has been effective: $9.3 billion has been spent in all 50 states. Touting its impact, DOT officials say 260,000 jobs are expected from this investment. And with competition for contracts fierce, the department is set to approve even more projects than previously envisioned. “There will be more money for additional transportation projects,” said the official.

    4. Education: Maligned for its handling of the financial and banking crises, the Obama Treasury Department has nevertheless implemented policies with real qualitative and quantitative impact on debt-burdened families. Chief among those was a $2,500 tax credit to help offset the cost of tuition (among other expenses) for those seeking a college education. Nearly five million families are expected to save $9 billion, according to Treasury officials.

    5. Cars: The automobile industry at the White House and Congress's behest has undergone seismic structural changes, managerial reorganization, and massive cuts in employment. But for all the tough love, the president has put in place the framework for an industry recovery. Perhaps the most significant of steps was to allocate $2 billion in stimulus cash for advanced batteries systems. One high-ranking Hill aide called battery technology “the next big frontier” in the automotive world, adding that if the U.S. could dominate this market it would reclaim its perch as the world's premier car manufacturer.

    6. Pakistan: Cognizant of a destabilizing situation in Pakistan, the administration's diplomatic team, with a major assist from Japan, secured $5 billion in aid commitments “to bolster the country's economy and help it fight terror and Islamic radicalism” within the country. The money, as Pakistan observers — notably Senate Foreign Relations Chairman John Kerry – note, will prove instrumental in bringing the nation away from the brink of failure and increased Taliban control.

    7. Cities: More than any prior president, Obama has put a spotlight on America's struggling cities, even creating an office of Urban Policy in the White House. It is the Justice Department, however, that lays claim to one of the most consequential of urban affairs achievements. Through the Recovery Act, DOJ secured $2 billion for Byrne Grants, which funds anti-gang and anti-gun task forces. The money, cut during the Bush years, is expected to have massive ramifications on inner-city crime and violence.

    8. Engaging the Muslim World: While certainly discussed, foreign affairs experts insist that Obama's engagement with the Muslim world has been at once remarkable and under-appreciated. From the first interview with Al Arabiya to his Nowruz address to the Iranian people, to his proclamation that “American is not at war with Islam” during an appearance in Turkey, seasoned observers have been routinely impressed. “Through these [statements and interviews],” said one Democratic foreign policy hand, “He has been able to dramatically change America's image in that region.”

    9. Forests: Since taking office, the White House has put under federal protection more than two million acres of wilderness, thousands of miles of river and a host of national trails and parks. The conservation effort – the largest in the last 15 years – came with the stroke of a pen when Obama signed the Omnibus Public Land Management Act of 2009 in late March.

  • bushlikesdick12

    Here is a list of all the good things that George W. has accomplished in his eight years:

  • bushlikesdick12

    Rudy Giuliani needs to spend more time thinking about his personal issues such as his next divorce and his thugs that run his city and spend less time speaking about matters that are above his intellect.

  • KingofNorway

    For all of you who still think Islamic terrorism is a law enforcement issue:

    Google: ISLAM-What the West Needs to Know 99 min. scholarly documentary

    Suitable for viewing even at the White House.

  • martha

    I have no idea what's going on in that little pea-brain of his other to think his meds are wearing off and it's time for his bedtime dose.
    This whole preoccupation he has with male endowments jumped out out me more than his liberal blathering. Oh and his anti-semitism too.
    I think he's just a needy child looking for attention.
    Watch-he'll think we're one person talking to himself/herself.
    Take care

  • martha

    I work for a company that has their main office in England. Couple of years ago, my contact over there quit and moved to Australia because he was fed up with the way the Muslims were overrunning the U.K.
    His replacement also left the U.K. to move to Spain.
    These were 2 native born Brits. Could'nt take it anymore.
    They had sent a girl over here in NY to work with us for a while, and she was really indoctrinated in the whole PC speech idea. I would look at her in shock.
    It's going to happen here if we do'nt start opening up our mouths and forget this PC crap.
    When I speak to a Lib and they want to start with that PC crap, I tell them, “I do'nt do Political Correctness” and just continue with what I was saying as if they never spoke. It usually shuts them up. If we put up with it, then we are part of the problem, not the solution.
    We should not be intimidated so easily.

  • bushlikesdick12

    re:

    “The real agenda here is this: To put the CIA and the US military on trial, to dissect the Bush security and intelligence services…..”

    It has been the Democrats political agenda for a very long time just as it has been the agenda of the likes of FOX to undermine the Democrats agenda.

    The only problem here is that Bush's agenda isn't in-line with America's agenda — that is why we kicked all your bums out of office.

  • KingofNorway

    Axiomatic: those yelling the loudest about prejudice are frequently the most prejudicial.

    Anti-Semite for sure, by his own demonstration, but no doubt he'll try to pass it off as irony or satire or some such, gazing, awestruck, upon his own countenance, oblivious to the giggles from the audience.

    God bless you Martha.

  • bushlikesdick12

    So how does your “boolshit”apply with the interpretation of creating a militia in the constitution?

    Ordinary citizens wore ordinary clothes and behaved like ordinary citizens in the open and the British couldn't distinguish an enemy combatant “(Patriot) from an innocent civilian.

    Our own constitution allows us to organize as militants and disband into ordinary citizens as we choose in order to combat the enemy (which sometimes can be within our own government as a hostile takeover such as the British).

    Ah but you want to change the rules here for everyone else and therefore jeapordizing my childrens future and the right to defend themselves against a hostile takeover of my country?

    screw you coyote3

  • bushlikesdick12

    wow something we can agree on

  • KingofNorway

    Amen. I've made it a personal mission to confront these PC liberal progressive meatheads at every turn. You quickly find they are made of paper and their hair catches fire quickly. Dish out just a little of their own medicine and they run crying for mommy or go ballistic. The depth of their understanding is so shallow, refuting them is like shooting fish in a barrel. I have to admit I love driving them up the wall. And the crazy part is, they rarely get it, for all their so-called superior intelligence. You'd think they'd realize they're being played but they rarely get it. Instead they go from one meltdown to the next. It's like being a cat with a mouse.

  • bushlikesdick12

    From what I have read from Clark 81, minus the mutual participation of hurling insults, he is merely challenging the position of the article.

    Apparantly, from my perspective, it is the likes of your constituents that start resorting to insults when you should be defending Horowitz slanted B.S.

  • bushlikesdick12

    I don't see my mommy anywhere so here I am f*cker — come and get it.

    I promise not to go ballistic while I'm doing you.

  • coyote3

    No, didn't say that. I said what the rules of engagement say. I didn't
    write them. As far as what the colonists did, while we didn't have the
    current rules of engagement, they were subject to “no” rules regarding their
    treatment, and were often executed summarily. I don't see any contradiction
    or change in anything. The British, although I consider them our oldest
    enemy, were obeying the law at the time.

  • bushlikesdick12

    And Putin isn't in office anymore either — who's the meathead here?

    You really think that wap has no power?

    My whole f*cking family is Italian and you don't think I don't know how they controll matters?

    KingofNorway explains alot — kinda like king of the kindergarten playground.

    You better stay in your little fenced area boy!

  • WFB2

    “…these terrorists receive a trial with all the rights afforded to citizens by our constitution, but those citizens who serve don't receive those rights? Come on people…wake up—I fear it's already too late.”
    ***
    You're right, it's already too late. It became too late when the Marxoid Dem's declared the Constitution “a living, breathing document.” Pure Postmodernist BS which means the Constitution means whatever the Loony Left says it means on a case-by-case basis. Completely elastic and consequently worthless. The election of Obama was a coup d' etat.

  • martha

    And you too.
    Most Liberals are Anti-Semetic.
    Have you read Jamie Glasov's book? He lays out an entire theory ast o why. Good book, I recommend it if you have not read it.
    Be well, and pray we make it until 2010 so we can at least neautralize the Great Pretender

  • keithrage

    Will there be a muslim on the jury??

  • martha

    I was standing in a crowd in Midtown once and we were waiting for Obama's motorcade to go by and a couple of college-age leftists were trying to protest who only knows what and they were shouted down by a crowd of middle-aged WORKING people-they just slithered away like the cockroaches they all are.

  • bushlikesdick12

    I don't understand?

    What is the matter with my screen name?

    You don't think George W. likes Dick Cheney?

    You don't suppose George really doesn't like Cheney and he had to pick him as VP so that Cheney's people can keep close tabs on George W. do you?

    Wow, that could explain why we really went into Iraq — to finish what George Sr. couldn't finish but would have if the international community would have agreed to.

    I'm trying to find your logic here.

    Oh wait a minute. I have been told there are perverts here that have found some other meaning in my screen name .

    Are you saying you are some sort of pervert?

    exactly what are you implying?

  • Lary9

    Seen it a dozen times and finally bought it from Amazon. It's the best thoughtful survey ever of Islamic ulterior motives over the last 1400 years.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Bobbi-Bennett/100000186261420 Bobbi Bennett

    I agree wholeheartedly with Congressman King. However, what no one seems to be considering in this is that putting terrorists on trial in US courts and/or holding therm on U.S. soil may be in itself a violation of Geneva protections for enemy combatants. They did not commit criminal acts as defined by civilian courts. War is an issue separate from civilian law, otherwise our soldiers, too, would be liable for civilian prosecution by civilian standards of legality. Like POWs, enemy combatants are held for the duration of the conflict and are not prosecuted for actions taken during war-time, provided they followed the internationally recognized and agreed upon laws of war. They are afforded under the Geneva conventions certain rights during imprisonment not granted to civilian criminals, and are denied others that would likely further their ability to wage war against the country holding them. There is no doubt that in specifically and purposefully targeting civilians and other non-combatants, terrorists commited war crimes. They should be tried for these by military tribunals according to the laws of warfare. (And hung in my opinion.)

    However, and perhaps more importantly, no one seems to be considering the precedents that would be set by trying war-time enemy combatants in US civilian courts. In order to prosecute these acts of war as if they were civilian crimes certain rights citizens of the US are guaranteed would need to be denied, such as Miranda warnings and rules of evidence. Once the precedent is set of denying rights to one defendant in one case, we can't un-ring the bell. Obama, and others, at one point suggested we set up a two-tiered system of justice to handle “terrorists”. There is grave danger in this for citizens since once a second tier is set up, what's to stop the federal government from determining that certain crimes committed by certain citizens deserve referral to the second tier? In addition, as I understand it, only some terrorists will be tried in civilian courts – those that the government feels it can prosecute successfully. Others will be tried by military tribunal. Not only does this fly in the face of all notions of equal treatment under the law, it sets the precedent that the government can capriciously choose the court that suits the strength of their case in order to achieve a pre-ordained result. I smell tyranny in the air.

  • WFB2

    “Why can't leftists in this country understand that as they do so much to help our enemy……at our peril???”
    ***
    Because leftists hate this country. They hate the two C's: Capitalism and Christianity. Our country's enemies are their allies. Google Antonio Gramsci and also The Frankfurt School and get up to speed politically.

  • akreynin

    Judeofascist? You are an antisemite, huh?

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Bobbi-Bennett/100000186261420 Bobbi Bennett

    Calm down One Way. Obama is merely a product of a university education in the US, he is a fool, a useful idiot to the left, not the anti-christ. He is a political operative advocating a political agenda that is the antithesis of what America stands for. He can be, and should be defeated by political means, not by force of arms. This can and will be done if we keep our heads and organize around core principles.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Bobbi-Bennett/100000186261420 Bobbi Bennett

    He also distracts us from what he's doing elsewhere to undermine our economy and liberties.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Bobbi-Bennett/100000186261420 Bobbi Bennett

    Thank you for your service. My son is over there too, for the third time. More of us stuck here in Obamaland support you and your mission than you know. I for one will keep fighting over here so you have an America to come home to. God Bless you.

  • Ruckweiler

    DaphneeLee:
    When your ilk is at the point of an al-Queda gun, it will be interesting to
    see your response. Islam has been at war with itself and the world since
    its inception. Your lot keeps wondering what we've done wrong instead of
    caring one wit for the fact that Islam means the subjugation of the world
    under their barbaric domination. So tell me, how do you
    negotiate/compromise with an ideology that says submit to me or die?
    Unreality is a liberal trait and you've got it bad.
    Richard Baker

  • Rob_W

    Oh – and one more thing:

    In order to be tried by a jury of their peers – which the defense attorneys will no doubt insist upon – there WILL be Muslims selected.

    This farcical stacking of the jury in the name of “diversity” will result in a hung jury – endless appeals – and a guaranteed circus atmosphere all for a war-crime that should never have wound up in the courts in the first place.

    All brought to you by the awesomely deep wisdom of his highness Barak Obama – who just doesn't get it that the nation has been TRAUMATIZED ENOUGH over the past 18 months with job losses – home foreclosures and a permanently reduced standard of living for decades to come.

    This guy sure doesn't know how to take the temperature of the patient – does he?

    All this just to show the world – not Americans – but foreigners that we are really the ones who should be somehow REPENTANT over 9-11 and that we have learned our lesson.

    RobW

  • BS77

    Toxic Kool Aid from the liberal left………spend a billion, spend a trillion, wheeeeeee! Who cares??….more Kool Aid please!!! Lose your home, lose your job, fifty more dead in Afghanistan, fifty more dead in Iraq….just let it keep going and going….spend another trillion…OH 22 million out of work? Have some more Kool Aid!!!! That you Mjamme? Call it peace, call it hope and change, you doofus.

  • jackhampton

    Clark 81You are no longer worthy of further comment you are a nasty mouthed punk. The military will give them just as fair of a trial as they would receive in civilian court with out releaseing secret information to the enemy. You do not have a clue about military trials if given the choice I would take it any day over a civilian criminal court. But as stated above you are a nasty mouthed punk no longer worthy of response.

  • KingofNorway

    Dick,

    You don't understand? Well, keep working on it. I'm sure with time and effort you'll come around.

  • KingofNorway

    Very enlightening eh Lary9? Fox ought to air it numerous times. CBS and the rest but they'd never touch it. Truth tends to burn their hands.

  • KingofNorway

    Too late. You've already lost. Here is your cone and your stool. There is the corner.

  • robolungfish

    We can't admit it, because it isn't. Even if war was officially declared, it would be legal insanity to backdate that declaration to conveniently cover these people. I don't care if it's inconvenient and it's conceivable that one of these people won't face execution or more than 10 consecutive life sentences – I'd rather the law be followed. I'm pretty damn sure they'll get the chair anyway: this isn't OJ. Worst case scenario, someone goes Jack Ruby on them.

  • robolungfish

    Bah, Christopher Hitchens is certainly not left and surely not a bed wetter, and only started to call it torture after he was dared to be water-boarded himself. Unlike Hannity, he actually went through it: he lasted 10 seconds and says he the experience gave him nightmares. Simulated drowning may not be as painful as bamboo-shoots under the nails, but by all accounts it's more terrifying and was a torture method cited when the Japanese were being tried for war crimes after WWII. However, that's straying off topic.

  • Robert Bernier

    Every American should know the truth

    No one should miss this video:

    http://xrl.us/bf29mb

    Look to the end ( 10 min.)

  • robolungfish

    I don't understand how someone on the right can bemoan someone on the left for complaining about our governments misdeeds and then go right on to mirror the sentiment of Strom Thurmond (“government should be small enough that it can be dragged into the bathroom and drowned in the sink”) and complain about how much power the president has. I don't get how someone can keep a straight face while accusing the left of being “America Haters” and then suggest that it might be time for a revolution.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/brian_h7694 Brian H

      a) The Administration (especially bloated with 30 illegal commissars) IS the government, now.
      b) The revolution is against the Usurper, not against America. It's on behalf of America.

  • robolungfish

    Haloween is over, no need for the boogyman. The left doesn't want to destroy America any more than the right wants to (but with all the “time to water the tree of liberty” talk, I wonder). The left wants a return to rule of law, accountability, and oversight. As far as I can tell, the right wants a super-charged executive branch and a compliant legislative and judicial so we can more effectively wage permanent war.

    The “radical left” are anarchists that want to be left alone to grow pot in the woods and only rarely can get a law degree.
    The “radical right” want to replace our public school, prison, social security, and military systems with a network of private contractors.

    But back to the topic; Clark81 made a great response to the point of disclosure, that the laws have been changed since that case and that state secrets are now protected.

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1308914033 facebook-1308914033

    It is vitally important that the Obama Administration recognize the extent to which Islamists will take their cause to conquer the west and to Islamicize it. (If they are incapable of recognition or refusing to recognize this obvious fact, then those commentators and authors who write the best should pursue the cause of of hitting the Obama Administration over the head with well-chosen words.)
    As for me, I am tremendously opposed to trying terrorist/murderers in our civilian courts. It's not merely that they do not deserve the hoopla around the circus of their hatred, but that since they operated as guerillas – as in guerilla warfare – they should be tried by military tribunals. In actuality, they are lucky that Americans have so much respect for law, and that they would be tried at all.

  • jackhampton

    A military tribunal is not a kangaroo court. Swarthy men in beards as you put do violent murder every day and kill more and more you would be wise to fear these monsters that felled 3000 human beings in one attack. the congress approved this method of trial for these killers they have no place in a civilian court and the best legal mindsknow that. These killers where captured on forign battle fields no more reason to bring them here and put them on trial than there was to bring Goering here or any of the Nazis. We are setting our self up for more terror attacks the trubunal is the very place for these people despite the America hating ACLU.

  • jackhampton

    DaphneeLee
    You have never read history. The violence created on Japan created peace, the violence we created on Germany created peace. I went to serve an FFJ warrant on a multiple offender that had shot his wife. He shot my pardner, yes I spelled that correctly I shot and killed him there was peace. I got an eight day paid vacation. Sometimes there is no other choice but violence it is not something that you want to or wish to use but somtime there is simply no other choice. But retirement suits me well and I leave that for younger people that are now willing to step up and place them self in harms way so you can move forward with your fantasy world.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/brian_h7694 Brian H

      Here's what a Japanese village elder, who had been dragooned by the military into civilian service during the war, had to say to America for bombing Japan: http://www.estatevaults.com/bol/archives/2007/11/



      Yamagishi then told us about his life during the war. He had been drafted in 1944, at the age of forty, and sent to Osaka to guard the emperor’s forest. Then the Americans took Saipan and the B-29s came. “The Americans burned the forest with incendiary bombs, so it was not necessary to guard it any longer,” he said. “I became a firefighter. The Americans would drop incendiary bombs to set the city on fire, and when we went to fight the fires they would wait until we were very busy and then they would come over with other B-29s and drop antipersonnel bombs and kill the firemen. I thought, ‘The Americans are very clever.’ Then, after the whole city had been destroyed, a single B-29 flew over Osaka and dropped not bombs but hundreds of little parachutes. When these parachutes landed we saw that a gift was tied to each—a mirror, a harmonica, a fountain pen. The Japanese people had lost nearly everything in the bombing and they were very glad to have these gifts from the Americans. They ran to get them, and when they touched them they exploded in their hands, blowing off fingers and blinding people. I thought, ‘The Americans are not only clever; they are ruthless. We have lost the war.’”

      Yamagishi said, “Your ships came and shelled us. The bombers kept on also, every day. I was assigned to train people to fight the Americans when they invaded. We showed women and children how to make spears from bamboo. Every Japanese was prepared to die defending the homeland. Then the atom bombs were dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki. The emperor’s voice came over loudspeakers in the streets. He told us we must surrender. No one had ever heard his voice before, and to us it was the voice of God. But our commanding officer said, ‘No! We must kill the Americans! He is no true emperor if he tells the Japanese to surrender.’ Nevertheless we obeyed the emperor, and I came back to this village. All the younger sons of every family—all twenty families—had been killed in the war. Only old men and women were left to do the work. I thought we would starve to death. But as you see, we did not.

      “Now,” the old Japanese said, “I will tell you why I invited you here. It is because I have something to say to you, and to all Americans.” He was out of breath and his face was full of color from the whiskey he had drunk, and I thought, “Well, here it comes.”

      Yamagishi said, “Thank you. Thank you for defeating Japan. If you Americans had not done so, this village would be as it always was. The militarists would never have let us have democracy. But the Americans built the road; my nephews and nieces have cars and television sets, and they see their children every day. And because they have eaten American things like milk and vegetables and fruit, instead of the millet and pickles we had to eat, they are tall and beautiful like Americans instead of short and homely like me and my wife.” He bowed and said, “Thank you.” I realized, to my surprise, and in spite of everything I believed about the morality of bombing civilians, that the U.S. Air Force had won Yamagishi’s heart and mind by pitilessly destroying Osaka, Hiroshima and Nagasaki..

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/brian_h7694 Brian H

      Here's what a Japanese village elder, who had been dragooned by the military into civilian service during the war, had to say to America for bombing Japan: http://www.estatevaults.com/bol/archives/2007/11/



      Yamagishi then told us about his life during the war. He had been drafted in 1944, at the age of forty, and sent to Osaka to guard the emperor’s forest. Then the Americans took Saipan and the B-29s came. “The Americans burned the forest with incendiary bombs, so it was not necessary to guard it any longer,” he said. “I became a firefighter. The Americans would drop incendiary bombs to set the city on fire, and when we went to fight the fires they would wait until we were very busy and then they would come over with other B-29s and drop antipersonnel bombs and kill the firemen. I thought, ‘The Americans are very clever.’ Then, after the whole city had been destroyed, a single B-29 flew over Osaka and dropped not bombs but hundreds of little parachutes. When these parachutes landed we saw that a gift was tied to each—a mirror, a harmonica, a fountain pen. The Japanese people had lost nearly everything in the bombing and they were very glad to have these gifts from the Americans. They ran to get them, and when they touched them they exploded in their hands, blowing off fingers and blinding people. I thought, ‘The Americans are not only clever; they are ruthless. We have lost the war.’”

      Yamagishi said, “Your ships came and shelled us. The bombers kept on also, every day. I was assigned to train people to fight the Americans when they invaded. We showed women and children how to make spears from bamboo. Every Japanese was prepared to die defending the homeland. Then the atom bombs were dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki. The emperor’s voice came over loudspeakers in the streets. He told us we must surrender. No one had ever heard his voice before, and to us it was the voice of God. But our commanding officer said, ‘No! We must kill the Americans! He is no true emperor if he tells the Japanese to surrender.’ Nevertheless we obeyed the emperor, and I came back to this village. All the younger sons of every family—all twenty families—had been killed in the war. Only old men and women were left to do the work. I thought we would starve to death. But as you see, we did not.

      “Now,” the old Japanese said, “I will tell you why I invited you here. It is because I have something to say to you, and to all Americans.” He was out of breath and his face was full of color from the whiskey he had drunk, and I thought, “Well, here it comes.”

      Yamagishi said, “Thank you. Thank you for defeating Japan. If you Americans had not done so, this village would be as it always was. The militarists would never have let us have democracy. But the Americans built the road; my nephews and nieces have cars and television sets, and they see their children every day. And because they have eaten American things like milk and vegetables and fruit, instead of the millet and pickles we had to eat, they are tall and beautiful like Americans instead of short and homely like me and my wife.” He bowed and said, “Thank you.” I realized, to my surprise, and in spite of everything I believed about the morality of bombing civilians, that the U.S. Air Force had won Yamagishi’s heart and mind by pitilessly destroying Osaka, Hiroshima and Nagasaki..

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/brian_h7694 Brian H

      Here's what a Japanese village elder, who had been dragooned by the military into civilian service during the war, had to say to America for bombing Japan: http://www.estatevaults.com/bol/archives/2007/11/



      Yamagishi then told us about his life during the war. He had been drafted in 1944, at the age of forty, and sent to Osaka to guard the emperor’s forest. Then the Americans took Saipan and the B-29s came. “The Americans burned the forest with incendiary bombs, so it was not necessary to guard it any longer,” he said. “I became a firefighter. The Americans would drop incendiary bombs to set the city on fire, and when we went to fight the fires they would wait until we were very busy and then they would come over with other B-29s and drop antipersonnel bombs and kill the firemen. I thought, ‘The Americans are very clever.’ Then, after the whole city had been destroyed, a single B-29 flew over Osaka and dropped not bombs but hundreds of little parachutes. When these parachutes landed we saw that a gift was tied to each—a mirror, a harmonica, a fountain pen. The Japanese people had lost nearly everything in the bombing and they were very glad to have these gifts from the Americans. They ran to get them, and when they touched them they exploded in their hands, blowing off fingers and blinding people. I thought, ‘The Americans are not only clever; they are ruthless. We have lost the war.’”

      Yamagishi said, “Your ships came and shelled us. The bombers kept on also, every day. I was assigned to train people to fight the Americans when they invaded. We showed women and children how to make spears from bamboo. Every Japanese was prepared to die defending the homeland. Then the atom bombs were dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki. The emperor’s voice came over loudspeakers in the streets. He told us we must surrender. No one had ever heard his voice before, and to us it was the voice of God. But our commanding officer said, ‘No! We must kill the Americans! He is no true emperor if he tells the Japanese to surrender.’ Nevertheless we obeyed the emperor, and I came back to this village. All the younger sons of every family—all twenty families—had been killed in the war. Only old men and women were left to do the work. I thought we would starve to death. But as you see, we did not.

      “Now,” the old Japanese said, “I will tell you why I invited you here. It is because I have something to say to you, and to all Americans.” He was out of breath and his face was full of color from the whiskey he had drunk, and I thought, “Well, here it comes.”

      Yamagishi said, “Thank you. Thank you for defeating Japan. If you Americans had not done so, this village would be as it always was. The militarists would never have let us have democracy. But the Americans built the road; my nephews and nieces have cars and television sets, and they see their children every day. And because they have eaten American things like milk and vegetables and fruit, instead of the millet and pickles we had to eat, they are tall and beautiful like Americans instead of short and homely like me and my wife.” He bowed and said, “Thank you.” I realized, to my surprise, and in spite of everything I believed about the morality of bombing civilians, that the U.S. Air Force had won Yamagishi’s heart and mind by pitilessly destroying Osaka, Hiroshima and Nagasaki..

  • jackhampton

    DaphneeLee
    We can already say “We told you so” The judge that sat in the trial of the first bombing of the Trade Center and was later US atty General has stated the danger of this show trial is unimaginable. The first trial begat 9/11 and the USS Cole. Any nation with 300 hundred million people are going to have some that commit evil acts but these are not acceptable to us I.E. the actions of William Kalley in Vietnam, Democrats supporting slavery and Jim Crow laws, were not acceptable. I have first hand knoledge of the evil people can do both in war and in law enforcement. But this nation still has the best system and the most fair criminal justice system in the world if it is civilian court or a military tribunal. We spend tons of money and force victims to endure extreme duress and punishment for that purpose while defendants are treated with kid cloves many escape justice,See OJ again and dozens of combatants that were released to be either captured or killed again on the battle field. Was it projected fear when people were leaping to there deaths from the windows of the World Trade Center to escape the flames? Grow up.

  • jackhampton

    GuestDaphneeLee
    “The likes of people like me” Yes people that gave there blod and flesh so you can sit behind a key board and pound out ignorance. There is nothing conjecture about my statement it is fact the technology is not there yet and affordable. “You are basing those comments on a history that you know of” Well yes! What do you want to reinvent the wheel? Humans made use of the energy we have to provide a better life and they will do so in the future as I stated above you will se cars running on hydrogen as they come down in price you will also see cars and trucks converting to Natural Gas which we have in abundance. In the mean time we will still use oil it is not evil it is a natural organic product that comes from dead animals from millions of years ago.
    Now here is a REALLY REALLY GOOD idea if you really believe the garbage you are spewing shut down that computer. give away your car or have it demolished any telivision sets any cell phone you have and oh yea that Ipod as well and move into the nearest cave. grow all your on food and hunt or pick berries as well use the animal skins for clothing. Do not cheat and take toilet paper either be in fellowship with the dummy Cheryl Crow or any other feminine products. Live the life you spew.

  • jackhampton

    JeromefromLayton
    After Cronkite lied about Tet in 1968 I never listened to another broadcast from the liar for the rest of his life. Just as I no longer listen to any speech or comment from Obama both massive liars

  • jackhampton

    Mark R
    It reminds me of an abused woman that wants to stay with there abuser after all he is only brutalizing her because he loves her. Madness madness.

  • jackhampton

    “Pythagoras, keep in mind that these trials are going to be conducted AT THE FEDERAL LEVEL. Federal district court judges don't typically allow the sort of jury packing schemes you seem to fear, and, frankly, federal judges just don't make procedural errors. These are the finest legal professionals in America, not country bumpkins who have to stand for election”

    It is more than obvious you have spent very little time in federal court rooms or you would not make this ridiclous statement. Federal courts are nightmares for there foul ups and procedural flaws as well. All you have to do is look at the 9th circuit alone. You do not have a clue about federal courts and the dumb errors they make daily I do. Give me a good state judge any day.

  • jackhampton

    Martha
    Do not stoop to this morons level. You are wiser than that.

  • jackhampton

    Martha
    You are right he has already proven he does not know anything about federal courts and is simply blowing to hear his own noise I would waste no more time.

  • jackhampton

    clark81
    So now the mask is ripped away to reveal what was suspected all along an anti-Semite. Disgusting. I was right

  • jackhampton

    What brain? anti-Semites do not have brains they just want to see dead Jews.

  • jackhampton

    You are confused it was Bill Clinton that needed a piece. Obama needs a new job like fry cook at a Waffel House. You are evidently not American so what is this we stuff? Done with this koolaid drinker.

  • jackhampton

    Giuliani has already stated it is a nightmare and very dangerous. You can write this down there will be a terrorist attack during the trial you can just about take that to the bank. But I do not think that Obuma or Holder really care.

  • jackhampton

    Lary9 NUTS you have to be insane Obuma has not accomplished one thing other than spend us into oblivion. He has people pining for the great days of Jimmy Carter that is how bad this rube is. You being a schill for this hapless camera loving simpleton is got to be a bad joke well it is and the joke is on the people of this country. Chalk up another loser.

  • jackhampton

    Either your a muzzie or just your garden variety moron.

  • jackhampton

    likesdick12
    There was no torture at GITMO There was some discomfort simuliar to college hazing to learn about torture goggle Col. Bud Day and he can tell you what real torture is. I think even you might understand it. Oh and yes I have been water boarded. We use to waterboard each other with beer.

  • jackhampton

    likesdick12
    I am now rolling on the floor laughing. It is apparent from your own words she worked as a waitress and cleaned the apartment and cared for your child the other job was obviously having to tolerate you. You are probably the reason she drank. Sounds like she was superior to you on all levels. But then after this sniviling complaint in regard to a woman you chose to be the mother of your child we are to trust your judgement Hehehehe Haw hehe. where do these people come from Hell if i could I would buy that woman a drink.

  • jackhampton

    likesdick12
    You are the substance that constitutes that hole and it has nothing to do with your race but your corupt mind and the self imposed debasement that you accept. Your previous comments regarding the mother of your child is very telling and is an integral part of your own miserable failings as a human being. Kumbaya has nothing to do with race but with ideaology of the leftwing hippie philosophy. but in short you are an idiot and now you have completely proven it.

  • jackhampton

    likesdick12 you are an idiot the man is no longer mayor or does he hold an office of any kind. You have gall even using the word intellect. You have the intellect of a head of cabbage you are a joke. Do you understand that people are laughing at you?

  • jackhampton

    likesdick12
    No wonder your wife left you now you want to do other guys? Not only is he low trash but he is into perversion as well I thought there was a hidden meaning to your name you must like it a lot.

  • jackhampton

    likesdick12
    This moron is just a pathetic liar above he indicated he was black now he claims to be Italian and with his giant intellect note the word (Wap) for the insult wop This guy is a moron I assure you Martha he is probably a cross dresser working at a homosexual bar. Not worth anymore of our time..

  • Lary9

    If that is so he won't have to try very hard,

  • RD1953

    The evidence of his actions continues to mount that Sheik Obama is Muslim, is aiding the jihad, and is helping to destroy America.

  • Steven Brady

    I remember one incident in Vietnam in which we were set up … fired upon by NVA troops on the other side of village, in order to catch the people in a crossfire (with predictable results). Within five minutes of the cessation of fire, three trucks showed up, complete with “journalists” and cameras), while our hapless LT tried in vain to explain what had happened. The cameramen were busy filming Vietnamese bleeding.

    It was complete cooperation with the news media, in my estimation. The same thing is happening in Afghanistan, right now.

  • Pythagoras

    My students call some of my math classes torture — and I'm sure the nightmares are real. So what? The Japanese did things a zillion times worse than waterboarding and I doubt their waterboarding was as “safe” as ours.

    I had a nightmare just last night about trying to reason with someone filled with blind hatred for the US,

  • JeromefromLayton

    Bingo! You just reminded of something I saw on TV during that time. I was doing multiple extensions, so, my viewing was on both sides of the Pacific. The TV shows tended to look like “the fires of Hades” but when I saw the same scenes, the real colors tended to be white and grey with a blueish illumination from the mercury vapor lights. So, I experimented with photo filters and found that I could reproduce the “media” version with an orange G2 filter. That filtering could have been done anywhere from the camera to post production, but I am sure they were manipulating the content for effect.

  • Robert Wargas

    “The left wants a return to rule of law, accountability, and oversight.”
    Which law? Certainly not the Constitution. And don't come back with the Bush-Patriot Act argument, because I'm not a Republican. And if you claim to want accountability and oversight, did you denounce ACORN and the assorted interest-group thieves who are feeding at Obama's trough? Or did you join the media in denouncing those who wanted real accountability?

    “The 'radical left' are anarchists that want to be left alone….” Not really true. Leftist anarchists claim they want no governmental power, except, of course, the “democracy” needed to outlaw free enterprise.

    The term “radical right” is usually reserved for ultra-nationalistic fascists. These people, by the way, are not conservatives. They come from an entirely different philosophical tradition.

  • LucyQ

    David Horowitz is at war with too many people such as the majority of US citizens who voted for the Democrats in 2008 and all 1.2 billion Muslims when only 19 were responsible for 911.

    Sure, our armed forces can invade and occupy all 78 Islamic nations in the ME, Asia and Africa, and kill all Muslims in those nations including born and unborn children, our taxes would have to be raised 90% higher or we could print more almost worthless money to support our 78 wars, bring back the draft and so on.

    The 1993 WTC bombers were tried in civilian court very successfully, the way justice works in a democracy. I don't understand David's fear of the democratic system in which our nation is based upon.

  • LindaRivera

    How the US army protects its trucks – by paying the Taliban

    Insurance, security or extortion? The US is spending millions of dollars in Afghanistan to ensure its supply convoys get through – and it's the Taliban who profit
    http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/nov/13/us-

  • LindaRivera

    WHY are U.S. tax dollars used to finance the WAR against our military???

    'How the US army protects its trucks – by paying the Taliban

    Insurance, security or extortion? The US is spending millions of dollars in Afghanistan to ensure its supply convoys get through – and it's the Taliban who profit'
    http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/nov/13/us-

  • LindaRivera

    For the survival of America, Canada, Australia, Israel and other Western nations, it is urgent that we examine the results of massive Muslim immigration into Europe and the UK. In Europe, UK, Israel and India there are many no-go Muslim areas where it is too dangerous for non-Muslims to enter.

    Good bye France… letting Muslims over take you once again… but without Charles Martel this time.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o3R7hYMNY2E&feat

    http://www.jihadwatch.org
    Fitzgerald: Douce France

    For a jihad is what — it is increasingly clear — France now faces…

    Yes, you do notice more and more Muslims about you as you walk, no longer in the banlieues, but in the center of Paris, or Toulouse, or Lyon. And you remember how uneasy you felt, four years ago, when you happened to be walking on the Cannebière in Marseille. You decided, then and there, that you would not return. And you have friends who live in the south. And they tell you that the beurs – some call them maghrébins — make life hell for everyone.

    They attack French children on the way to school. They vandalize cars. They threaten, and do more than threaten, anyone who is still foolish enough to walk out wearing a kippah or a cross. Whole areas of cities in the south, as in the north, and east, and west, have become off-limits to non-Muslims. In the schools, the teachers have lost authority. They cannot even cover the subjects of World War II, the Resistance, and the murders of the Jews as the state prescribes; they fear, with reason, the violent reaction of the Muslim students.

    And as the schools become more and more dangerous for non-Muslim students and teachers, with more time and resources devoted to discipline rather than to learning, French parents and would-be parents are now silently factoring into their childbearing plans…those French people will plan on smaller families.

    And they will also be factoring in the growing cost, paid by them, those French taxpayers, for the whole expanding edifice of security, the guards in the schools, the guards at the train stations and métro stations and airports and at government buildings everywhere, the costs of keeping the gravestones from being vandalized, the costs of protecting the synagogues and the churches, the costs for all those tapped phones and agents in mosques, and subsidies to lawyers and judges to hear charges and try cases against Muslims, and the costs of monitoring da'wa in the prisons (more than 50% Muslim).

    But the Muslims are indifferent to expenses incurred by the French state. France is part of the world; the world belongs to Allah, and to his Believers. That doctrine has remained immutable for 1400 years. Imam Bouziane, the one they keep trying to deport, had 16 children by two wives, all living on the French state: a representative Muslim man.

    You vacation in Normandy, or Brittany, or the Ile de Ré. And you do not take the metro often enough, or walk in the right districts, or work in the right factories or offices, to understand what tens of millions of your fellow Frenchmen now have to endure.

    No one will mention what is happening or what kinds of things we must begin to think about doing to save ourselves…something has gone irreparably wrong with your country, and you, and your children, are in danger of losing that country, down to every village and house…France will have a majority Muslim population.
    http://www.jihadwatch.org/2005/11/fitzgerald-do

    Unless the Muslim immigration-invasion is stopped, France's agony is the future for America and all Western nations. Future generations will NEVER forgive us.

    ’“One day, millions of men will leave the Southern Hemisphere to go to the Northern Hemisphere. And they will not go there as friends. Because they will go there to conquer it. And they will conquer it with their sons. The wombs of our women will give us victory.”
    —Former Algerian President Houari Boumedienne’s prophetic warning to Europe in a speech at the U.N. In 1974.

    MUSLIM Demographics (alarming)
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6-3X5hIFXYU

    In Sweden, many Muslim youth wear a t-shirt proclaiming: “2030-then we take over”

    The END of EUROPE http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CfOmQ4Eo_as

  • LindaRivera

    WHY are Ohio Authorities Acting as if America is a MUSLIM NATION where non-Muslims have no rights?

    Terrified 17-year-old Rifqa Bary who fled from being honor killed by her family must NEVER be returned to her parents in Ohio! Never sent back to Sri Lanka! Rifqa left Islam and the punishment for leaving Islam is death!

    Ohio authorities to whom Rifqa has been returned from Florida where she fled for safety, are punishing frightened Rifqa – not allowing her to use the internet or use the phone! Secretly holding hearings and deliberately isolating this young girl from her friends and the many people who are deeply concerned about her safety and want to help her.

    Why are Ohio authorities acting as if America is a Muslim country???

    British police and the organizations in Britain who help victims such as Rifqa Bary, would be deeply shocked at American authorities' cruel treatment of Rifqa.

    http://WWW.GUARDIAN.CO.UK
    Ending the silence on 'honour killing'
    I wish I could get involved with the support groups and help but you know, I'm just a coward.”

    Having first walked out of an abusive marriage at the age of 17 and then from a hostile family who had had a meeting to discuss whether or not she should die, Zena does not lack courage but she is still very scared.
    She has every reason to be. Her Bangladeshi-born mother had suggested that Zena might be allowed to poison herself rather than be murdered for bringing shame on the family.

    “I'm sorry to be so cloak-and-dagger but you never know what they might be capable of, I know there are plenty of young men who would love to play bounty hunter just for a bit of kudos in the community.”

    Police estimate at least 12 are dying each year in the UK but others will be hidden – forced suicides and murders made to look like suicide are widely believed to take place undetected. Women aged 16-24 from Pakistani, Indian and Bangladeshi backgrounds are three times more likely to kill themselves than the national average for that age and it is impossible to tell what pressures some must have been under.

    When it opened its helpline in April 2008, Karma Nirvana received 4,000 calls in the first year and is now taking 300 calls a month from people under threat of honour-based violence, often linked to forced marriage.

    After the government's forced marriage unit was set up in April last year, it received 5,000 calls and rescued 400 victims in the first six months.

    They also face being hunted down, said Detective Chief Inspector Gerry Campbell of the Metropolitan police. “It's not uncommon to have bounty hunters out hunting down young people who have left forced marriages or fled from a family where they are at risk. It's rare for [one person] to take unilateral action, it's all done in consultation and there is logistical support and collusion in the extended community,” he said.

    …Banaz Mahmod, who made contact with police five times to say she thought her life was in danger but always drew back from pressing charges. Banaz, 19, a Kurd, was murdered by family members at her home in Mitcham, Surrey, in 2006.

    She had been raped and beaten by the older man she had been forced to marry, and had left him. Her elder sister, Bekhal, had also left home to escape their father's violence and the extended family was beginning to regard Mahmod Mahmod as a man who had lost control of his daughters. The shame became so unbearable that he held a meeting to discuss killing his daughter and her new boyfriend.

    “I'm confident that no victim will ever be turned away in London and that officers know that to do nothing is not an option.

    “Honour is about a collection of practices used by the family to control behaviour, to prevent perceived shame, but there's no honour in murder, rape, or kidnapping and with 25% of the [cases] we are seeing involving a person under 18: this is a child abuse issue too. The simple message is: If you do this you will be caught and brought to justice.

    The behaviour of women seen to have dishonoured their families can be as harmless as wearing make-up or talking to boys. One suspected murder is believed to have been caused by a girl having a love song dedicated to her on a community radio show.

    Diana Nammi, who runs the Iranian and Kurdish Women's Rights Organisation in London: For someone to be killed for their make-up or clothes or having a boyfriend or for refusing to accept a forced marriage is so brutal and unacceptable.

    In Pakistan the practice of honour killing – called karo-kari – sees more than 10,000 women die each year.

    For Zena, she has her life but does not have her freedom. “When I first ran away I would go to the library and read loads of spy books to pick up tips. You have to teach yourself how to best keep hidden,” she said. “My life is about keeping a very low profile now and about looking over my shoulder, but at least I know I am alive and I grieve for those poor girls who are not.”
    http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2009/oct/25/h

  • Bhishma

    Americans are paying the price for:
    - Electing and rele-ecting traitors.
    - Ignorance about Islam.
    - Poor Education.
    Thanks to their ignorance, Americans gave a pass to mass immigration, legal and illegal, including muslim immigration. This has changd the demographics of America so dramatically that every 2nd “American” is an immigrant.. and this does not include an illegal immigrant. Politicians, in their greed for votes, opened up immigration to one and all. In their greed for money, politicians took campaign contributions fro La Razas, who care less for American and even less for Americans (American dollars, benefits, definitely but America and Americans, none, if one can see the difference).
    Taking advantage of greedy politicians, their open, liberal (read greedy) policies, Islam just walked into USA, made CAIR, MAS, ISNA and are now dictating the same greedy politicians (will they ever change?). Who give in. And now, the ustice Department, State Department and the White House are dancing to muslim tunes. Yet, at the root of the problem is the open and liberal immigration, caused by electing and re-electing greedy politicians, thanks to the poor educated Amerisan public.
    This is not to condone Islamic hostility or the policies of greedy, liberal and irreponsible politicians. But when Barry “God D**n America” Obama is elected to the White House, and patriots like Tom Tancredo are ignored, America has definitely “Changed”.

  • SAM000

    President OBAMA SHAME ON YOU;

    The millions of the Iranians were chanting Obama, Obama You are with them (the Mullahs) or with us?

    at November 3 it was the anniversary of the hostage taking of the US EMBASSY of Tehran.

    At this day the Iranians were chanting death to the Islamic Regime (in response to the regime who were chanting death to USA and Israel),
    And yesterday, Obama tried again to find a way to protect this Criminal Regime of the Mullahs by offering them more incentives and supports agains the Iranians.

    President OBAMA SHAME ON YOU.

  • CowboyUp

    Why are enemy combatants given rights US Soldiers don't even get? What's right about that? Why did no one insist US service members get civilian trials for Haditha, Abu Grahb, or any of the other incidents US service members were tried for? Military commissions were good enough for them. There's huge problems giving enemy combatants rights as civil criminals, rather than the rights the war criminals they are. It looks like you and many others will learn about them the hard way. Remember me when the realization occurs.

  • Charles Dean

    Making these trials matters of civil law is an expression of U.S. lack of will to endure difficulty for the sake of national safety. In a darker expression, it is in a way the repudiation of United States existence, all for the sake of a legal theory. About theories: some years ago a man won the Nobel Prize in Mathematics for demonstrating that a rubber ball could be everted completely, mathematically, even though such an event was, by the laws of physics, is impossible on its face. So much for the theoretical, in a dangerous world. Howsomever badly the Bush Administration oversaw the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, they were AT LEAST, clear-eyed, if reluctant, realists.

  • robolungfish

    Which law? Yes, the constitution.

    I would come back with the Bush-Patriot Act, regardless of your political affiliation (not sure what this has to do with you) because it was a gross expansion of executive power. As was the use of signing statements and line item vetoes, the “if I say it's legal, it's legal” reasoning of the unitary executive theory and behind extraordinary rendition, the expanded power of the vice president as a shadow office that can claim to be beyond rules pertaining to the executive or legislative branches because it can claim to be a part of both, and so on. Nearly every president has abused the office to expand the power of their branch, and the expansions of power under the Bush administration was only one of the more dramatic expansions.

    Receding oversight and accountability follow with continuing to build toward an imperial presidency. Illegal wiretapping, disregarding FOIA requests, hiring private military contractors who do not answer to the chain of command and answer directly to the state department, withholding lists of white house visitors, illegally using private accounts to conduct official government business and then “losing” all email archives. These are issues that the current administration are happy to address only in the most passive of ways-if at all-because it, like every administration before, wants to expand executive “privilege.”

    If “I claim” to want accountability and oversight? Oh, I get it, you decided that I represent the left and you represent the right. I don't really think that's fair; I'll answer as if you asked “why do you think the left did not denounce ACORN?”

    The left doesn't care about ACORN and doesn't understand the controversy. The thousands of false voter registrations that swept the news seemed like just the cost incentivizing results instead of paying hourly – after all, you can register Mikey Mouse a million times, but only the legal Mikey Mouse can vote. In my state, there was a much worse controversy in that arena because it was paying for signatures to get measures on the ballot favored only by powerful interests.
    The video where a couple people went to a lot of offices and got a few people to give them advice on their taxes for their fake illegal immigrant child prostitution business was hilariously bad press. Everyone involved was immediately fired and hiring guidelines and training were tightened. After hearing about the Dem whose now going to jail over his freezer full of cash or the “Sex For Oil Scandal At Interior Department,” that episode seemed terribly tame.

    Anyway, I would say ACORN doesn't compare to the Patriot Act as an infringement on accountability and oversight and expansion of the imperial presidency.

    The final point; what is the “radical left” and do they want to outlaw free enterprise? That seems to me a boogyman argument and sounds like the “you hate freedom” retort that is so disingenuous and divisive that it's a joke. Religious fundamentalists hate other people's freedom because they think a sky god will reward them for following the “true way.” If we're talking broad generalities, the only freedoms the left fights are the freedoms of super-rich companies to use anti-competitive maneuvers to become near cartels with rights as legal persons and be able to pressure the government for a bailout when risk crashes on them, and the freedom of government to be a surveillance state with the power to take life without establishing guilt.

  • LucyQ

    What are the huge problems you perceive? What will I learn 'the hard way?

    This issue is not about the rights of US soldiers and thanks for responding to the issues I raised-?????

  • robolungfish

    I'm sorry your students feel so terrorized, haha

    The reason I mention Hitchens and Mancow waterboardings is because they are examples of people saying that it's not torture and just s a walk in the park, and then changing their tune immediately afterward. Working at a naval hospital I met SEALS who had been waterboarded as part of their training and none of them called it something that only bed wetters would call torture; they called it torture. Which is why they train to be able to resist it.

    Anyway, on this issue I suppose we are at an impasse typical of exchanges like these: Everything I've read and seen suggests that it is torture and I haven't seen credible evidence to the contrary. I imagine you're in the opposite position, and unless we're willing to start throwing sources and counter-sources at eachother, we'll have to agree to disagree.

    Judging by the lack of sources so far in this thread, I imagine we're equally busy enough already without voluntary research assignments.

  • Lary9

    Have you forgotten that President Clinton gave us a balance budget
    repeatedly and turned over a zero-deficit record to George W. and what did
    he do with it? He crashed it! 'Mission Accomplished' indeed!
    Harrumph! Lary9

  • Lary9

    Just keeping the faith. I like to remind myself that we're all Americans
    and Thansgiving isn't a day for throwing turkey legs across the table at
    each other. Lary9

  • Lary9

    I am sincerely convinced that trying them as civilians is constitutionally
    sound and strategically optimizes our response… to the Muslim Brotherhood,
    to the world at large and by law. Lary9

  • Lary9

    I'm not sure I agree but I follow the thread of your reasoning. I just
    think it's not the best option. Lary9

  • bushlikesdick12

    Hey Jack-off-often,

    Your response to Talk'n-Horse-shit is displaying your emotional feminine side only with no rational point.

    Re: “

    “—There's a terrible irony in having a government structure that no longer recognizes any Constitutional restrictions on its authority with respect to domestic control of American citizens, but pulls out all the stops for the benefit of foreign genocidal maniacs. This intolerable madness is pushing the nation toward internal discord the likes of which hasn't been seen since the Civil War. God help us all.—“

    LOL — not recognizing any constitutional restrictions? Can you give me any examples?

    You know we have an expert on this subject named Coyote3 who likes to misrepresent the constitution every chance he can get so maybe you should consult him on how to give some b.s examples on this one because talk'n-horse-shit has zero — just whining with no substance.

    I, on the other hand, can give you an explicit example: detaining U.S. citizens without a trail and spying on them without a warrant. The Patriot Act is unconstitutional and it is Dick's Bush that is doing Cheney's unconstitutional acts for him.

    So don't be accusing anyone of unconstitutional authority other than yourselves.

    What sniper conviently left out is that fact that both the prosecution and the defense team have equal number of jury dismissals during the jury selection.

    I was juror #12 on the James Moreno case in which ( a 15 yr old at the time) shot and killed an innocent Mexican citizen outside a mall.

    I answered both lawyers questions with exact precision upon my selection to serve on this trail — I was very objective in the questions regarding bias and non-bias towards gangs and police.

    I have had confrontations with both but no more than the average citizen and demonstrated my honesty.

    Muslims, on the other hand, as Sniper again doesn't go into, obtain the fact that fanatical Muslims can not be objective due to the restrictions placed in their belief system.

    So the more subjective they are as fanatical Muslims, the less likely they will be chosen by the prosectution. Also, if a Muslim displays too much bias, the judge can dismiss him without costing the prosecution a chance in dismissal.

    As jury # 12, just before deliberation, the defense team tried to get me dismissed ( they must have read my body language correctly) based on the accusation that I was writting a book about the trial on my laptop during breaks outside the courtroom lobby.

    The defense was correct in their observation of me being hostile towards the defendent (my opinion of his innocense by the end of the trial must have become apprarent to the defense)– What the defense forgot to ask me ( I'm not sure if they were allowed to ask me) was if I had any children that socialize at malls. They also forgot to ask me what I was really doing on my laptop — at the time, I had a 12 yr old daughter in which I was coaching her soccer team and I was working on some practice plans for her team.

    Never the less, I'm the one that aggressively debated the jury to find him guilty of 1st degree murder. It was the only other 2 men in the jury that felt sympathy for the little punk.

    So Snipper only knows how to copy and paste, Talk'n horse- shit holds true to his name and you just need to go back to doing your regular hobby.

  • Lary9

    LucyQ~ Where did you get your figures? I'm just curious since I make it 55-56 Islamic countries at last count. Agree with you on your posting.

  • bushlikesdick12

    Jack-off-often,

    It is the significant part of our democracy that we express the complete story.

    Lady liberty is holding the scale for what reason?

    This applies to our justice system as well as our press.

    If we only expressed issues through the ideas of the right-wing then we wouldn't be a democracy.

    Only the American's that have the courage to show the unpopular side have brass balls.

    Bush””has no balls what so ever.

  • bushlikesdick12

    “jack off-often,

    Actually, the Taliban recents Hollywood because it is the altimate avenue of freedom of expression. Even the Christain fanatics would want to blow up Hollywood. Someday, that may be the only alliance that fanatical Muslims and Christians would have together — to subjugate anyone who doesn't live by their beliefs — you are not much different than the terrorists you speak of jack-off

  • Lary9

    “Why did no one insist US service members get civilian trials for Haditha, Abu Grahb, or any of the other incidents US service members were tried for?” The reason is obvious. They were all in uniform and were active duty members of the US armed forces. There crimes are covered by Title 10 under the Uniform Code of Military Justice, except in the case of National Guard troops activated under Presidential order, which is covered under Title 32 and, I believe, reverts to the states of guard unit origin. That's quite clear. These terror mongers from Gitmo don't deserve a UCMJ trial. L9

  • bushlikesdick12

    Jack-off-often,

    Our judicial system is the best in the world and in no means is a kangaroo court.

    The problem you have is that there are the scales of justice and you can't cope with that.

    You can't cope with the truth and that is what our justice system is designed to find.

    If the process of finding the truth becomes tainted due to invalid means to distribution, then the defendent is granted the assumption of innocense till properly proven guilty.

    We will not compromise our system so that jack-offs like you can express your bias by making a joke out of our system.

  • bushlikesdick12

    Jack-off-often,

    If a word is in the dictionary anyone can use it.

    Expressing a point with explicit language is a effective tool of communicating the level of intensity.

    From my perspective of your position, we all should only live by the living standards of Quakers,

    Besides, you are a hypocrit — it is you that indulged in profanity by responding to all my comments of so-call vulgar.

    Based on this, it is you that should no longer comment base on the conclusion that you are hypocrictical by your own standards.

    It is you that is behaving like a puck — Jack-off

  • LucyQ

    I got my figures a few years ago from an encyclopedia, don't remember which one. There are 22 in the ME and the rest are in Asia and Africa.

    I think it's nuts to want to kill every Muslim on earth because 19 dead ones did 911. Not our military, the Dems nor the GOP say were at war with every Muslim on earth. The only ones who want that are the extremist fringe cases, including Horowitz.

  • KingofNorway

    I hear you Lary9. However, there are a ton of people in this country who think we should ignore the constitution, people who think a huge central government is the answer to all problems, people also tend to agree that ceding sovereignty for the sake of world peace or environmental preservation is acceptable. For my part, people who would dither away our sovereignty and/or ignore the constitution cannot rightly call themselves Americans. Those who think a huge central government is the solution have no sense of history and will destroy the country if allowed to proceed.

  • Lary9

    Just a post-it note to LindaR: Did you know that 57 cents of every American tax dollar goes to military affairs?

  • KingofNorway
  • bushlikesdick12

    Hey Jack-off-often,

    It is you that has an ignorant perspective of the complete justice system including both Federal and civilian courts.

    One of the key differences is that a judge in a federal court can make information secret about the defendent from the press for the purpose of protecting the defendent.

    Also, documents can not be made public.

    It the lack of disclosure from the Federal court that would prevent our system to find the real perputrators in the crime of terrorism thus making the trail invalid to the rest of the world and more likely causing unrest and distrust in us — and for good reason.

    You often spout off about how we convicted the Nazi's this way but you conviently disregard the fact that the world doesn't really need to put the Nazi's agenda under a fine microscope to discern the judgement guilt as a civilian court would

    Would we find out if Bin Laden was really behind this one as well under the standards of a Federal court? — without the participation of the Public very unlikely.

    Would he tell the CIA what he assumes they want to hear only thus tainting the truth or are you just interested in creating a kangroo case in a subjective Federal court to generate a phoney case for the purpose of make propoganda for Cheneys personal agendas similar to Bush''s lies for putting Americans through the most costly and unproductive war in U.S. history?

    Another difference is that a Federal court is more likely to use harsher sentences than a civilian court.

    The prosecution in civilian court is seeking the death penalty — what more do you ask for Jack-off? Maybe we should sodomize him in public first and give the fanatics more reason to hate us.

  • Lary9

    You are angry. I can sense your frustration. Obama, by the way, is a moderate. Moreover, he is my president and happily I voted for him. But, again, he is a moderate, not an extremist. Listen carefully. He is a lawyer. He is a Columbia University and Harvard Law School graduate. He was president of the Harvard Law Review. He has an IQ of 138. Bulletin! Radical extremists do not have this kind of pedigree. He seems like a radical because of the chapters of black activism in his biography. But for an Afro-American from Chicago this is normal. Does a radical socialist bail out Wall Street, the symbol of the American dollar? Does a radical socialist and closet-Muslim send 40,000 more troops to Afghanistan? I don't think so. Give the guy a break. He's your president too.

  • bushlikesdick12

    Hey jack-off-often,

    King-of-kindergarden thinks it is about how our soilders feel and less about the dignity of our justice system.

    If a soilder feels like he has been spitted due to our constitutional due process, then the jack-off needs to wear a turbine and starting blowing the enemy.

    Regarding filing complaints and charges — soilders are not above the law but some criminals in uniform think they can randomly rape women in front of their families without any regard.

    This sort of behavior legitimizes the international community's accusations of us being barbarians.

    If the soilder did perform the hideous acts — then he should be tried and convicted. By doing so, we are restoring our reputation of defending justice and the security that come from democracy.

    Also, stop putting soilders on a pedistool about my country. They serve my country not the other way around.

    everytime your fingertips touch the keyboard, you incriminate yourself with stupidity.

  • bushlikesdick12

    Look it Jack-off-often,

    It isn't anti-Semite to point out that your dick is the size of a grain of rice.

    The word Anti-Semite isn't for you to randomley use as you please everytime your little weiner crawls up inside you.

    Can I not express the fact that Jews in general have bit noses?

    Are you a communists?

    Apparantly, you are allowed to make inappropriate remarks about Muslims but you don't see them acting like a little crybaby.

    The only time a Muslim protests your inappropriate behavior is when you piss on their Koran.

    So stop being a communists by properly using the word anti-Semite.

    FYI —anti-Semite includes the whole Babylonian Empire which would include Arabs as well so stop highjacking the word you jack-off

  • bushlikesdick12

    Unlike you who went from your Mama's womb right to your plastic bubble, I have lived life and have been responsible for my mistakes.

    I got the whore pregnant right out of highschool. Sense I was raised with principles, unlike you, I made the responsible choice of not aborting my daughter and I payed for many years.

    True, she divorced me during her affair with an apartment manager but here is the reality today. She has always been a drunk and over ten years as of today from our divorce, she can't find a partner that will put up with her, she has had over 3 dui's, and she is living in squaller.

    Me, on the other hand, have a beautiful family with children, a successfull contractor and a very healthy life

    And as you can see up the tread of this article, my intellect if far superior than anyone here including Horowitz and his idiots.

    You are so low on the list of I.Q levels on this website, it is starting to make me look like a bully beating you with a stick so often.

    I guess I should stop for a little while so you can get a chance to stop crying and screeming like the little girl you are.

  • bushlikesdick12

    Hey Jack-off-often,

    do you know the difference between the enemy attacking a military target and a civilian target? Apparantly not.

    I can't believe that you are that stupid.

    9/11 terrorist act was against civilians.

    Timothy Mcveigh targeted civilians as Federal employees and the Yemen that attack the U.S. Cole targeted the military outside the u.s..

    Hasan attacked soilders on a military base inside the u.s as a military officer.

    So can you disern which one of these should be tried in a civilian court and which ones should be tried in a military court?

    If you need help, just read your history book of actual facts Jack-off

  • bushlikesdick12

    Oh my god you are sooooo stupid—

    Kumbya was originally associated with human and spiritual unity, closeness and compassion, and it still is, but more recently it is also cited or alluded to in satirical, sarcastic or even cynical ways that suggest blind or false moralizing, hypocrisy, or naively optimistic views of the world and human nature.

    So there is an assertion of disrespect to it as of today

    But worse than that, to insinuate the song towards a black woman is explicit racism:

    Come By Yuh, as they called it, was sung in Gullah, the creole or pidgin dialect spoken by the former slaves living on the Sea Islands of South Carolina and Georgia. In Gullah, “Kumbaya” means “Come by here”, so the lyric could be translated as “Come by here, my lord, come by here.”

    My extensive experience as a contractor hiring subs and what not in the deep south, I can tell Martha there is a plantation white trash that talks down to black people.

    She is directly mocking her roots by talking down to her pigeon dialect songs.

    I would very much like to put her ignorant face up against my educated black friends — the only problem is that they have to much class to even acknowledge her.

    Man you are a very very dumb person'.

    Hasn't got much to do with hippies but a lot to do with subjective right wing idiot Christians subjugating the black poor

  • bushlikesdick12

    I marked your remark with a like because you incriminated yourself as a racist.

    It is you that I caught calling inappropiatly calling someone else a anti-Semite but yet you make the dissertion of the historical fact relating to the Denny's incident of refusing to serve a black person recently.

    Way to go Jack-off

  • Lary9

    I'm sure Mr. Horowitz doesn't want war with all Muslims. But I understand his reactionary thinking in the wake of political correctness doctrine. I remember Walid Shoebat in “Islam: What the West Needs to Know” said (I'm paraphrasing): There may be peaceful Muslims to the extent that they either: a) are ignorant of what the Koran says or b) intentionally disregard certain violent, Islamo-supremacist surahs in the Koran. But there is no such thing as a peaceful Islam.” I completely agree with this nuanced, thoughtful statement by Mr. Shoebat, an honest Egyptian scholar who was formerly a 'shaheed' and a member of the Muslim Brotherhood.

  • johnhickey

    For myself who was mentaly and physically, psycologicly affected by 9/11 still to this day, and hundreds of thousand plus +new yorkers who were closely affected by that day, Why is the Government bringing this situation back to NYC to reawaken all of our fears and memories of that day.
    For many of other reasons this decision is also this is WRONG. We must protest.

  • Lary9

    Do you think the UCMJ somehow abrogates the rights of defendants? It does not. What it does is to associate these homocidal Islamo-zombies with a sort of military sensibilty. As a former USAF vet myself that thought is abhorrent to me. I am adamant about this although I do see your side of it too. They are indictable for homicide. They are not indictable for being covert partisans in a wartime conspiracy.
    Oh, by the way, I am reallydisappointed and insulted when people call my president a traitor or any number of other rude names. The level of political discourse in our nation resembles a pro wrestling match. Dr. Franklin is rolling over in his Philadelphia grave.

  • bushlikesdick12

    The water boarding you experienced during your college hazing is fun and games when it comes to the professional tactics of psychological manipulation from these tactics.

    To say that waterboarding is not torture is insulting.

    There are three basic types of abuse in domestic cases — emotional, physical, and sexual.

    At Gitmo, or at least the Iraqi prisioners held in Iraq, All three were used.

    So when an American soilder gets capturered and paraded in front of the internet, do you suppose they need much arm twisting to torture and cut off his head?

    Worse than that, how much more torturing needs to be done for the Taliban to put aside some of their humanities and start torturing and choping off women Christian missionaries heads off?

  • bushlikesdick12

    Usually when one has no counter arguement one can only resort to hurling insults in an Ad Homien fallacy.

  • bushlikesdick12

    I never said I was black!

    1. wap 219 up, 122 down
    buy a wap mug or cap or hoodieDerogatory term for persons of Italian decent.

    —-http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=wap

    Listen here you dictionary Nazi

    If you study Websters or any other dictionary for that matter, you will see that most of our English words have derived from other languages such as Germaric, Latin, French, Spanish, and Hebrew.

    Also, our language evolves daily.

    The melting pot that we are, combining cultures together requires people of different languages to converge by combining language terms.

    The most common in the U.S. is called Spanglish to evolves to Chicano culture and language.

    Wop and Wap are both reconized as derogatory.

    Sense I'm of Italian descent and have personally experience our traditional subjective means of controll, I speak from experience and isn't racist sense I'm speaking of my own culture.

    It is correctness of one's dyfunctional cultural attributes that corrects and evolves one's race to a higher level of descency in humanity.

    This of course is the main problem with the Muslim world — the people are supressed not only by their own but by stupid articles and websites of the likes of this one by writting bias crap and letting morons like yourself appease to this nonsense.

  • bushlikesdick12

    My experience with Italians and my point completely flew over your knuckle shaped softball sized head.

    No shit Sherlock!

    I guess you don't have much knowlege or experience of how Italian Mafia's have run Lower Manhattan.

    Apparantly, you don't know much about Guilliani.

    Why do you suppose he is still allowed to breath after his big clean up of “corruption?

    Do you suppose every thug is now out of business or just the ones that managed to take a reduced sentence when Guiliani was a DA?

    Besides. Guiliani is a Democrat that turned Republican so he could compete for election. Too many Democrats and not enough Republicans.

    He would have never got nominated.

  • bushlikesdick12

    I had to make an example out of Jack Hampton for the rest of you who think you can skate around making unsubstaniated claims againt my government while hurling insults.
    As you can see, it is best that you don't respond to my abilities to correct your flawed opinions unless you know what you are talking about.

    As you can see, I have beat'n the crap out of Jack Hampton for being the little smart ass he is and he is hiding under his bed for now.

    Don't be my next victim

  • CowboyUp

    Lol, Putin's still running Russia, he's already had to publicly set hussein (who took it like the obedient commie pup he is) straight on that one. It's also pretty obvious all the way from Atlanta that NYC hasn't been run by Mayor G for a while now.

    Keep postin' though, you're a hoot.

  • CowboyUp

    Bush Sr., W Bush, there was something in between, wasn't there? Oh yea, 8 years of noncompliance with the GWCFA. Wild bill talked a lot, and bombed a few times when he needed a distraction, but punted when saddam kicked the inspectors out.

  • LindaRivera

    To LucyQWhy do you wickedly slander Mr. Horowitz and dishonestly accuse him of something he is NOT guilty of? At no time has ethical Mr. Horowitz ever said he wants every Muslim killed! The G-D of the Bible, the Creator NEVER changes! G-D's Word NEVER changes. He knows the future! G-D's Laws NEVER change. They are the same laws for everyone! G-D commanded:YOU SHALL NOT MURDERWe honor the G-D of life, our wonderful, great, mighty and awesome G-D by obeying His laws! Man's honor is nothing! G-D's honor is everything! G-D's requirement for ALL humanity is KINDNESS:And what does the L-RD require of you but to do justice, to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your G-D. Bible, Micah 6:8

  • bushlikesdick12

    Wow,

    I can't believe you are out of touch with reality that much.

    Let us talk about Clinton for a second.

    When Bin Laden bombed our embassies, the reaction from the public was null. Nobody seemed to really care that much and as far as most were concerned, we could just pull our embassies our of these rougue African countries.

    So what did Bill do? The only aggressive option he had was to violate Pakistan airspace with surface to surface missles to the Afghan mountains where Laden had his training camps only to be chastised by Pakistan for violating their airspace.

    If he would have asked Pakistan for permission he would have been denied for political reasons.

    Let us do a little history lesson before we go into the emotional pull the 9/11.

    Before and during WWll, the U.S. was in the worse economical depression ever. Jews immigrants were being turned away and sent back to Nazi Germany because so many people were out of work and there was no room for more. Jews were jumping ship in Havana Cuba because they were denied access their too.

    Back then, our economy was far more isolated than it is today and nobody wanted to go to war — the consensus of most Americans was that Hitler was Europes problem.

    After Japan attacked Pearl Harbor, congress declared war on Japan.

    4 days after Hitler declared war on us, congress declared war on Germany and Roosevelt received the largest expansion of war powers and war funds from congress ever.

    ( I'm kinda still in disbelief of your stupid remark about Clinton)

    Now let us jump ahead a few decades to Desert Storm.

    George H. Bush:

    The coalition forces led by the U.S, Saudi Arabia, and the UK (in that order) who liberated Kuwait and advanced into Iraqi territory. The coalition ceased their advance, and declared a cease-fire 100 hours after the ground campaign started

    Essentially, George H. Bush was chastined for not going into Bagdad and expelling Saddam when the reality is he didn't have the backing of the international community nor the American people (Congress)

    Now let us jump ahead another decade to the 9/11 terrorist attack on the WTC:

    When Clinton handed over his job to George W., Secretary of State Madeline Albright explicitly warned the Bush Administration of an imminent attack planned by Al Queda.

    According to Albright, she was left of deaf ears. Nobody in the Bush Administration was interested in her international efforts through the state department — it just wasn't a priority of the new Bush Administration at the time.

    Almost 9 months into the Bush Administration goes by and exactly what did the Bush Administration know about 9/11?

    Nobody really knows and nobody really knows for sure what FDR knew about the imminent attack on Pearl Harbor.

    But what everyone knows today is that both the Pearl Harbor attack and 9/11 prompted congress to give the President war powers and the funds to fight their war.

    Now how stupid do you feel now Cowboy up?

  • bushlikesdick12

    GWCFA? Nobody knows what you are talking about.

    That is pretty chicken shit to create an acronym of letters that could stand for is about anything.

    how about this acronym?

    wtf?

    (what the f*ck?)

  • CowboyUp

    Don't make fun of hussein's low IQ, we all know he has the best education affirmative action can buy, all that experience organizing, and he has an articulate teleprompter. Putin and the mad mullahs must be really brilliant to make such a chump of him. A 'moderate' commie is still a commie, but keep telling yourself that, it seems to be working for you.

  • bushlikesdick12

    re:

    Guiliani's influence in the City of N.Y. after office:

    Peter Powers is Chairman and Chief Executive Officer of Giuliani Partners;[4] he replaced Giuliani in this role[5] in June 2007,[4] as Giuliani was in midst of his campaign for president. Peters was formerly a deputy mayor of New York,[4] and many of the managing partners and executives of Giuliani Partners are former New York City officials, counsels, emergency services leaders, etc. from Giuliani's time as mayor.[6] There is a subsidiary of the partnership, Giuliani Security & Safety LLC (before 2005, Giuliani-Kerik), which focuses on security consulting, especially regarding buildings;[7] its Chairman and Chief Executive Officer is Pasquale J. D'Amuro, a former Assistant Director in Charge in the Federal Bureau of Investigation's New York office and an Inspector in Charge following the September 11, 2001 terrorist attacks.[7][3] Other subsidiaries include Giuliani Safety & Security Asia and Giuliani Compliance Japan.[3]

    Giuliani Partners' stated mission is

    “dedicated to helping leaders solve critical strategic issues, accelerate growth, and enhance the reputation and brand of their organizations in the context of strongly held values … based on six fundamental principles: Integrity, Optimism, Courage, Preparedness, Communication, Accountability.”[8]
    “No client is ever approved or worked on without a full discussion with Rudy… We're cautious in the right sense of that term, in terms of who we work for. We always want to make sure it is a company that is doing the right thing, that we're proud to represent,” according to Giuliani Partners’ senior managing partner, Michael D. Hess, former Corporation Counsel for New York City.

    No client is ever approved or worked on without a full discussion with Rudy… “

    again —

    No client is ever approved or worked on without a full discussion with Rudy…

    one more time for the mentally challenged

    No client is ever approved or worked on without a full discussion with Rudy…

    Again for the FPM patriots:

    No client is ever approved or worked on without a full discussion with Rudy…

    I guess you people need to have FPM publish even the most common sense shit in order for you to accept it.

    what a bunch conservative robots you are.

    Doesn't FPM give you some permission to think on your own?

  • bushlikesdick12

    Regarding Putin's influence after office:

    President Vladimir Putin said Tuesday that a convincing victory for the party he is leading in Dec. 2 parliamentary elections would give him the “moral right” to maintain strong influence in Russia after he steps down next year.
    Putin's remarks were the clearest affirmation yet that he plans to keep a powerful hold on Russia's reins, but he stopped short of saying whether he would seek a formal role

  • jackhampton

    likesdick12
    It is obvious who is the nazis here and you are willing to engage in any lie or deceit. You have been outed Clinton gave Bush a greatly weakened nation and vulnerable to attack Albright warned of nothing and when Clinton had his oppertunity to get Bin Laden he folded like the cheap suit you are. Your a phony and the truth is not in you. You publicly defame the mother of your own daughter and that is all that decent people need to know. You are simply a cheap punk and I locked many just like you up before I retired. You are no longer worthy of further comment. Lolol what a punk.

  • CowboyUp

    What US citizen has been detainded without a trial? What domestic phone call was illegally tapped? Maybe you should look up explicit before you use it.

    You must be real upset that hussein removed interrogation of high value terrorists from Congressional oversight, and is quietly keeping the Patriot Act.

  • CowboyUp

    Don't vote for a traitor and I won't call him one. It about the only standard to win the dp nomination these days. After the last 8 years, defenders of the dp are the last ones to lecture us on elevating political discourse.

    Terrorists we catch overseas are illegal combatants, and subject to military law. I find it abhorrent that they would be elevated above our service members and given rights we deny to our own. If they are caught over here they certainly are indictable as covert partisans or spies.

  • CowboyUp

    What more can I ask? A military tribunal, not a civilian criminal trial they have no right to. It's an exceptionally stupid mistake as you will learn.

  • CowboyUp

    Lol, who ever played slayer? Might as well listen to GWAR. That explains a lot about you. Are you one of those that has to change his handle often 'cause you're almost always wrong?

  • GBoydA

    the worst decision by a US president are the results of the worst decision in history for so many idiots that voted Obama as welll as Pelosi into office!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • CowboyUp

    Official, unofficial, putin's running Russia, and will be until he decides otherwise.

    I'll keep doing whatever I want, laughing and typing on the keyboard.

  • GBoydA

    To this person Bushlikesdick 12. Your intelligence or rather your lack thereof is greatly displayed with your rotton filthy language.

  • CowboyUp

    G has a veto over clients his distinguished private organization takes on, and nobody joins without his say-so, so what? He's not running NYC government, and hasn't since he left the office of Mayor.

    You can't pawn off NYC's obvious slide since he's gone private on Mr. G or his group. You'll just get laughed at.

  • CowboyUp

    Gulf War Cease Fire Agreement fool. Not everyone is as stupid as you are.

  • CowboyUp

    Yet those “military kangaroo courts” are fine for our service members?

    And yes, it is spitting on the US Constitution and the Soldiers defending it when those not entitled it's protections are given them. It's also spitting on the Geneva Conventions and US Soldiers when our enemies are not held to them.

  • CowboyUp

    I don't feel as stupid as you yet, maybe I'll suffer a severe blow to the head. Have heart the day's young.

    You believe what albright or any clintonista says? She and wild bill also said saddam was an imminent threat and had WMD. Wasn't it her brilliant diplomacy and her boss's leadership that had us going to war with and bombing a sovereign country that never attacked us, without congressional or UN approval (wild bill fired off half our supply of conventional cruise missiles without even notifying the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs)?

    Her 'international efforts through the state department' that's good! How many terrorists did they bag?

    Sorry charlie, wild bill did nothing about terrorism, whether it was aq terrorist attacks in Somalia (where wild bill cut and ran in the face of aq), Kenya, Tanzania, or letting obl go in Sudan. No doubt the uproar in my circles over wild bills noexistant response after talking a bunch of bs time after time didn't reach whatever insular rathole you live in, but it was wild bill's job to do something about it, not mine or anyone else's. I've been keeping tabs on terrorist Aholes since the 80's, and I had friends at Khobar towers. The military was wanting to go after aq long before 9/11.

    Yea, the clintonistas were so hot on terrorism they had to send sandy berger to steal a bunch of the 9/11 documents and make them disappear. Tell us another one.

  • kentek

    You re an idiot!
    He is over the top radical, Muslim, non-American and we are in deep trouble because of his policies.

  • CowboyUp

    Yea, you're right larry, lets give them a civil criminal trial where they have even more rights and status. Great idea, that will show everyone how much you despise those terror mongers.

  • CowboyUp

    The NCOs used to tell us scary stories about the “Forgotten Army” of the late '70s, in the '80s. It reminded me of Patton practicing with plywood tanks between wars, cause they didn't have any real ones. They said to thank President Reagan every time we got to fire a live Dragon ATM (which had a much more pronounced flash and kick than the practice rounds).

  • CowboyUp

    We can start with publicity, it gives them a public propaganda platform with a lot more leeway than a military tribunal. Half of terrorism is publicity, score one or more for aq, and giving a terrorist a microphone is almost as dumb as giving them a weapon.

    Discovery will be an intel goldmine for aq, methods, operatives and sources will go on record, endangering them and their families as well as negating most or all of their future value and utility. Any judge and jury (and their families) that convicts him will be prime targets for future terrorism. Any fair civil criminal trial will reveal enough to endanger those out there hunting the rest, not to mention the 300 million Americans they are defending.

    Anything about the people and organizations US soldiers fight, kill, and capture, is about their rights as well. You can't elevate the terrorist without debasing the lawful combatants. It's the same issue, just a different side of it that obviously isn't being considered.

    These aren't mere criminals you're dealing with here, and President Bush didn't keep them there just because he was mean and didn't want them to get a fair trial. Apparently hussein really is as stupid as he talked in his campaign. We're playing with fire, we're going to get burned, and unless they walk, nobody that thought they weren't going to get a fair trial with a commission will think their civil criminal trial was fair anyway. It's pointless, wrong, and stupid to give them civil criminal rights when they belong in front of a military tribunal.

  • CowboyUp

    You're right, and I don't even think we have to go to war with, much less kill but a fraction, but those are the hardest of the lot and they'll never quit killing us until we do, so I don't expect it to be short, cheap, or easy.

  • jackhampton

    CowboyUp
    Please do not take this the wrong way but you are trying to reason with the equivilent of a harlot challenged on every standard of decency. You are wasting your time.

  • jackhampton

    Cowboy
    That is a great attempt and deserves a cheer but you are confusing this dullard with facts. I believe that is a felony now.

  • CowboyUp

    Spare me, they didn't even get a lungful of water, just a little up the nose. My brother used to hold me under until no more bubbles came up and I was groggy and coughing up lake water for the next 10 minutes. Then I'd bug him into doing it again. That was mild to what other people's older brothers were doing to them. What a bunch of wussies.

    They already are raping and killing Christian missionaries, torture is SOP for them, and to change that you're back to force. They won't quit until that means a reasonably certain and unpleasant death for them. As long as waterboarding works, great, but what can they copmplain about if we use their own torture manual on them?

  • jackhampton

    Cowboy
    That NCO was right it was called VOLAR and Jimmy Crack Carter just about destroyed the military.

  • CowboyUp

    Some laws are meant to be broken ;-) He's just too easy to pass up.

  • CowboyUp

    And then you woke up…

  • CowboyUp

    I'm told by family and friends I'd argue with a rock if there was no one around to argue with, lol. I put it down as keeping the fixated dipstick out of trouble, and me in practice.

  • coyote3

    Come on pendejo, give me an example of how I misrepresent the constitution. I want an actual example, factual. Not just an accusation. The patriot act has nothing to do with it, one way or the other. The patriot act has not been found to be unconstitutional. I guess you missed that one. If you have the right to call it unconstitutional, I have the right to call medicare unconstitutional as well. You just can't handle it because you can't debate the issue.

  • coyote3

    I don't know, the Nazi's had and still have a lot of support. The military tribunals worked just fine. We “did” need to put their conduct under a microscope.

  • coyote3

    Really think a lot of yourself don't you guerdo? More unsubstantiated claims. I.Q. higher than anyones' here??? Sounds like the guys the guys in jail.

  • coyote3

    These are good things?

  • coyote3

    No, didn't insinuate, I am a retired USBPS agent (Border Patrol). So, I have spoken with plenty of people in jail. They all think they are smarter than everyone else. I never said you have been in prison, just sound like it. . If you think that constantly being incorrect is correcting then I'll accept that (Lo que no oida, lo inventa, every time)

  • kbond

    This, like everything the O admin can dish out, is a travesty and again, a disgrace.

    O obviously wants to feel accepted by one billion Moslems world-wide, rather than to be accepted by 300 Million AMERICANS!! He is not an American. He is a sham. And yet all the liberals and mass media and hollywood elitists raise him up on a high pedestal. What a travesty.

    It's all hypocricy gone wild.

  • LucyQ

    Linda, David Horowitz in this article said “we are at war with Islam.” I don't know about you but wars are won by killing the enemy and/or making the enemy submissive to the winner.

    The G-d I'm familiar with is against murdering innocent children, women and men as we are doing in Iraq and Afghanistan by killing hundreds of thousands of human beings who had nothing to do with 911. I don't know about your G-d, but the G-d of the Original Testament is against murdering innocents. Is your G-d for it?

  • Lary9

    My, my, my. Everybody has an opinion. Has anyone here actually been in a foreign war? Been in the line of fire? Applied the rules of engagement on the fly? How about heard a 7.62mm round from an AK-47 assault rifle whiz by your ear? I've found that the loudest, most rude critics of command-under-fire are the silver-star-wanna-bees! The armchair soldiers who never served anywhere but the local bowling alley bar. But then… I could be wrong.

  • Lary9

    You're missing the whole point here. I'm not advocating my position because
    I think it's soft on these detainees. I loathe these valueless monsters but
    I know how they think. When Bush went into Iraq that was just what al Qaeda
    wanted. Now if we try these guys as covert partisans in a military court
    that will be just what al Qaeda and the Muslim Brotherhood want too. Can't
    you see this? Doesn't anyone else on this blog '*get this' *idea?

  • http://twitter.com/miss911ninja Sandra Childs

    It occurred to me reading your post that although “the jury selection process must not exclude or intentionally narrow any particular group of people,” the Islamist defendants are likely to object to women serving on the jury. That will be one of the first assaults on our system as the games begin.

  • bushlikesdick12

    what part of my language is filthy?

  • bushlikesdick12

    You probably have a point there

  • LucyQ

    I don't know what you're afraid of, Cowboy. Do you honestly think Americans will want to become terrorists? What is wrong with letting a terrorist try and defend himself in America?????

    I didn't know you had allowed your brain to be so thoroughly washed, again and again by extremists. I have absolutely no fear that Americans will suddenly sympathize with those terrorists or want to become terrorists.

    Obviously, you think the masses are very stupid or you think the democratic system of justice is stupid or both, reflected by your extreme position on this.

    I am so glad that my people, after the Shoah which murdered six million innocents, allowed the Nazi trial to be held with all the microphones in the world, on all radios and forever documented on film and TV.

  • bushlikesdick12

    Well I am poncho.

    I am constantly having to give these idiots lessons in life.

    How many times have I had to correct you?

    You learn a lot from your mistakes in life but hopefully you learn not to make mistakes latter in life.

    I've never been to prison poncho — why don't enlighten me on that one.

    Oh wait a minute. You once insinuated that you are a federal officer.

  • bushlikesdick12

    We need to stop waterboarding people who live in the Bible belt states — if you cut off oxygen to the brain long enough, it causes brain damage.

    This is quite apparent in your case.

  • LucyQ

    Very well said. I get this idea. Terrorists fancy doing things in hiding, in the dark, and they don't fancy having the spotlight shine on them for even a second.

  • Lary9

    As Queequeg said in chapter 22 of 'Moby Dick'…”Holy whaleshit! They've got
    it by the tail now!”

  • Lary9

    Linda~ Verily, verily I say unto you that nine tallens shall change hange hands at the Temple Rock, nay not ten, nor shall it be eight, but only nine the number is, when the Prophet Melchoizadork shall recite the parable of the three swine of Zorkney, not large pigs, nor medium size either, forsooth, they be but little pigs that shall bring a lupine messenger on high to the place of the six sandals and huff and puff and…. awww Balderdash! Break out your Darwin, boys. Let's start quoting from the chapter on 'descent with modification' and the 'expectation of transitional fossil records'.

  • CowboyUp

    That's okay, I had plenty to spare, and people like you to make me seem brilliant no matter how many I lose.

  • bushlikesdick12

    You obviously have no experience city large city governments.

    I have pulled building permits in large cities all over the country, have had to deal with local unions, and what not.

    I have far more experience than you do when it comes to getting things done with people who have worked under Guliani.

    You are extremely nieve if you think that Guliani loses significant control of the city when his public life is over.

    This isn't Mayberry CowboyUp.

    Let me give you a real life example:

    A building inspector who works for one city in one particular district for 20 years develops an authority due to his enate knowledge of the structures and the people who own the structures in his particular district.

    After he retires, he will become what we call a deputy inspector.

    Now he is a private inspector hired by these people who own these buildings to meet the city requirements of having continued inspections for construction applications that require a bonded continued inspection.

    He charges a 4 hour minimum but only stays for a few minutes based on the fact that he either trusts you will do it right or he has been bribed to not watch.

    As a private inspector he is now far more powerfull than any city inspector could ever possibly dream of being. — even the city principle inspector

    I have a gut feeling inside me that you must be a high school kid or possilby in college learning some basics and havn't indulged in the real world yet.

    This may explain why you are only interested in titles and articles rather than the realities of the lessons of life.

    When you get older and learn the ropes of business and employment or maybe if you reach the level of success, you will understand what I am talking about— when you go to city hall and actually try to get something done.

    You will understand that it isn't the politicians that get things done. No they are the ones you have to pay to get them to go away.

    It is people like Guliani that you have to deal with in the public and private sector to get things done.

    Trust me —– trust me a lot on this one

    If some smuck in the city didn't want to grant me a permit, I would defeat him if he didn't have good cause.

    Guiliani, on the other hand, as a private citizen with public stature can stop me dead in my tracks.

    Some people learn this lesson and some don't

    Maybe you should be a teacher, fireman, or something that doesn't require you to operate at this level son.

  • CowboyUp

    Lol, that was the GOP Congress, and they had to drag wild bill along kicking and screaming, he never offered a balanced budget. He didn't think a balanced budget was possible (and it wouldn't have been if he had anything to do with it) until 2002 at the earliest, two years after he was gone, and $240+ billion a year in deficits 'til then. That's like wild bill taking or getting credit for welfare reform. It's hilarious if you remember what he and they said at the time. I feel bad for you that you can't.

  • CowboyUp

    Perfect.

  • bushlikesdick12

    Military courts are not kangaroo courts — they are designed for trying criminal acts within the military and crime acts commited by captured criminals within the adversary.

    The problem is there isn't a particular adversary we can group as the enemy and to imply that the religion of Islam is the enemy is stupid.

    Religeous fanatics such as people like you are at war with Islam not the U.S. Govt.

    Even Bush couldn't state that because it isn't true to the slightest.

    On your emotional level regarding spitting on the pride of a soilder that is the farthest from the truth as possible.

    It is an honor to be able to burn our flag. The day that we see people thrown in jail for burning our flag is the day we become like a communist state.

    Saying that, when our fireman become symbols of courage and we put them in such high regard that their opionions become higher than the rest of us, then we are no longer a dignified democracy.

    Soilders, many of them are not even U.S. Citizens, are not above firemen.

    What one particular soilder feels about being spitted on may be soup of honor to the next.

    As we see with the case with Senator Kerry — many vets dissagree with him throwing his medals away in protest — many are honored that they have fought to maintian his right to do so just like burning the flag

    The oxymoron here is you

    You claim to represent freedom but you spit on it when you think that we are spitting on certian soilders by practicing the freedoms that have been protected by us by the blood shedded from these soilders.

    You want to dictate that?

    You are very small

  • Lary9

    I agree with whatever bushlikesdick12 (why12?) says. Plus Rudi is so transparently and ravenously ambitious he makes Sara Palin look like a Sister of Charity.

  • Lary9

    Nevermind on the “(why 12?)”'. It just dawned on me.

  • KingofNorway

    Hey people. We have a lot more to be concerned about than a few jerks in turbins.

    http://www.examiner.com/x-27672-Portland-Politi

  • CowboyUp

    I grew up in Atlanta under Jackson, Campbell, etc…, yea, I know all about corrupt big city governments. The fact is, even though he is further left than I care for, Mayor G cleaned the place up more than anybody thought was possible, brought in more business and tourism, and improved city services. D*mn him, we could, an NYC has done far worse before and since. The old personal life attacks and his being far to the left of most of America are the only way to go with him.

  • CowboyUp

    Nonsense, they want almost any exposure they can get, other than them wussing out under light interrogation, or them being desecrated, humiliated, and dying slowly and painfully..

    There is nothing you could show about the 9/11 attack they don't want shown. It's a basic fact of terrorism, taught in the Warsaw Pact camps most of the pros were originally trained in. To fight it, you don't give their attacks publicity, even the carnage, you don't show people panicking over them, you don't give the terrorists or their cause legitimacy, you don't publicize the groups' demands, manifesto, or members (beyond recognition), you don't let it be known how they were caught, and you don't give them status they don't rate under the laws of war (which they are illegally waging), much less civil law. Simultaneously, you hunt them down and kill them any way you can. That's sound, long established, successful counter-terrorism, when it's followed.

    The Israelis wrote much of the book on it, though they don't always follow it themselves, and like anyone else, they pay for it when they don't. When educating yourself on the subject (I'll be doing so myself 'til the day I die), when you read counter-terrorism books that mention those points, pay attention. Counter-insurgency is nothing new either, though it must often be relearned as well. You're smart enough to learn, take the time to do so.

  • CowboyUp

    q lost big in Iraq, and it was logically the best place to engage them, and they obliged by putting so much into it. They got a humiliating public *ss whipping by us and the Iraqis, who also publicly rejected them. The terrorist enemy that posed the main threat in Iraq was always the mad mullahs. They have the resources and were training, arming, and infiltrating anybody on any side that would fight against the coalition and Iraqi government. Irrefutable proof of that (along with President Bush's resolve and the overall exemplary behavior of the coalition and brutality of the terrorists), was key in turning the tribes and government against the 'insurgency'.

    I get your idea, it's just wrong.

  • bushlikesdick12

    Then just between you and me, you should know when you are being punked!

    lol!!!!

  • KingofNorway

    “From the abundance of the heart, the mouth speaks.”

  • LucyQ

    Who is them, all 1.2 billion Muslims? I was under the impression we are trying to get and kill bin laden and al qaeda. If you want to kill all Muslims, you had better find at least one political party in the US who wants to send our young soldiers into all 78 Islamic nations to do your bidding.

    As of now, there isn't one party including independent ones that agrees with your foolish, unrealistic fantasy. You're sounding more and more like a Muslim, Cowboy. That's anything but a compliment.

  • bushlikesdick12

    Sniper,

    I have came to the conclusion that you are not only USMCSniper but that Vietnam Vet that pops up when you're not here, and that fat Dick (retired USMC) that showed up only once to scold me for calling you for what you are and now it appears you are this Jack Hampton asswipe.

    So far 4 people like this comment but me and one other have responded to your comment.

    You have a lot of unknown friends out here with a strange sense of good and bad:

    Your comment — the jury pool must include a cross section of the populaton — and — the selection process must not exclude or intentionally narrow any particular group.

    I find it strange that that many people on this website would agree with that especially when this website targets conservative Jews and Christians that seem to have a problem with everyone but themselves and finds it unAmerican to be otherwise.

    The O.J. trial was moved from Santa Monica to downtown L.A. because O.J's attorney was a lot smarter than the DA and knew he would have a substantial ratio of black jurors to select from — based on the defense case, that showed to be critical especially best known the racial background of detective Mark Fuhrman.

    'Where in NY could they possibly hold a trail to get an unsubstantiated amount fanatical Muslims to give the defendant an advantage?

    You are assuming that American Muslims will be bias.

    Do you have any historical evidence of this happening in the past in the U.S.?

    Or are you just making a gross bias remark — Sniper/Vietnam Vet/Mama's retired Marine Vet/ Jack-off?

  • CowboyUp

    Not all 1.2 billion muslims, but not just aq either. The terrorist 'family' is much wider than one or two groups or governments, though you could eliminate most of it by taking down five or six terrorist sponsoring governments.

    Yours is the foolish unrealistic fantasy of one or the other. We certainly could kill over 95% of the muslims without putting a boot on the ground, but that's not neccessary, and never has been. But millions of American and Israeli, along with your 1.2 billion muslim lives depend on them believing it. It's stupid to even court such a possibility.

    If you think the terrorists or their sponsors will show the same hesitation with employing WMD, you're in for a rude surprise.

  • CowboyUp

    Who's talking about Americans sympathizing with terrorists? I'm talking about basic counter-terrorism and avoiding a real bloodbath.

    The nazis and bushido were tried by a military tribunal after the war ended, and further resistance by nazi sympathizers was somewhere between uselessly suicidal and impossible. You're putting the ox in front of the cart, while playing into the terrorists' game, and helping keep the ones we haven't caught out there plotting and killing.

    For God's sake learn more about terrorism and counter-terrorism, and a little more detailed general history wouldn't hurt either. I've got to hit the hay, I hope some of this got through or at least piques your curiosity enough to go somewhere where it will and learn it.

    Oh yea, you can see the same basic mentality at work (and some the same procedures to counter it) with these domestic nuts that leave a manifesto and then go out and kill a bunch of people to get it and themselves publicized. The AJC, my local paper, gave one of those nuts his own section. And they wonder why this sh*t happens so much?

  • CowboyUp

    Thanks Jack, I just saw that. He is forevermore likesdick12.

  • CowboyUp

    I heard similar stories from my friends and family still in during the clinton years. I'm still ticked at the GOP for just letting much it happen in the '90s.

    People should have looked at the mess jimmy crack carter (I like that, I'm passin' it on to my fellow Georgians who'll probably pick it up as well) made of Georgia before they voted for him for President. I was embarrassed by how many Georgians who wouldn't vote for him again for Governor, voted for him for President. For them I can't even apologise.

  • CowboyUp

    Oh please, hiding behind our freedoms to destroy them is old
    hat. I'm not salutin' that red flag.

    Who's talking about Americans sympathizing with terrorists? I'm talking about basic counter-terrorism and avoiding a real bloodbath.

    The nazis and bushido were tried by a military tribunal after the war ended, and further resistance by nazi sympathizers was somewhere between uselessly suicidal and impossible. You're putting the ox in front of the cart, while playing into the terrorists' game, and helping keep the ones we haven't caught out there plotting and killing.

    For God's sake learn more about terrorism and counter-terrorism, and a little more detailed general history wouldn't hurt either. I've got to hit the hay, I hope some of this got through or at least piques your curiosity enough to go somewhere where it will and learn it.

    Oh yea, you can see the same mentality at work (and some the same procedures to counter it) with these nuts that leave a manifesto and then kill a bunch of people to get it and themselves publicized.

    “they are designed for trying criminal acts within the military and crime acts committed by captured criminals within the adversary” – can you clean that up or expand it? I'm not sure what you are trying to say there, you seem to be agreeing with me.

    Yea, I'm small, but a stick of dynamite is only 8″ tall.

  • Lary9

    Cowboy~ First time I've heard anybody suggest that al Q got their butts
    whipped in Iraq.

  • jackhampton

    coyote3
    The sad thing is this pathetic probably a convict really believe this crap. But he does know how to say MF really well. To bade some local agency can't nail him with 287G and send him back his phony intellect and all and his baby daddy.

  • jackhampton

    Lucy
    Number one the US military does not target innocent women and children not even innocent men. My God gave me the intellect and ability to defend my self and my family from a murderous death cult. These are the people that target innocents like they do on the buses and pizza shops and weddings in Israel or like they did on 9/11. It is the death cult muslims that is bombing the innocent intentionally. We have the right to self defense. I do not know if you have children or ever hope to but rest assured you are to a great degree safe compared to most of the world because men of courage and principal do what you do not have the courage to do. Wake up

  • jackhampton

    Lary9
    Yes I have heard plenty of 7.62 from AK's also plenty of 122's and B40's also RPG's as matter of fact they almost killed me along the Laotian border on my second tour in 1971. I was in a little dust up then called Lam Son 719. Also at places like Dong Ha Vandergrift. My home base was Camp Eagle but I was seldom there. I never saw a bowling ally but I saw the hospital in Japan and Ft. Campbell KY. What did you see?

  • CowboyUp

    You haven't been watching and listening, or you need to broaden your sources..

  • jackhampton

    Lary9
    You are missing the point if you had any military training you would know that the Geneva convention does not apply to ununiformed illegal combatants nor are we required by or criminal laws or US Code to bring them to a federal court of any kind by doing so gives them exactly what they want a platform to spew more propaganda for the whole world. It also places the people of New York in extreme danger. You are wrong about Bush doing what Al Queda wanted. They have lost most of there best and able in Iraq they are almost a non story there now.You very seldom hear anything about it at all. You also have the wrong impression you have it ass backwards but let me assure you the 11B's in Afganistan understand and there are fewer and fewer prisoners. They know next some moron will come up with the idea to let these scum file civil lawsuits. This is simply the absolute dumbest damn thing that any president has ever done.This after the imbicile supported and voted for the law that allowed these killers to be tried in a military tribunal. But the deaths that occur from terrorist attack over this stupidty will place the blood right on his hands and those that supported this.

  • jackhampton

    Cowboy
    I remember the SOB said it would take 10 years then the GOP won the Congress and balanced it. He also was forced to sign welfare reform stating when he did we will fix it after the election. People the ilk of Dickliker are brain dead and do not have a clue about facts.

  • jackhampton

    Likdicks
    You smoked to much crack. I was Army an 11B I do not know but one sniper in the military and he passed away last year. You are not worth the skin off of this mans genitals. I would wager there is not a roll of tin foil left with in a 50 mile radius of your domicile which is probably the YMCA. Now hit that crack pipe again prison punk lololol.

  • CowboyUp

    I guess they figure nobody's paying attention or have a memory span longer than a week. I guess most don't, because they've been pretty much getting away with it all my life. The info age is making it more difficult for them.

  • LucyQ

    I'm not in for a rude surprise because I don't equivocate citizens of the US with terrorists, period. The main difference between Israel and the US is that Israel lives in the ME.

    Israel's issue is self-defense even though the Bush team and the GOP are trying to destroy her. Obama and some of the Dems are trying to destroy Israel, too.

    You are sounding more and more like a Muslim because anyone who doesn't agree with your extreme views is an enemy of yours. That's as extreme as a Jihadi.

    When our wars are over and the truth comes out about how many innocent children, women (including pregnant ones) and men we intentionally killed, you're in for a rude surprise.

    G-d and rabbi Christo would agree with me, not you. Allah and Muhammed would agree with you.

  • LucyQ

    Do you have any idea how many innocent children, women and men we have intentionally killed in Iraq and Afghanistan because 19 dead Muslims did 911? Do you even have a ballpark figure? Do you even care what the number is?

  • jackhampton

    LucyQ
    Nuts.

  • jackhampton

    Lucy
    I will assure you I have a lot more of an idea than the prop-aganda you have swollowed because I have fought in war and have some understanding. I know GI's You have drank the bull crap koolaid. We have American military that die avoiding civilian deaths while the muslims do not give a damn. You might run that nonsense on someone that does not know better I do.

  • CowboyUp

    God would agree with what? That killing a couple hundred thousand mortal enemies now is worse than ignoring them until that number increases exponentially and includes millions of our own? Right.

    First you imagined I want to kill all muslims, now anybody that disagrees with my extreme views (the ones you're pulling out of thin air ARE extreme, but they're not mine) is an enemy? I think you're confused.

  • CowboyUp

    Perfect.

    I could have saved time and reduced my post to one word.

  • CowboyUp

    What a stud. I'm quakin', am I hid well?

  • LucyQ

    You should read Phyllis Chesler's article today. She describes you perfectly. How many handles are you using? I'm glad I don't live in utter fear every moment and total, self-absorbed anger at everyone who doesn't agree with me. Echoes bore me.

  • LucyQ

    I knew you didn't have a clue as to the number we intentionally killed including dropping hundreds of thousands of bombs down the fireplaces of innocent Iraqi families. I don't blame our military; I blame the total idiots we elect as leaders, who give our military their orders. I blame Reagan for giving nukes to Pakistan as well as arming and training bin laden, al qaeda and Hussein. Stop pretending you care how many innocents we kill.

  • jackhampton

    LucyQ
    I do not wish to be unkind but “I knew you didn't have a clue as to the number we intentionally killed including dropping hundreds of thousands of bombs down the fireplaces of innocent Iraqi families” Hundreds of thousands of bombs down fireplaces? This comments is absolute proof that you are an idiot and do not have a clue that is an insane comment and proves that nothing else you say is worthy of consideration. I truly hope you are on dope because the alternative is that you are crazy as an outhouse rat.

  • jackhampton

    Cowboy Up
    I believe the convict spent so much time in the joint he abused himself to the point he had to be institutionalized. Poor soul probably flogged himself blind.

  • CowboyUp

    Go back to your fantasy world, you are obviously confusing me with someone else, because you are attributing things to me that I haven’t said, so I must have multiple handles to justify your confusion. The only two handles I've ever used anywhere are Rifleman and CowboyUp, though there are others posting on my handle elsewhere.

    I am somehow full of all sorts of hatred, self-absorbed anger, fear, and desire for mass murder, because I think the lives 3000 murdered American men, women, and children are reason enough to end islamic terrorism as a threat to the USA or anyone else, before they kill any more Americans. That fool chesler is probably half your problem, I see she’s learned nothing in 40 years.

    All the shrinks in Vienna couldn’t come up with an effective answer to a nazi boot against their door, or a nazi rifle butt against their head. America had the answer, good thing you and phyllis weren’t around to stop us.

  • bushlikesdick12

    Hey jack-off Speaking of crack, you should contact the guiness world record for having the most crack between your butt checks ever.I'm proud of you today Jack-off. Sense I was addressing Sniper (and apparantly not you), then you are fully aware that there is currently only one jack-off on this website. Unless your mama pointed that out to you, I underestimated your level of intellect.Which brings me to my next subject:Why is it that all you can do is hurl insults and talk about yourself?Please notice the level of my dialogue includes the subject of the article at hand as well as citations from reliable sources along with my critical perspective and valid conclusions.You, on the other hand, just seem to make unsubstantiated claims with smartass rhetoric. could you tell me approx. where you live?

  • Lary9

    Good, Jack. Vets are vets and if we were enlisted in '66-'70 and paying
    attention, we all saw plenty. Mind if I ask what your hospital stay was
    for. I've been at the VA in Jersey rehabing young Iraqi vets since I
    retired in 2003.

  • Lary9

    jhampton~
    I understand your points. Incidentally, I never mentioned the Geneva
    Conventions. But you're wrong about precedent. We are required by the
    Constitution. Let's remember we weren't in Iraq or Afghanistan when these
    civilians from an al Qaeda cell in Hamburg, Germany committed homicide on
    over 3,000 Americans. The fact that the detainees are in Gitmo came after
    the fact. Look I hear you, but I still the public venue in spite of today's
    public numbers–76% prefer a military venue. As to your claim that NYC will
    be put in harm's way to greater extent, I disagree. They weren't
    even holding anything remotely like a trial when al Qaeda hit them in '93
    and again on 9/11 in 2001. NYC is already in their cross hairs; just like
    London, Madrid and Mumbai were. I'd rather be on the alert and know why and
    then have my 'eyes-on-principals' during the proceedings. It's won't matter
    in the end, when someone pulls switch or the plunger.

  • LucyQ

    War is horrible and brutish and that's why it should always be the last option, not the first. In war, innocents are killed and are usually the target.

    Do you think we only killed the Nazi and Japanese leaders? Is that why we firebombed Dresden and dropped nukes on Japan? This is what we do in war so grow up.

    My five year old son is more mature than you are. He knows all wars are horrible but sometimes necessary.

    Just what do you think the military term, “softening up,” means?

  • LucyQ

    When in doubt, go to the leftwing favorite-the Nazis. You ran out of ammunition a long time ago, Cowboy. You're the one in favor of the right/leftwing plan, to build new nations from the old ones for the terrorists…..nation-building.

    Now I understand why you obviously have no love life and 'real' friends where you live….you're it's my way or the highway abusive tone drives people away from you.

    When you were Rifleman, you were easy going and quite likable.

    In the meantime, we still need oil from the terrorists and will need even more oil from them to continue to invade their nations because 19 dead Muslims did 911.

  • bushlikesdick12

    The idea that no gentleman ever swears is all wrong. He can swear and still be a gentleman if he does it in a nice and benevolent and affectionate way. – Mark Twain

    I personally think we developed language because of our deep inner need to complain. ~ Jane Wagner

  • bushlikesdick12

    Dear God, There's something I wanted to ask you… what was all that thundering and lightening about last night ?~ Dennis the Menace

  • jackhampton

    Shrapnal from an RPG round and and gunshot wound to left thigh. Perforated ear drums from concussion and some how not sure to this day how but my left little toe.

  • bushlikesdick12

    Your accusation that congress passes laws that are unconstitutional only when that don't benefit your personal preference.

    i.e. you don't think the patriot act is unconstitutional because they are not spying on per say but anyone who may have a hostile attitude towards our governments policy.

    When the people feel an act is unconstitutional, we will vote in members of congress and a president that will agree with us and will nominate judges that share our expectations.

    You are starting to wittness this today!!

    The Patriot Act was created and renewed under the previous administration.

    Sense this has happened, we fired the promoters of this bill along with the Chief executive that signed it into law.

    So now that your favorite people are not running this country, all of sudden we are unconstitutional.

    Sorry to have tell you that the constitution in a democracy is only as good as the people who participate in it.

  • jackhampton

    The precedent is already there for military tribunals. Franklin Rossvelt set that stage. There presence in New York will make the place an even bigger target to tempting to pass up. Every damned expert on these killers all say the same thing this is simply the dumbest thing that has ever been done. Also military tribunals are very principaled. They are not some kangaroo court but ran with great deliberation and strict rules of evidence.

  • bushlikesdick12

    On paper, Bush and Ashcroft wield absolute dictatorship powers that can place Americans in jail without charges, for an indefinite period of time, without that guarantee of one phone call, without the guarantee of a lawyer, and without their loved ones knowing where they are and if they are all right. This is the stuff of which dictatorships are made and sustained! This is the terror wielded by the Kings of Britain and Europe over 200 years ago, from which our Founding Fathers fled, and against which they labored mightily to erect a government that could never, ever do this to American citizens.

    The USA Patriot Act gives Bush-Ashcroft exactly these type of dictatorial powers. However, most Americans have turned a deaf ear to our protestations, because they believe these dictatorial powers will only be used against those nasty Arabs following Osama bin Laden; most Americans steadfastly refuse to believe these powers would ever be turned against American citizens who had absolutely nothing to do with terror, or with Osama bin Laden, or with any criminal behavior.

  • bushlikesdick12

    You're babbling about nothing

  • jackhampton

    LucyQ
    I have forgot more about war than you will ever know. Germany and Japan were different types of war. It was total war where the dictators fascist had the support of the people all out war. The wars we are fighting are limited wars and our military go to great lengths to avoid civilian deaths and injury. You are a child that does not understand or either you are a paid schill for the terrorist. If we had dropped hundreds of thousands of bombs down fireplaces there would not be very many people left in Iraq. you are simply a fool or a tool.

  • bushlikesdick12

    we were actually shocked by the level of atrocities when our soilders first walked into these camps. We really had no idea of the extent of these mass murderers.

    We did know that Nazi's were putting them in death camps even before we entered the war and what is shocking is that we wouldn't allow boat loads of Jews to come into our country due to our immigration policy of not excepting anymore people due to not being able to care for the millions already suffering from the depression.

    We knew but we didn't really understand to how much of this was happening untill it was too late.

    Even if we did know, obviously, there wasn''t anything we could have done to stop it sooner.

  • jackhampton

    You have got to be joking! you are an insult simply by your stupidty and lack of basic knoledge. Oh and I could tell you exactly where I live. But we do not need any doped up stumble bum excons around here. I notice besides likedick you want to jack people off you really are disgusting and perverted I would tell you to get a grip but you keep referring to your moma and jacking off that is deviant and vile you should have more respect for your mother. No wonder your wife dumped you for another man.

  • jackhampton

    likesdick12
    The Patriot Act is still the law of the land. If you were as bright as you thought you were you would know we are not a demoracy but a constitutional Republic a nation of laws. The framers went to great lengths to prevent this nation from being a democracy which is basically mob rule. lolol what a stooge.

  • Don

    What? You mean Obama and Holder are NOT in power, but bush and ashcroft still are? Gosh, that WAS a clever dictatorial coup!

  • Lary9

    Glad you're still with us.
    Semper fi to you.
    L9

  • Lary9

    I know I'm in the minority opinion on this. I'm rethinking the issue based
    on all the input.
    L9

  • bushlikesdick12

    I'll attempt to read between your sarcasim and try to guess what you apparantly don't have the courage or character to just say:

    I'm assuming you are implying that now that we have a democratically controlled congress and executive branch, that the Patriot Act should easily be overturned eventhou it was found to be constitutional in the Supreme Court. (wow, AI do a good job representing and communicating your position don't I)

    I find it kind of strange Don that many on the website complain that I'm vulgar but yet I don't dance around and hide behind facades.

    Many of the act's provisions were to sunset beginning December 31, 2005, approximately 4 years after its passage. In the months preceding the sunset date, supporters of the act pushed to make its sunsetting provisions permanent, while critics sought to revise various sections to enhance civil liberty protections. In July 2005, the U.S. Senate passed a reauthorization bill with substantial changes to several sections of the act, while the House reauthorization bill kept most of the act's original language. The two bills were then reconciled in a conference committee that was criticized by Senators from both the Republican and Democratic parties for ignoring civil liberty concerns.[1] The bill, which removed most of the changes from the Senate version, passed Congress on March 2, 2006, and was signed into law by President George W. Bush on March 9 and 10, 2006.~~~~ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USA_PATRIOT_Act

    So basically, the Supreme Court has found the intent of the Bush Administration unconstitutional.

    The subject at hand, is should this terrorist be tried in a militray tribunal or a regular court and in reflection of this choice was the prior administrations unconstitutional policies set forth.

    The indifinate encarcenation of “combatant”detianees at Gitmo was also found to be unconstitutional during the previous administration as well —

    ~~On June 29, 2006, the Court issued a 5-3 decision holding that it had jurisdiction, that the administration did not have authority to set up these particular military commissions without congressional authorization, because they did not comply with the Uniform Code of Military Justice and the Geneva Convention (which the court found to be incorporated into the Uniform Code of Military Justice).[4]

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamdan_v._Rumsfeld

    This battle verses congress and the President “Hamdan v. Rumsfeld is continuing today and will for quite awhile, probably will be passed on to the next president.

    There three points I will make in rebuttal to your vague are sarcastic remark:

    1.The acts of the Bush Administration have been declared over reaching.

    2. Obviously, the acts of the prior administration affects the current adminstration considerably.

    3. Just because I present the rebuttal to a FPM article doesn't imply that I'm against these policies set forth by the Bush Administration.

    Conclusion:

    At the time of the 9/11 terrorist act, I too was extremely angry and expected vengence and justice towards the ones the perpurtrated these hideious acts.

    Furthermore, I didn't have a problem making a case out of going to war against Saddam based on faulty premises — even today I feel that that was an excellent message to send to our enemies ( that we are capable of turning into anything if needed). Very effective and I believe that strategy is probably the main reason why we haven't been attacked sense then.

    Even the Patriot act was appropiate at the time. The aggressiveness and character of this Hawkish behavior towards terrorism is exactly what we needed at the time.

    The problem I have is Bush's alliance with the Right Wing Christian Coalition and his remarks of claiming a Crusade ( insinuating against Islam as a whole).

    During most of Bush's Administration Bush demostrated a tremendous amount of arrogance which emulates ignorance which he obviously has no shortage of.

    When addressing the extremist during this period, the fragrant arrogance and the permission to behave in a deceitfull way became intolerable to the moderates and likes of people like myself that do not claim to be liberal nor conservative and do not necessarily belong to a particular party.

    I was extremely embarrassed with Bush's banner of “mission accomplised” while he was wearing a flight jacket knowing he was too chicken shit to actually fight in Vietnam ( Daddy got him into the Air National Guard — we can assume).

    Then his Hurrincane Katrina Golf trip really pissed me off.

    Then, of course, his negligence ( which of course Clinton is responsible too) of preventing the economical meltdown we have today by maintaining the conservative policies of not regulating the securities and banking standards. — Alan Greenspan holds most the blame here but he is a Republican appointee with a conservative idealogy.

    In consideration of all these facts, I started to lean left for the purpose of creating more balanc in the house and Supreme Court.

    In seeing our reputation being severly tarnished in the process, I slowly became disenchanted with the whole Republican Party.

    Then of course what threw me over the edge was the vindictive bipartisan politics introduced to me through the likes of Fox, Limbaush, and so forth.

    So there you go Don.

    Now our President recently announced that our reputation has been restored

    Like I believe that as much as I believe that our economy has improved at the great expence of our deficit.

    The deficit, in my opinion, is completely unavoidable — the banking bailout happened on Bush''s watch and fact that no strings were attached to this money — Bush is the one that could have admended it if he chose to.

    Congress had to act fast to prevent a meltdown and the complexities designed into passing laws had to be overruled but Bush doesn't have that excuse — he is a one man show in the White House and it was much easier for him to make the necessary changes to reintroduce this bill.

    Bottom line, Bush is responsible for the current economical crises by giving the banks so much money with no strings attached. As a result, the banks are holding out on the American people by waiting it out (not willing to take a risk) thus starving out our people by not giving loans thus putting us back to work.

    As you see, construction is getting hit the hardest.— no loans to build.

    You would think developers would want to take advantage of the low cost of labor and real estate, but no — banks are giving loans right now.

    So how would a Republican President react to our current economical issues — not much different.

    So yes, Don, the impact of the Bush Administration will effect us for decades not years.

    Ecuse me if I don't check my spelling but I have made my case far more than your willing to acknowledge already.

    Cheers,

    Bushlikedick

  • bushlikesdick12

    If you would bother to followup on the current status of the Patriot Act, You will see that much of it was overturned due to the constitutionality of it being overreaching. Bushlick then had to sign the new version which is still being debated in the Supreme Court as petitioners continue thier effort to control the government snooping into our personal business with the excuse of giving the govt. the benefit of the doubt of accusing anyone of being a terrorist while the term of who is a terrorist is still debated likewise.

    i.e the example of the claim of this article:

    Indefinite detention is the incarceration of an arrested person by a national government or law enforcement agency without a trial. It is a controversial practice on the part of any government or agency that is in violation of many national and international laws, including human rights laws[1]. In recent years, governments have indefinitely held those suspected to be involved in terrorism, declaring them as enemy combatants.
    ~~ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indefinite_detention

  • reneekelly

    Hey – all this trash talk is offensive and pointless to most of us who check in to read articles and comments here. Lay off the gutter language and treat other people with some basic decency, no matter how strongly you disagree with their viewpoints. There are plenty of places on the web to trash talk each other. Get your brain out of the gutter please.

  • CowboyUp

    Go To Bottom, Starting a new thread

  • CowboyUp

    LucyQ

    Now I’m a lonely unhappy lefty, on top of being a hateful muslim. I don’t know where you think (or are you just feeling?) you get a clue about my ammo supply, love life, or friends, the latter two being completely irrelevant to the discussion, because you’re just blasting away with your eyes closed to keep from addressing my posts. Don’t quit your day job to headshrink.

    You claimed to not understand why anyone would have a problem trying ksm as a civilian, I told you, you asked me to elaborate and I did. Then you went on a headshrink tangent and claimed I thought “the democratic system of justice (Whatever that is, never heard of it, myself.) is stupid.” I elaborated further, implored you to look into it further, and that thread of your post ended.

    On this thread you said basically aq doesn’t want, or won’t like the publicity of a public trial. That’s nonsense, and I told you why. Then you started back with the headshrinking (and my incredulous amusement somehow becomes fear and anger), imagining things you thought I said, and trying to change the subject.

    If I said some of the things you have in your spacey moods (like now), my friends would be ridiculing me too, just not as gently as I am you. We’ve apparently got thicker hides down here.

  • jackhampton

    Cowboy
    I gave up on her after the “hundreds of thousands of bombs down the fireplace of innocent Iraqis comment” I realized she does not have any idea about war or how it is waged certainly no experience or she is simply a liar for the muzzies one or the other. Or like that moron from Washington state that threw herself in front of a bulldozer.

  • bushlikesdick12

    I here ya and agree with you. But humor me for a minute.There are a lot of lies and misrepresentations in the articles at hand and whenever you have a lot of deceit and appeasement to these distortions, you will find characters of a lower class.I've never seen your screen name but that doesn't mean you are not other screen name. Assuming that, and assuming that you have read many of my non abusive and responsible rebuttals to the subjects at hand, then you should know that the ones that I have indecent verball exchanges with are the ones that start hurling insults first while not even responsibly addressing my rebuttal. They too can ignore me. How often do you see me abusively attack someone for no reason or for just having an absurd opinion? —never I hope. If I did, then I need to apologize which I have done in the past. Let us look at Jack Hampton for example. He has been rude from the get go and yet he trolls around trying to get people to ignore my claims while attacking my position at every turn.So you want to correct my behavior?That is okay, I'll take your advice for now.I remember a few years back when I behaved like a "Jesus freak type Christian"for the purpose of promoting tolerance on this website. I had this guy named "Hispano man who lived in Mexico who assumed that I was this innocent little Christian that wouldn't hurt a fly. So the coward decided to ripp on my religion and my character as well with the appeasement of the motely crue of posters at that time.So, in a very crude way ( he must have been a Mexican living in Mexico at the time) I told him in so many words that I would pay him $10.00 per hour to dig me a ditch along the Mexican border.Well he took to such offense to that that he never came back to FPM.As far as the rest of the posters, they couldn't believe how cruel that was and lamblasted me similar to what jack does untill they eventually went away. (these characters eventually resign their own position and eventually stop posting on FPM)What I can't understand is why so many of you find me so absurd for deliverying an opposing point of view while I become combative when attacked?I'm simply mirroring yourselves in my opinion.Thank you for your time.

  • CowboyUp

    No, that's not enterely true, JackHampton, she makes a lot of sense when she talks about Israel (other than her apparent hatred of the GOP over American policies toward Israel), and sometimes she comes up with very interesting angles on things. I think she just has a very spotty knowledge of history and warfare, doesn't understand the thinking of terrorists, is a bit emotion oriented, and posts when she's tired (mea culpa). Sometimes I wonder if it's my posts she's responding to (I've done that myself as well).

    Her notion of fighting seems to be like my youngest sister's, hit them back once and wait to see what they do. That didn't work on the playground, and it sure won't work against terrorists and their sponsors. Proportionate response only perpetuates the violence and kills more in the end. Overwhelming response most often ends violence, and discourages others from violence.

    She's been posting here at least as long as I have, so I'm fond of her, even though she unintentionally cracks me up a lot.

  • coyote3

    If you would bother to read, you would see that you are lying about what I said. I never said whether the patriot act was unconstitutional or not. I said it had not been found to be unconstitutional.. That is not misrepresentation, parts of it were, but the act itself still stands, and is being used by this administration.. You didn't quote the statutory language or refute a thing I said, because you can't. Again, if you believe there is no constitutional basis for the patriot act, then you are free to assert that position, just as I am free to do the same with medicare, etc. In fact, I did criticize Bush for unconstitutionally expanding, the program.

  • bushlikesdick12

    Here ya go Sara,

    While I was writting my previous response to you, this response popped up into my mailbox. First here is what he was responding to:

    IIf Sara Roy is so illigitimate as an academic scholar in the feilds she claims, then why bother even writting an article about her? I would understand why you would want to bring attention to the bias towards Israel but this Sara shouldn't have any sort of concern to anyone if she has no clue.

    Do you think anyone of significance cares what Horowitz thinks — I don't.

    What are Horowitz's qualifications?

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    That is what I wrote! Exactly what was in that comment that you find so offensive and full of trash?

    Is my opinion of Horowitz any different than how the author talks about of the person at hand?

    Now read the response I got from him:

    antifascist18 wrote, in response to bushlikesdick12:

    Hey Bozo,

    Your ignorance is showing, and by the way, do learn how to spell. Sounds like you're a typical brain dead fascist or muslim. Either way, makes no difference.

    I'll tell you what Renee,

    If you think a Muslim should be insulted by this then you deserve some benefit of the doubt:

    If I start seeing you or someone of another screenname correct people of likes of this then I will change my screen name to ~~ObamaCares~~ instead of ~~~BushlikesDick~~~

    I promise to do this after a week of defending my non-trashy and responsible comments.

    But if the attacks of the likes of these don't stop under my new unprovoking screen name, then I will expect a public retraction of your statement along with an apology.

    Agree?

    You're just plain stupid.

  • bushlikesdick12

    I apoligize for the typo,

    I noticed that somehow ~you are just plain stupid~ somehow got into the ending of my comment to you.

    That was pasted from the other guys comment and wasn't directed toward you

    Sorry about that

  • bushlikesdick12

    The remark ~~ you are just plain stupid~~ was at the end of his remark. somehow, I got my words sandwiched between his

  • jackhampton

    Cowboy
    I will take your word for it. Someone needs to explain to her had we dropped hundreds of thousands of bombs down fireplaces with the accuracy of mordern munitions there would hardly be one scorched stone or brick left standing and not very many people.

  • jackhampton

    This seems to be a reasonable post I would normally not respond but I will to this one. Your assertion that I some how attacked you first is a lie. I do not agree with you but I did not attack you first. This post reveals a lot a child like mentality mommy he hit me first and it also says that you have more personalities than EVE. There is a term for that sort of disorder but look it up it will give you something to do. By the way people with multiple personality disorder are quite often violent against women and others they believe defenseless. You try to make an excuse as to what your handle represents when you know full well the vulgar implication. I learned in 20 years of dealing with hardcore felons that most reoffend and you do not help or deter them by being timid they sense weakness and bully and abuse if left to there own devises.

  • bushlikesdick12

    You remind of an electrician I had on one of my jobs who use to also be a prison guard. He had to retire early due to the stress. ( actually he had a temper problem that was apparantly brought on by his job)

    But one thing was certain, he never loss his prison mentality. Yea everything is a oneupmanship game for him and he became one the most combative employees (subcontractor) ever.

    The only thing he understood was corruption, getting kickbacks and doing things that normal people wouldn't do such defy authority and lived in an environment where convicts make the rules amoung themselves.

    (He was a pretty good electrician thou — He caught a huge mistake my client made — like shipping out about 50 light fixtures that didn't match our Title 4 requirements. I have to give that to him!)

    Basically, he became a product of his environment and carried it into mine.

    I get a lot of your clients in my business. Construction is one of the highest paying industries that úsually doesn't do an extensive background.

    Organized crime in the construction unions have a large contribution to that as well.

    It is one of the few occupations/trades where you can literally walk onto a job and just need to show your I.D. and your SS# and sound like you know what you are talking about.

    ( that has changed a lot in the recent years — we require them to fill out appliations now with the question if they have ever be convicted. in some cases we will follow up on that question but for the most part, we just use it as a disclaimer and don't follow up on it)

    That is one of the reasons why construction jobs have the highest ratio of theft.

    If they know we have expensive tools in the container, they will know someone that will steal it.

    has happened to me more than once. It doesn't take much to deal with a security guard.

    You must be pretty nieve is you make the assumptions you are making now.

    Did you do that when you were a guard?

    Man-o-man?

    Is it you that call me a stooge?

    You know what the ring leader does when he wants to frame someone — he uses someone like you as a stooge to misinform you about thier target.

    All I have to do is act like your friend on-line and lie about someone else or a subject and I'll have you feeding out my hand in no time.

    You should be gratefull that I'm who I am — at least I'm standing in front of you in plain light!

    You know what I'm going to do to your silly ass?

    ( not really— you are already too much a waste of my time)

    I'm going to use another disguise (screen name) and play the role of somebody that is as psycotic as you and be your best buddy. Then my evil twin is going to sneak up behind you and give you a rude awakening.

    You can call me what you want but Jack Nickleson knows good acting when he sees it.

    Anyway,

    Regardless if Rene takes up my offer or not, I'm done with you. You can follow me around this website and shoot your fat mouth all you want for now on and it is only going to display your own demeanor.

    Unless of course, you can hold water in a debate of course.

    From what I can see, you can only act rude.

    Cheers

  • jackhampton

    All anyone has to do is read your last response and they will understand how deranged you are. The only thing that you might contract is a venereal desease. lol. Like I said I locked up hundreds like you. I ran an FFJ section for the last eight years before I retired. Now I must really be bored responding to a a lunatic. All people have to do is read your rambling nonsensical comments above it tells the whole story. You fancy your self some grand intellect and master of all things The sad part is you are more than likely off of some badly needed medication. But I hope no harm comes to you when they come to take you back to the nice place where they give you the coloring books and crayolas and ask you to draw something nice. Good luck with your fantasy world hehehe.

  • jackhampton

    I also forgot to add you exhibit all the signs of a malignant narcissist which is very compatible with criminal behaviour. You fancy yourself as some master manipulator when in all probability you are angry because all you can manipulate is some guys zipper in a bathroom stall at a bus station.

  • CowboyUp

    She does get way out there sometimes, I just assume she's tired. I've also often thought she's sometimes posting things she hears or reads in passing and agrees with, because she can't seem to discuss or expand on some things she puts out there.

  • jackhampton

    You are probably right sometime I am not the most patient as you can tell wit my verbage with the resident convict but that has about run it's course. Stay cool.

  • bushlikesdick12

    I'm not going to argue with you over the semantics of each others words if we can't even agree on the intent of our meanings.

  • LucyQ

    Really!

  • jackhampton

    Yep AQ got there asses kicked big time in Iraq all there leaders killed and them just about wiped out even the old traitors like Harry(the war is lost Reid) and the idiot Nancy Ploser has had to admit these facts.

  • Lary9

    You throw that word “traitor” around so frivolously that I wonder what you
    would call someone who was actually a bonafide traitor instead simply a
    congressman with whom you disagree. That kind of political pre-pubescence
    will come back to bite you. Tighten up your rhetoric and cut back on the
    coffee.

  • jackhampton

    No I do not throw that word around much but when I do I mean it. Funny thing though the coffee pot did blow up after 11 years so I went and bought a new Cuisnart. Harry will not be back he will not get reelected. Hopefully there will be a nice prison cell some place next to Jefferson for him. He has to be the the worst weasel I have ever encountered in my life. Well John Murtha is probably worse. They should have prosecuted him over ABSCAM he just slid by. Then there is Dick the Turbin Durbin, If I could I would still put Teddy Kennedy in prison. He sent a letter to the Pope by Obama and received no reply.

  • Lary9

    Happy Thanksgiving to y'all. L9

  • Nick in Virginia

    “…because the 9/11 attackers targeted civilians they should be tried as civilians.”

    I guess the Pentagon does not count as a military installation?

    Holder/0bama are being real idiots on this issue. And the best thing the 0bama administration could do is keep Holder off camera, because both Kyl and Graham spanked him in the Senate hearings.

    30 years ago there was a documentary called “The 3 Rs: Reading, (W)riting, and Reefer”, in which they asked one of the high-school potheads named “Stoner” if he did anything productive while he was stoned. In a spaced-out voice he replied, “Noooo, I don't think so”.

    That was Holder when Graham asked him if the US had ever done anything like this before.

    As I said, idiots.

  • JOHN GREEN

    Send the FBI, Sheriffs, and the NYPD to lunch and set them free on the streets of Manhatten. Lets move on to things of more importance…….

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/brian_h7694 Brian H

    Attacking civilians and dressing as a civilian is termed "Perfidy" by the Hague Conventions, and absolves forces suppressing such attackers of blame for civilian casualties. They have no rights as combatants or, indeed, any rights whatsoever.