The Anti-Israel Lobby


J Street has gone over to the dark side. It claims to be “a pro-Israel, pro peace lobby.” It has now become neither. Its Executive Director, Jeremy Ben-Ami, has joined the off key chorus of those who falsely claim that Israel, by refusing to make peace with the Palestinians, is placing the lives of American soldiers at risk.

This claim was first attributed to Vice President Joe Biden and to General David Petraeus. It was quickly denied by them but continued to have a life of its own in the anti-Israel media. It was picked up by Steven Walt and John Mearsheimer, Pat Buchanan and others on the hard right and hard left who share a common disdain for the Jewish state. It is the most dangerous argument ever put forward by Israel bashers. It is also totally false.

It is dangerous for two reasons. First, it seeks to reduce support for Israel among Americans who, quite understandably and correctly, care deeply about American soldiers being killed in Iraq and Afghanistan. Israel has always understood this and that’s why it is one of the few American allies who has never asked the United States to put its troops in harm’s way in defense of Israeli citizens. If Americans were to believe the falsehood that Israel were to blame for American deaths caused by Islamic extremists in Iraq and Afghanistan, support for the Jewish state would suffer considerably.

It is also dangerous because its implication is that Israel must cease to exist: the basic complaint that Muslim extremists have against Israel is not what the Jewish state does, but what it is: a secular, non-Muslim, democracy that promotes equal rights for women, gays, Christians and others. Regardless of what Israel does or doesn’t do, its very existence will be anathema to Muslim extremists. So if Israel’s actions were in fact a cause of American deaths in Iraq and Afghanistan–which they are not–then the only logical solution would be Israel’s disappearance. This might be acceptable to the Walts, Mearsheimers and Buchanans of the world, but it is surely not acceptable to Israel or anyone who claims to be pro-Israel.

Finally, the argument is totally false as a matter of fact. At the same time that Israel was seeking to make peace in 2000-2001 by creating a Palestinian state on the West Bank and in Gaza with a capital in East Jerusalem, Al Qaeda was planning the 9/11 attack. So Israel’s “good” actions did nothing to make America safe from Islamic terrorism. On the other hand, when Israel took tough action against Gaza last year in Operation Cast Lead, Israel’s “bad” actions did not increase American casualties in Iraq and Afghanistan. In fact, there is absolutely no relationship between Israel’s actions and the extent of American casualties. It is a totally phony argument based on equal parts of surmise and bigotry.

Yet this dangerous and false argument, which is being hotly debated within the Obama Administration, has now received the imprimatur of J Street. In the letter to the New York Times on April 21, 2010, Jeremy Ben-Ami, speaking on behalf of J Street, included the following paragraph:

“An analysis of the Obama administration’s calculus on Middle East policy should reflect that many in the Jewish community recognize that resolving the conflict is not only necessary to secure Israel’s future, but also critical to regional stability and American strategic interests.”

Although Ben-Ami doesn’t explicitly make a direct connection between Israeli actions and American casualties, his use of the phrase “critical to…American strategic interests,” is a well-known code word, especially these days, for the argument that there is a connection between Israeli actions and American casualties.

In lending support to that dangerous and false argument, J Street has disqualified itself from being considered “pro-Israel.” The argument is also anything but “pro peace,” since it will actually encourage Islamic extremists to target American interests in the hope that American casualties will be blamed on Israel. It will also encourage the Palestinian leadership to harden its position, in the expectation that lack of progress toward peace will result in Israel being blamed for American casualties.

Truth in advertising requires that at the very least J Street stop proclaiming itself as pro-Israel. As long as it was limiting its lobbying activities to ending the settlements, dividing Jerusalem and pressing for negotiations, it could plausibly claim the mantle of pro-Israel, despite the reality that many of its members, supporters, speakers and invited guests are virulently anti-Israel. But now that it has crossed the line into legitimating the most dangerous and false argument ever made against Israel’s security, it must stop calling itself pro-Israel. Some of its college affiliate groups have already done that. They now describe themselves as pro peace because they don’t want to burden themselves with the pro Israel label. J Street should follow their lead and end its false advertising. Or else it should abandon its anti-Israel claim that Israel is damaging American strategic interests.

  • gamalpha

    pro-peace is wrong too because the consequence of their ideology will be war.

    • Joseph

      My daughter recently married a Jewish man and I am proud to be associated wIth the Jewish people and Israel in this way. However I am concerned when my community-Los Angeles-begins to ponder the question: Has Israel become a strategic liability for the U.S.? This is a direct result result of the Gaza situation and their harsh treatment. at the same time there is even a questioning whether the Iraq war was fought for the benefit of the U.S. Or rather for Israel. This is not the time to rely on past events to justify it's current policy with the Palestinians but rather examine whether it's actions are consonant with a moral, ethical, and just society that can serve as a beacon for other emerging nations seeking a model society.

  • Informer

    time or an open hunt season…those scumbags need to vanish…by all means! enough being polite.,..kill bastards! up to…enough. they do not get it otherwise ,only death will stop scum like street! kill them!

    • Toma

      Traitors and cowardly collaborators all of you!He is calling for the killing of American citizens and all of you keep quiet,thefore silently agreeing with him!This seditious rightwing treason needs to end.

      • http://intensedebate.com/people/aspacia aspacia

        Toma,

        I am not affiliated with any political party, and vote my conscience.You ad fallacious hominem attacks are neither helpful nor enlightening.

        Who is calling for for the murder of American citizens?

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/aspacia aspacia

      I hate to say this, but it is either this or expulsion to any land that will take them, and not too many will. Their brethren will not accept them; the Jordanian king expelled Arafat.

  • Anon

    Good.

  • solemnman

    J street was formed as part of the left"s strategy to infiltrate and divide from within.The involvement of George Soros should have made that clear from the beginning.

    • Ze-ev ben Yehudah

      Hear Hear.

  • visitor

    I think it is Prof. Dershowitz who has gone off the deep end. Recognizing that it is in America's interest to put an end to the Arab-Israeli conflict is NOT the same as asserting that Israel has no right to exist.

    If as we learn in Talmud that the first Temple was destroyed because of idol worship and the second because of senseless hatrred between the various factions of the day (e.g., Zealots killing those they regarded as insufficiently militant against Rome), what will be the fate of our Third Commonwealth if our liberal and conservative factions treat each other as the main enemy?

    The Likud does not have a monopoly on truth.

    • Ze-ev ben Yehudah

      But "Oh Boy " I'm glad that Likud is in power an Netanjahu its president.
      One tuf cooky to deal with.

    • rac

      Professor Dershowitz is right on the money! It might be that it is you who has gone of the deep end and into the dark ages! It is in American's interested to strongly support Isarel, America only true ally in the Middle East and elsewhere as a matter of fact. But your hatred against Israel blinkers every bit of common sense. Remember the that Islamist slogan, "Israel is the small Satan and America is the big Satan'" Indeed Israel is in the front line defending not only her own survival but also freedom and democracy for us all.

      Don't worry America Israel is behind you despite Obama bowing to the Arab and Muslim world. Obama will pay for his wicked plans.

      "I will bless those who bless you, and whoever curses you I will curse; and all peoples on earth will be blessed through you." Genesis 12:3

      'That's how it goes, every body knows'……

  • rib/eve

    You folks are confusing rational thinking with agenda. Lying is quite acceptable. Remember the ends justify the means to these creatures.

  • Stephen D.

    Visitor, You sound like you respect "Truth" well sir, tell me please; Why is it that these folks don't mention that the people in Gaza (there is no such thing as "Palestinians") were offered 97% of their demands for "Peace" and refused it! Why is this never an issue? Why is it that Israel is the bad guy in this? Saying that Israel is the one against a settlement is false. They don't want peace because then they would have no cause to continue with their false claims of oppression when those (non-Jews) in Israel enjoy more freedoms than in ANY OTHER Islamic country. How is Israel the bad guy!?! Make sense of this please.

  • Toma

    therefore

    • Jacob

      Methinks 'Informer' is Toma's sockpuppet.

  • Ze-ev ben Yehudah

    In torbe trog ikh um mayn kholem,
    vos ikh hob oyfgehoybn fun dem shtoyb.
    Bin ikh den bloyz a moshl – un mesholem
    Zaynen oykh der shparber un di toyb?…….3 in total from yiddish;translated.

    In my sack I carry around my dream
    that from the dust I lifted up above.
    Am I but a parable – and parables
    as well the sparrow hawk and dove?

    The bloodthisty flock demands salvation too,
    the sheep let themselves be torn,but they await
    the prophesied time,when the wild beast will
    take them on her back,mild and compassionate.

    The yearned-for hour of deliverance must come.
    But what will happen to the blood spent,
    the innocent blood the earth has absorbed
    trough all generations to this very moment?.
    Itzik Manger.
    And anew the flock that follows the wild beast is growing out of proportion.
    The beast of antisemitism is after Jewish flesh,the only one he likes to
    devour.What yesterday was your most faithful friend has now become an
    bitter enemy.And where do you carry beastly meat? Yes ! in wagons only for
    beast food.Soon they will role,like once before, from their hiding places.

  • AL.
  • interact

    I find it unbelieveable that so few contributors have bothered to look to the past to realize the direction these "peaceniks" will take – in the name of expedience and at the expense of "jews" – all over the world.

    I would venture to guess the percentage of those liberals who have actually served in our armed services is quite miniscule and those who have been on the front even smaller still, leaving them with absolutely no reality as to the enormity of dangers we are facing.

    Wake up!!! America has become the friend of those who would sacrafice Israel at any cost. The inability to recognize the realities inherent to current "popular opinion" particularly by the the liberal "Obama" / "Clinton" jews – parallels the European situation leading to and throughout the second world war for minorities .

    We truly are in deep shit maybe it's because the "intellectuals" have their heads so far up their anal cavity that they've lost their moral compass..

    • rib/eve

      to be a liberal is to have no moral compass. Besides I learned the other day, that these people are illiberals, not liberals. It's always bothered me to call them liberals. And statist just doesn't quite make it either.

  • Funny, That!

    Honestly, I wouldn't have a problem with Palestine if it wasn't for HAMASS, GOD DAMN FUCKERS. I have respect for Fatah, the other half of Palestine, they're good at handling the conflict and peace, but unless both sides get their shit together, I'm going with Israel.

    • Democracy First

      Well, I wouldn't allow youtself to be fooled by Fatah. It is they who thwarted peace for years, long before Hamas was crated or gained any power. Arafat, you will recall, never even bothered to counteroffer the year 2000 Barak-Clinton offer of 97% of what the Palestinian had been demanding. He just walked and started a second terrorist war, aka intifada. It is Fatah whose media is indistinguishable in its anti-Semitism from Nazism itself. It is Fatah's educational system that hangs posters of suicide bomber martyrs in elementary schools, and whose text book maps show only Palestine and no ISrael. And so on.

      The difference between Hamas and Fatah is that one is explicit in its goal to see ISrael dead and Jewry worldwide massacred, while the other is more discrete, playing the political game for international approval and MONEY.

      • http://intensedebate.com/profiles/unextremist Unsuppressed View

        I know Arafat's reign, he's far dead now, now they have a more respectable leader…

        Can you please elaborate on Fatah's educational system? And I thought the members of Fatah were semites?

      • Sign This

        I know Arafat's reign, he's far dead now, now they have a more respectable leader…

        Elaborate / give sources on the educational system.

        Fatah's members are semites, they're Arabs.

        • zsa zsa

          Fatah recentely named a square after a terrorist who bombed an Israeli bus and killed many people including children. Educate yourself.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/aspacia aspacia

      Abbas' dissertation is Holocaust Denial. Real honest peace brokers my ass. Read their government run media for insight. MEMRI is illuminating.

  • Neil

    The question that I pose to Professor Dershowitz is will you go out and beat the drum to support the president's re-election in 2012? You knew, or should have known, where he stood politically. Regardless, you went all out to support his candidacy in 2008, totally ignoring his (released) record and his known friends and associates on the far, far left. You're part of the reason that "J Street" has so much pull with this administration.

    • http://www.thefathatcat.vox.com Mad Jewess

      Neil, let us hope that Prof. Dershowitz has seen the light.
      I know how frustrating it is when we see our people voting in a person with a middle name of Hussein.
      If Prof. Dershowitz is standing up for Israel, we can hope and pray that he will also read again, David Horowitz book Radical Son, then he will see that his past is not brilliant and has harmed America and Israel, and if G-d willing he repents, we will have another fighter against the total soviet takeover of America.

    • http://www.analysis-knowledge.com/msgTeaching.htm Dr. Sanford Aranoff

      We must investigate why intelligent professors like Dershowitz made such a serious error voting for Obama. We must investigate what Harvard professors teach students. Dershowitz voting Democrat is a disaster that we need to probe.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/ginjar ginjar

    Israel and the Muslim extremist will never peacefully co-exist. That is not the extremists future view.
    Washington is almost completely anti Israel the evidence of that unfolds daily.
    Israel will not fall because of America but sadly America may suffer greatly if we abandon Israel.

  • david

    Dershowitz says: "As long as J Street was limiting its lobbying activities to ending the settlements, dividing Jerusalem and pressing for negotiations, it could plausibly claim the mantle of pro-Israel." What rubbish! That's "pro_Israel" to Alan?

    J St was set up by Soros and the like to hurt Israel by eroding U.S. support and giving B.O. plausible cover for his vicious agenda. Sensible people saw through it from the start.

    When will Dershowitz have the courage to admit he was suckered and speak out against B.O.'s vicious anti-Israel, pro-Islamist and anti-American agenda?

    • rib/eve

      I agree with you there David

    • To the ignorant

      David, Soros is an Hungarian Holocaust surviver jew.

      How sad to have a self hating jew, with the Oslo syndrome, have so much money and power to organize jews against their country.

      SHAME JUST SHAME!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    • http://www.thefathatcat.vox.com Mad Jewess

      When will Dershowitz have the courage to admit he was suckered and speak out against B.O.'s vicious anti-Israel, pro-Islamist and anti-American agenda?
      ————-
      David,
      Prof. Dershowitz will have to stand up to what hussein Obama is doing in America before anyone will take him very serious.
      We need to pray hard that this will happen for Prof. Dershowitz as it did for Horowitz many years ago.

  • Michael

    With all due respect professor,J street libs are your friends(hopefully a former friends)
    Please follow David advice above.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/zotrules zotrules

    i think that when it comes to countries or nations, terms like "anti" should be banned from circulation. Anyhow, my brain does not understand the weird word combination "anti-israel"… what the heck is that about? how can one possibly, in the right state of mind, justify that? how do you excuse a thing like that? and yeah… what was the connection again with american casualties or war losses? is it really that difficult to see two separate accounts there? i hope i'm not being too rush, but i'd exclaim "go Israel, go!!!"

    • To the ignorant

      Zotrules,

      It is the old blood liable against the Jews!!!!!!!!!!!

      And it is organized by the president of this country!!!!!!!!!!!

      !930 all over again!!!!!!!!

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/JosephWiess JosephWiess

    J Street has gone over to the dark side. It claims to be “a pro-Israel, pro peace lobby.” It has now become neither. Its Executive Director, Jeremy Ben-Ami, has joined the off key chorus of those who falsely claim that Israel, by refusing to make peace with the Palestinians

    Exactly how can Israel make peace with a group of people who, when they get concessions, be it land or money, uses those concessions to attack Israel, whether it be by moving rockets into that land and attacking Israeli citizens, or in the case of money, use it to pay for bomb vests and guns?

    To have true and lasting peace, both sides have to come together and work together. With the palestinians not wanting to make peace, that peace will never be. Israel has been trying to meet palestine half-way for 50 years, and so far, the palestinians don't want peace.

    • solemnman

      What did it take to bring Germany and Japan to the peace table?Are the Arabs less fanatical than the Germans and the Japanese were?Complete victory,if it's possible to acheive it, is the only path tp peace.

  • badaboo

    When will people understand that there is no difference between Hamas and Fatah .They both have the SAME goal ,- the Destruction of Israel , that much is self evident in th Palestinian National Charter , and the Hamas charter , their only difference being ,the method , means and time frame in accomplishing this common goal .
    The goal of these two gruops is anything BUT peace , it never has beeb noir will it ever be .

  • rib/eve

    The problem is that we are allowing them to frame the argument.

    I always found that the best defense is a great offense. As long as they keep making us back peddle to explain why Israel should be allowed this or that. Or why we should support them if they will shoot themselves in the foot AGAIN. We will never win the war.

    Israel shouldn't even bother with peace talks. They aren't peace talks at all, they are pow wows on how to slowly or quickly (as the case may be now) dismember Israel piece by piece. And now that we are not by Israel's side, I think things could go rather quickly. Scary, scary times for them.

    Lifting them up in prayer would be a good idea.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/Indioviejo Indioviejo

      Until we subdue Islam and convert muslims to Christians, Buddist, Zoroastroans, Anymist, ect., we will be at war with them. Until we recognize this bitter fact, we won't start fighting for real. Until then we are only sacrificing our blood and treasure in a futile excersize.

  • Max

    Dershowitz is right that the likes of Bin Laden are going to be against Israel's existence one way or another, but the U.S.'s "target audience" is not already committed radicals but the rest of muslim/Middle-Eastern society (not to mention the rest of the world). To find, capture, and/or kill terrorists or beat their arguments, stymie their recruitment and deter their aims, the U.S. needs the help of nations, leaders, and ordinary people in the muslim world and one step to getting that help is finding a viable settlement in Israel/Palestine with Palestinians have dignity and self-determination and muslims being able to visit Al-Aqsa. This would be a victory for Israel as it would take the wind out of the sails of Palestinian terrorist groups/extremists. The fact that Israel was pursuing some peace initiatives around the time that Al-Qaeda was planning 9/11 does not change the equation. Bin Laden and co. knew that they could draw on 50 years of conflict to argue that their action was in support of the muslim world against its humiliation in the Holy Land funded by America. Even if you think Israel has made no moral lapses in its various wars and clashes and that the U.S. has acted on the whole fairly, it is the perception that is the problem. End the occupation, create a future for Palestinians, with active U.S. participation, and you can begin to change the equation in the Middle East.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/Stephen_Brady Stephen_Brady

      Max, your solution is simply a prescription for the destruction of Israel. It doesn't matter what the US does or does not do. The problem with Islam is in the religion itself. If Israel were to "create a future for Palestinians", Islamists would simply find another excuse for hating Israel and seeking her destruction.

      The notion that Islamists are simply responding to US actions in support of Israel is simply ludicrous. Islam will not rest until "Islamic lands" are in Islamic hands, once again, and the Jews are dhimmis or dead.

      Perception? It means nothing …

    • rib/eve

      FIRST of all the Palestinians are nothing other than a tool. They are the tool that the Muslim world uses to beat the crap out of Israel. None of the Muslim world wants anything to do with the Palestinians, they hate them also. After all the Palestinians are descendent's of Esau. Esau is the only person in the Bible that GOD said he hated and so are the Palestinians.

      Second – Muslims aren't looking for peace. End of story.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/Indioviejo Indioviejo

    Regardless of Peace or lack of it in Israel, American security will continue to be threatened by Islam because most people fail to recognize the the world has gotten smaller, and we can't live with muslims in the same planet. +While the march towards the Caliphate continues relentlessly, most people continue to be distracted by the Palestinian/arabs play on western stupidity. Until we make a NATIONAL effort to understand our enemy, we will argue about how many angels may reside on a pin head. Case in point: The Pentagon forbade Rev. F. Graham from saying the prayer for national prayer day because he truthfully said what some of us know already, and Muslims try to disguise(Taquiyya) : Islam is wicked, evil, and it is a satanic cult.

    • Max

      Oh, yeah, if people around the country start to study intensely Islam and the muslim world, they're going to conclude that 1.5 billion people believe exactly the same thing and that it is a "satanic cult". Satan is part of the monotheistic religions and he's used to justify whatever hatred or fear is fashionable at the moment. Your caliphate argument is void because most muslims are the products are particular national cultures and identities that they would not want to see subsumed in an oppressive global confederation. Particularly, the governments of muslim nations are wedded to their sovereignty and political order (hence why many of them are the enemies of Al Qaeda). Countries like Morocco, Algeria, Egypt, Saudi Arabia, Lebanon, Jordan, Pakistan, Indonesia, etc. would never go along willingly with a union that seems to be the common fantasy of global terrorists and paranoid westerners. Denouncing and alienating muslims in general regardless of their regional/ideological/religious/political differences is exactly what Bin Laden and co. count on to gain support for their aims. Arguably the reason they attacked on 9/11 was to provoke the U.S. into a over-the-top retaliation that would set the U.S. up as a common enemy of muslims. The provocation worked but Al Qaeda is luckily still the worst of two evils in many eyes.

      • http://intensedebate.com/people/Indioviejo Indioviejo

        I hear what you are saying, and it's true that muslims are killing each other in great quantities, which I think is a good thing. 1.5 billion people are not in step with global jihad, but neither were all Germans Nazis, nor all eastern europeans Communist at the time of their dominance over their part of the world. It took a lot more than a sensible outreach on our side to bring down their respectively satanic cults(as in evil). Those ideologies are still around and will always be around. As for the Caliphate subsuming muslim nations to one world goverment, you are right again in saying that it is a dificult construct, but most muslims regardless of their nationalities, will be more than happy to see sharia imposed on the USA. Eurabia is evident already. Taking your reply into consideration, I still believe we need to learn about our enemy and take the Koran seriously, just as much as the Haddiths. As for the Satanic cult, if evil exists anywhere in people's behaviour, and it has to be called something, satanic is just as good as any other definition of evil, regardless of religious belief.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/Liberallyproud Liberallyproud

      I take offense at your ignorant statement that liberals have served in miniscule numbers. My husband served 20 years USMC, as did my father, my uncle (Army) my brothers (3) my nephews (2) my cousins (all 6 men and women) and ALL are liberals and we do NOT find that to be the exception to the rule. When they enlisted they were not asked what party they belonged to! We are all American Indian and love our country, much LONGER than YOU have so give it up. Have YOU served? If so, when and where?

  • http://ww.traplo.com Traplo

    yes Fuad I agree with your ISRAEL is a FAKE state made by US and Europe to protect thier Interest in the Midlle east.

    Israel killed more thna 2 million Palestinians and yet it continues infront of the eyes of the so-called modern world
    In GAZA it slaughtered 500 children in January 2009. Yet Europe and America applauded her.
    It is the defensive intention of the Muslim Extremists to bring down AMERICA first and then the False-Administration next

    • Allen

      I am amazed that Trapalo and Fuaad believe that Israel does not have a legitimacy to exist and the bigger lie that Israel has killed more than 2 million Palestinians. That is part of the problem. Liars keep perpetuating the same lie over and over until people don't know the difference and they think it's the truth. Joseph Goebbels of Nazi fame did exactly that and we know the history of that. Try to teach your children if you have any to love not to hate and not to celebrate martyrdom. It's people like you that are causing problems around the world. You are disgusting.

  • http://ww.Mohamed.com Ahmed

    Let them hear then Die for thier hatefullness==== All the commentators of this page all Zionist. They either have a Stolen died Palestinian Organ or they killed some Palestinians and yet they Live in America and EUROP.

    Zionism has a time and turning points. It is time to LIVE a WORLD without ZIONISM.

    I just woke up now. They hate Muslmis and ISLAM so that is why they stay in Middle east.

    Remember 90% of Israels people have passporst of EUROPE and America. They all immigrated from America and Europe to Protect the Interest of the west and OPRESS the Muslims middlee east people.

    • Ron Grant

      "It was an Idea We as a Jews fabricated"

      The power of an idea,yes.No less an idea then justice,dignity and statehood for Palestinians.

      "It is the defensive intention of the Muslim Extremists to bring down AMERICA"

      Good luck on that one,brother! It is crystal clear to me that America is on the wrong side of history here,but I don't want a world without America,a very strong America.The fact that you and I both can voice our unwelcome opinions on Davids site should tell you something about that great country.Only in America.God (and Allah too) Bless America.Muchiboy

    • Democracy First

      The hate is not from Zionists, but those who oppose Zionism. Zionists support democracy, human rights, gender equality, gay rights. Anti-Zionists tend to support Islamism, Sharia Law, authoritariamism, theocracy, and oppose gay rights and gender equality.

      Zionists also support the one tiny Jewish homeland, to which jews returned 1400 years after Arab imperialists invaded and ethnically cleansed them after nearly 3,000 years there.

      So, Zionists are on the side of good. They should be proud, as they are.

    • JDL

      General Phil Sheridan said it best:

      "The only good Muslim is a dead Muslim".

      Have fun, roach clip.

  • http://ww.fuaad.com fuaad

    What about If we Say that ISAEL DOES NOT HAVE ALL THE LEGITIMACY TO EXIST.

    It was an Idea We as a Jews fabricated in europe and America.

    let the Middle east live peacfully

  • Max

    Whatever its intellectual origins or the circumstances of its creation, Israel has the same right to exist as any other country as place with a functioning government and people living their lives. @Ahmed: bullshit, the majority of Israelis (Jewish or Muslim) are native born with only one citizenship. They didn't move there to oppress anyone but had no choice where they were born. Saying you want to live in a world without Zionism is like the other bigots saying they want to live in a world without Islam. Zionism means different things to different people. And no one's rhetorical position is any indication of them having killed anyone, the commenters here have probably been no closer to a Palestinians organ than you have been to an AIPAC conference.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/Liberallyproud Liberallyproud

      As American Indian and knowing too well the history of this country, we do identify with Palestinians and YES they ARE Palestinians, who were there BEFORE the Israelis. By the way Israel was built on a RELIGION, not a nationality, so how do you feel you have the right to displace a nation of people, just because you WANT TO? I guess all the Catholics should ban together and decide to take over France. Same deal, different time and religion. They have equal right to live on that land if not more. Many Israelis feel that Israel has not been a morally sound country and have committed crimes against humanity. Do you rationalize that by saying the Jews in Poland had genocide committed against them? What they are doing right now, this very minute is illegal and horrible, They have not allowed medical assistance or food and water to the Palestinians and hold them hostage under superior weaponry. Women and children mostly at this point. This is honorable? This is how they want to be recognized as a nation, by not allowing others to do the same? Sorry, but it's wrong, no matter how you look at it. No one here is anti-Israeli, but we are pro – human rights.

      • http://intensedebate.com/people/Stephen_Brady Stephen_Brady

        As a member of the Comanche nation, I ask you to speak for yourself. Native Americans are not a monolithic bloc in ideology or beliefs. I am a proud supporter of Israel, and will always be so.

        Although my screen name is an alias, my "national" name is Tsa Hinu Supanaitu Isa, or "Wolf that knows all". I didn't want my screen name to throw you.

      • http://intensedebate.com/people/Indioviejo Indioviejo

        Hey, Indioviejo means Old indian, and yes I am a proud supporter of Israel, and not for religious reasons. I'm also a Vietnam vet. I served in the U.S. Army. Not drafted. I met quite a few liberal service members and I must say, some were very disruptive of the program, and some even served the enemy well, so I feel I can't trust people like you in the service of our country, but you have a right to your opinion. Enjoy.

        • Grayzell

          Thank you sir, for your service to your country and thank you for your response.

      • Grayzell

        Maybe, with your wisdom, you can tell me how many Palestinians of today were born in Israel?

    • Ron Grant

      "Israel has the same right to exist as any other country as place with a functioning government and people living their lives."

      Perhaps,but with this qualification:not at the expense of another people,a people who were settled on that very same land now occupied by Jewish settlers.As for Israel having the same right to exist as other states,how many other modern states exist at the expense of the original inhabitants.Israel has abused her right as a state because of her abuse of the Palestinian people.Muchiboy

      • traeh

        Have you read Dershowitz' book, The Case for Israel?

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/Indioviejo Indioviejo

    Fuaad,Traplo and Ahmed, your senseless rantings don't contribute anything but contempt for your anti Israeli stance. Feel happy that you got at least something in response.

  • Ron Grant

    "..one of the few American allies who has never asked the United States to put its troops in harm’s way in defense of Israeli citizens. If Americans were to believe the falsehood that Israel were to blame for American deaths caused by Islamic extremists.."

    It is simplistic to think that just because American soldiers are not directly at risk defending Israeli citizens that a pro Israeli American foreign policy is not harmful to America and her soldiers.Bin Laden himself has said the treatment of the Palestinians at the hands of the Israelis and American support for Israel is a reason for attacking America.And American troops are in Afghanistan because Al Qaeda was/is there.The region and world would be a far better place without this Zionist entity.Re-flag Israel,abolish the Zionist borders,and allow Arab and Jew to live together within these borders.Palestinians and Israelis who can't make the change can go elsewhere.Learn the lessons history has to teach us and know that we all live together on this beautiful,finite planet called Earth.Muchiboy

    • Democracy First

      It is not to Israel that you should be preaching co-existence. That nation is a multi-ethnic, multicultural western democracy, with 1 million Arabs, who are active in media, in academia, even the supreme court. Instead, you should be preaching to the 500 million Arabs in 23 countries with more land area than the US. Most of their nations harass non Muslims, most do not allow Jews to reside there, terribly discriminate against women and gays, and Saudi Arabia makes possession of a bible a crime.

    • traeh

      Abolish the Zionist borders? You mean a one-state solution? The Jews would very quickly become a minority, and then they would be destroyed, or else dhimmified to the point where many would convert to Islam to escape dhimmification, or else they'd have to leave for other parts of the world.

      Why do you tell the Jews that "we all live together on this beautiful finite planet"? The Jews have offered pretty remarkable compromises to solve the whole problem. Don't you recall when Arafat walked away from the bargaining table without even making a counteroffer! He started an Intifada instead!

      Your presentation of the situation flies in the face of reality. Islam has many totalitarian threads running through its core. Palestinian culture is not a liberal democratic culture and therefore does not daily train people in the need to compromise their ideas, to tolerate differences in religion. When a culture protects freedom of speech and freedom of religion, then people every day are forced to learn to compromise, because you can't simply set up a hierarchy and threaten people with guns if they don't tow your party line. The reason the conflict goes on is not Israel, which has several times shown its readiness to make a deal and compromise. The reason is that Islam, and Muhammad, do not represent a culture of free speech and freedom of religion. Individuals are thus not forced to endure differences and tolerate them. Hierarchy establishes, or tries to establish, one "right" view about many important questions. Furthermore, hatred of Jews is a strong element in core Islamic texts, where Muhammad, acting as mouthpiece for God, mouths "God's" hatred of the Jews. Why are the Protocols of the Elders of Zion so popular in the Islamic world? Why is Hitler so popular in the Islamic world? Why do we see toddlers on Palestinian television being taught that when they grow up they should kill Jews? The reason is in the core Islamic texts, which are totalitarian, and have a lot of Jew hatred. Muhammad, according to core Islamic texts, executed five hundred or more Jews who had surrendered to him. They were all beheaded and dumped in a trench. Muhammad banished two other Jewish tribes from Arabia. He said, "No two religions shall exist in Arabia." That is not a culture of compromise and tolerance of differences. That is a totalitarian culture, one that seeks to spread itself all over the globe. Basically, Muhammad came to hate the Jews — or most of them — because they refused to acknowledge him as prophet. He claimed that the Jewish scriptures talk about him, refer to him, and when the Jews said that was not so, Muhammad said the Jews had corrupted their own scriptures.

  • Janis

    RALLY TO SPEAK OUT AGAINST OBAMA’S POLICIES TOWARD ISRAEL

    SUNDAY, APRIL 25
    ISRAELI CONSULATE
    2ND AVE (BTWN 42ND & 43RD), NYC

    For more info:
    http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kxG82kKYGos&fe
    http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2010/04/24/if
    http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com/atlas_shrugs/

    SPREAD THE WORD AND ATTEND IF YOU CAN!

  • aliko

    Latest traffic update:
    No traffic on J street, they all took a left turn at Cair's-Dimmhis highway and should get to Guantanamo park at some point.

  • Democracy First

    Do you think palestinians have been honest about their numbers? If so, then you know their popoulation has increased something like 3 fold under Israeli occupation. Boy, are those Zionists ever awful ethnic cleansers. If they had any brains they'd learn from the Arabs, and consider how they ethnically cleansed Jews from their 3,000 year old homeland when they invaded in the 7th century. Now, that was the real deal! Stupid Zionists. Can't even do something as well as the Arabs.

  • Ron Grant

    If you can't or won't recognize ethnic cleansing when you see it,then we have a serious problem,Houston.I can see the difficulty for you and others in admitting to this onerous crime.Until you and your kind are wise or insightful enough to admit to this then we are likely stuck with the status quo and all that entails.Too bad.

    • Stu

      I do recognize enthic cleansing when I see it. It was enthic cleansing when the Arabs forced the Jews out of the Old City of Jerusalem and Gush Etzion and Hebron. There were NO Jews left until the area was retaken after King Hussein of Jordan joined in the June 1967 war.

      I do see over 1 million Arabs living in a democratic Israel living a decent life and represented in ALL aspect of the government.

      How many Jews live in (Saudi) Arabia, where their own Koran mentions Jews living there? What happened to them? Murdered or "ethnically cleansed!"

      Instead of just throwing charged terms around, tell us an example of what you see as "enthic cleansing."

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/WildJew WildJew

    The point is, General David Patraeus and / or his surrogates said the following about Israel:

    "Israeli intransigence on the Israeli-Palestinian conflict (is) jeopardizing U.S. standing in the region…there (is) a growing perception among Arab leaders that the U.S.
    (is) incapable of standing up to Israel…..

    Patraeus: "….enduring hostilities between Israel and some of its neighbors present DISTINCT CHALLENGES (emphasis mine) to advance our interest in the AOR (Area of Responsibility)…..The conflict foments anti-American sentiment, due to a perception of U.S. favoritism for Israel. Arab anger over the Palestinian question limits the strength and depth of U.S. partnerships with governments and peoples in the AOR…..The conflict also gives Iran influence in the Arab world through its clients, Lebanese Hizbollah and Hamas," etc.

    Professor Dershowitz's president has said nothing (that I am aware) to mitigate these worrisome allegations from this popular U.S. General. The bottom line, unless Israel is willing to commit national suicide, she will be jeopardizing U.S. standing in the region.

  • Allen

    I am amazed that Trapalo and Fuaad and Ahmed believe that Israel does not have a legitimacy to exist and the bigger lie that Israel has killed more than 2 million Palestinians. That is part of the problem. Liars keep perpetuating the same lie over and over until people don't know the difference and they think it's the truth. Joseph Goebbels of Nazi fame did exactly that and we know the history of that. Try to teach your children if you have any to love not to hate and not to celebrate martyrdom. It's people like you that are causing problems around the world. You are disgusting.

  • Marty

    Israel has a much greater and more legitimate right to exist than any of its neighbors. jordan, syria, and lebanon are fake states contrived by foreign powers and (mis)governed by autocratic rulers. egypt was invaded by arabs more than 1300 years ago and they have occupied the country ever since. It's time for them to leave and allow the coptic christians to reclaim the land that was stolen from them.

  • AntiFascist18

    Jeremy Ben Ami would have been right at home with Hitler. In fact, unlike many of those who served on Judenrat councils, he would have been an enthusiastic advocate of Hitler, just as he is for the Chimp.

  • http://www.speedylimousine.com/pearsonairportlimousine.aspx Pearson Toronto

    peace to all, cant we be peaceful and accept each othersd just as simple Human beings!!!