Israel on Trial

Israel is trying hard to contain the damage from the Gaza flotilla incident. But it doesn’t seem to be working.

In addition to an announcement on Sunday that all nonmilitary goods can now enter Gaza, the incident is now under no less than three investigations within Israel. In the military sphere, a commission headed by Maj.-Gen. Giora Eiland, a former national security adviser, is investigating the conduct of the army top brass in the affair including Chief of Staff Gabi Ashkenazi. The existence of the Eiland Commission is not controversial in Israel. People want to know—to the extent that the military echelon was responsible for the foul-up—why naval commandos were sent inadequately armed into a trap, and almost killed, aboard the Mavi Marmara, and whether faulty intelligence, judgment, tactics, or some combination of those played a part.

Legal dimensions of the affair—like the naval blockade of Gaza and the interdiction of the flotilla in international waters—are being looked into by the Terkel Commission headed by retired Supreme Court judge Yaakov Terkel. Along with two other Israeli jurists it includes two foreign observers, Northern Irish politician David Trimble and former Canadian military judge-advocate-general Ken Watkin.

The Terkel Commission is already intensely controversial both domestically and abroad. In Israel, the Left charges that it doesn’t have enough teeth and will whitewash the political level; the Right says the inclusion of the two foreign observers is a grave capitulation to international pressure. Abroad, it’s charged that Trimble is too friendly toward Israel and that the commission lacks sufficient independence from the government.

Complaints that the Terkel Commission won’t probe the government have led the Israeli state comptroller, Micha Lindenstrauss, to launch yet another investigation focusing on the political echelon’s role in the flotilla incident—both in the decision-making leading up to it and in the alleged defective PR after it. Prime Minister Binyamin Netanyahu and Defense Minister Ehud Barak have already been accused, including from within the government, of deciding on the interdiction exclusively by themselves and failing to consult with other bodies like the cabinet and the National Security Council.

Three separate probes of one incident, then, including one—the Terkel Commission with its two foreign participants—that was set up under intense pressure from the Obama administration to ward off, or so it was believed, an international investigation and get the issue off the international agenda.

Yet UN Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon doesn’t seem to be impressed.

He told the Security Council, after the Terkel Commission had already been established, that he was still considering setting up an international panel to look into the incident. UN Middle East envoy Robert Serry said the Terkel Commission “could be consistent with the Secretary-General’s own proposals for an international panel—the two combined would fully meet the international community’s expectation for a credible and impartial investigation.”

In other words, the Israeli commission by itself, even with its international observers, wouldn’t fit that bill. It wouldn’t, no doubt, satisfy the standards of the bloc agitating most strongly against Israel—the Arab, Islamic, and “nonaligned” countries with their many distinguished democracies.

And as for the Obama administration, Anne Bayefsky notes that Assistant Secretary of State Philip Crowley has refused to affirm that the Terkel Commission fulfills the Security Council’s initial call on May 31 for an investigation of the flotilla incident. Bayefsky also notes that the particularly anti-Israeli UN Human Rights Council has already launched a “fact-finding mission” of its own and that “though the administration eventually voted against the resolution, it has done nothing to remove its standing pledge of substantial financial support for the investigation and everything else the Council does.”

If Ban’s panel is set up, then, there will be no less than five investigations—three Israeli ones and two foreign ones—into the flotilla incident. This will probably be a record considering that the incident took a total of nine lives all of them belonging to gun-, knife-, club-, and iron-bar-wielding aggressors who fell upon soldiers carrying mere paintball guns in an express attempt to avoid or minimize violence.

Meanwhile it was reported in Israel that, with two Iranian ships already en route to Gaza to challenge the naval blockade, “the Navy was put on high alert amid fears that another flotilla would be launched from Lebanon, leaving—due to the short distance—little time to stop it.” A flotilla from Lebanon, it’s believed, could include Hizbullah operatives. It was further reported that the IHH, the Turkish terror-linked organization behind the flotilla two weeks ago, is planning to send another one in late July.

All of which underlines the fact that, in the eyes of the enemies of Israel and the West, the first IHH flotilla was a great success. It entrapped Israel in a violent incident and got it caught in another round of severe international delegitimization and censure that is still—despite Israel’s best efforts—continuing.

In acquiescing to this latest anti-Israeli campaign if not helping to propel it, the U.S. administration and its European allies are in effect contributing to heating up the Middle East and increasing the chances of war. Perhaps they can summon enough rationality to recognize that this is not in their interest.

  • http://intensedebate.com/profiles/fightinwordsusa Walter Scott Hudson

    To say I'm disappointed by the American response is an understatement. Israel is in a tough position, surrounded by enemies who play without decency. As the prominent symbol of freedom in the world, America ought to declare without reservation its support of Israel's right to defend itself. It is also incumbent upon the US to point out what no other international party would dare, that there is no moral equivalency between the UN and Israel. The UN is a clubhouse for oligarchies and tyrants. Their opinion ought to be of little to no concern.

    • Stephen

      This is an important event and doubt must be laid doubt to rest. Wait for the reports before making a decision. US intellegence is not always faulty. Perhaps there are good reasons for calling for the Terkel Commission investigation.

      • WildJew

        What needs to be laid to rest? What are your doubts?

      • USMCSnpier

        Yeh sure, the good reasons are that there is an anti semitic clandestine Muslim in the oval office who insults and snubs the prime minister of Israel Netanyahu and welcome Abbas the head of the Palestinian Authority terrorists as though he were a head of state.

        • willic

          USMCSniper, I have been reading your comments for several months; I appreciate you and thank you for your "right-on" observations. I look forward to your suggestions on how we impeach the Muslim in the WH.

    • Lori

      Hope Israel Continues To Stand, I have not abandon her! She does Have the Right to defend herself!

    • Ron Grant

      "that there is no moral equivalency between the UN and Israel. The UN is a clubhouse for oligarchies and tyrants. Their opinion ought to be of little to no concern."

      The UN by a vote of 33 to 13 gave birth to Israel in Nov 1947(resolution 181).And their opinion counts for nothing?What universe do live you in,Walter? Muchiboy

      • MixMike

        That was before the Arabs, Soviets and Third World (nearly all dictatorships or autocracies) formed a pro-Palestinian bloc/lobby in the 1970s to attack Israel and support the Palestinians. What universe do you live in?

        • Ron Grant

          "What universe do you live in?"

          The one with a conscience,MixMike.

          • MixMike

            Could have fooled me Mr. Grant.

        • http://intensedebate.com/profiles/fightinwordsusa Walter Scott Hudson

          Nations are sovereign, founded by their people, not some international entity. The UN created nothing. They merely did collectively what each member could do individually, recognize a sovereign state. The UN has no more authority over a nation than any foreign entity, which is precisely none.

  • Andres de Alamaya

    If Israel ever runs out of enemies outside its borders it need not feel neglected since it seems they'll never run out of self-defeating enemies within its own border. I would not be in the least surprised if the Turks didn't shoot a few of their own men to further their PR cause.

    There never needed to be any boarding. You simply order the ship into your own port for inspection and if it refuses you sink it. Hopefully they'll learn to do so with future ships from the towelhead mob.

  • Robert Annable

    Israel is a pariah state that feels it can murder with impunity. I love the Zionist who wrote this "aggressors how fell upon soldiers carrying mere paintball guns." Gee that means the nine murdered were shot numerous times by paintball guns mostly in the head at close range. Were the snipers on the helicopters only using paintball guns. Read about how religious fanatics have taken over Israel. Zionism = Racism! Look at how the "chosen people" are discriminating against each other, against women and Palestinians (both Muslim and Christian). Look at how most of it's leaders are being indicted for financial crimes. This is no longer the Israel of "milk and honey".

    • al Kidya

      I have seen that video I don't know how many times and I have yet to see a sniper in it.

    • Stephen D.

      I feel dirty just thinking of answering to you. Please show how Palestinians have less freedom in Israel than they do in Plaestine…that's right, you can't! Yet you call Israel Racist. Explain how Palestine keeps some of its own people living as, and called officially, REFUGEES within its own borders. Yet Israel is the oppresor. Tell me again who launches, indiscriminately, 8,000+ missles into civilian populations with impunity. Yet Israel is the "murderers." Your arguments are incinsitant within themselves. Silly, Silly boy.

    • MixMike

      "Gee that means the nine murdered were shot numerous times by paintball guns mostly in the head at close range."

      Actually, the Israelis first asked the ship to dock at Ashdod and were told to "go back to Auschwitz." 40 members of the terorrist IHH planned a premeditated murder of the Israeli commandos. When, the Israelis boarded the ship with paintball guns, they were attacked with stun grenades, stabbed with knives, beaten with bats and subsequently fired upon when their automatic weapons were wrestled away by the IHH members. The Israelis legally shot and killed their murderous aggressors in self-defense. But, I guess its not self-defense when a Jew defends himself against a murderous Muslim terrorist aggressor huh?

    • MixMike

      "Look at how the "chosen people" are discriminating against each other, against women and Palestinians (both Muslim and Christian)."

      Actually, Israel is a secular democracy that has civil and equal rights for all of its citizens: women, Arab, Palestinian, Jew, Muslim, Christian, African etc.

    • Jeff

      I love anti-Semites such as yourself who are too stupid to know what they are saying when they fling such accusations such as a pariah state! Pray tell how? Unlike Saudi Arabia that is the single major funder of Islamic terrorism! Also is the major funder behind all the mosque (and mega mosque building) in the West! Also is the force that funds Muslims in the West to demand more (and special rights such as being judged by Shari law) rights. Also thanks to the Saudis funding terrorism, every airport in the West needs to check out all passengers as though they were terrorists!

      And what about Iran? They are directly funds Hamas in the Gaza Strip and Hezbollah in Lebanon! Besides both terrorists groups firing off rockets to Israel, they both crackdown of their respective people via harsh nonyielding 7th century Islamic law!

    • Jeff

      One more thing about anti-Semites such as yourself who use labels such as Israel is an apartheid state or Zionism equals racism; this is all Islamic propaganda and you fall for it–that makes you stupid! Arab Muslims are racists because Arabs look upon other Muslims from Pakistan, Asia and Indonesia as inferior! Do some research on how foreign non-Arab Muslim workers are treated by the Saudis and in other Arabian Peninsula countries such as Dubai. Zionism can't be racists because the entire premise of the movement is the bringing back of all Jewish exiles back to Zion! It's the exact opposite in how Arab Muslims treat other non-Arab Muslims!

      Islam is an apartheid system by nature, in all Muslim countries there are no-go areas for non-Muslims but especially in Saudi Arabia, non-Muslim are forbidden to enter Mecca! They have a notorious gender apartheid system, research it rather than in me telling you about! In Israel, the Islamic Waqf administers the Temple Mount (which they deny that any Jewish Temple existed on it) and ban Jews from praying (even silently moving their lips in prayer), they have the right to remove any Jews who are praying!

      It's time for people like you to stop absorbing the propaganda and lies of Muslims and it's time you started to actual do the hard research of the truth yourself! Until such a time, you are the living example of someone who is too stupid to live!

    • Asma

      If for one second we believe the official Israeli version on the aid flotilla massacre in international waters which is that Israeli soldiers killed the nine humanitarians in self defence,even then one fails to understand as to why they had to shoot once and some several times in the heads when the aggressors didn't have anything better than kitchen knives or sticks with which they launched their attack. Surely Israel cannot fool the world any longer.An old saying says that your best friends are those who criticize you and not those who praise you. If Israel corrects its ways due to international censure of its ways,it will do itself a great favour.If it continues on its present day course, it will harm itself . At this point of time its not only the Muslims who are criticizing Israel,the Christians and even the non Zionist Jews are very upset with the current policies of its government. Just open Google and type 'Pariah state' and see the results and you will realize that Robert Annable is not the only one saying what he has.

  • WildJew

    What needs to be acknowledged is this. Like the post above indicates (the one written by Mr. Annable), this whole thing is – largely if not exclusively – being driven by Jew-hatred. Barack Hussein Obama ran with racists, bigots, jihadists (some violent) and anti-Semites like Jeremiah Wright his entire adult life. We knew this.

    Jew-haters cannot be appeased by good-will gestures and investigations. These things only whet their collective appetites. They only invite further condemnations; more unreasonable demands. When the democracies attempted to appease Herr Hitler, he merely ratcheted up his demands. Winston Churchill had it right when called on by Fritz Hesse, press attache in Germany's London embassy.

    Churchill: "If a dog makes a dash for my trousers, I shoot him down before he can bite." Hitler, after reading this, muttered that Churchill was a "Deutschenfresser" — a devourer of the Germans. This is what Israel needs at the helm. A devourer of Jew-haters.

  • Kanwi

    It is not often Israel attempts to appease the Muslims but when they do it backfires on them because it is seen as weakness and thus encourages them more. Israel needs to go back to basics. Lay out the terms to respect the legal blockade, give maybe two warnings about failure to stop running the blockade. Fully arm the boarding party for inspection and if threatened withdraw or shoot to kill. If needed torpedo the ship on recovery of the boarding party as an act of blockade defense.

  • PAthena

    The hypocrisy of the complaints against Israel for trying to prevent Hamas in Gaza from getting weapons from the sea, for its soldiers fighting and killing nine men in one of the ships in the flotilla is blatant. North Korea recently sank a ship of South Korea, with no provocation, – and silence.

  • Robert Annable

    Just look what is happening in Israel. The Askanazi hate the Sephardic. The Haredi are religious parasites. Discrimination abounds among these groups but the Palestinians of course are looked upon as cockroaches, Look at the comments made by Israeli religious and political leaders about Palestiians since 1948. Your links to the South African apartheid regime show where you received training or you were doing the training. Aren't any Jews concerned about how religious fanatism is sweeping Israel? Aren't any concerned about the level of corruption in the government? Speak up or Israel
    may not survive!

    • Stern

      Suddenly you're worried about internal frictions in Israel? No answers to those who called you out for your anti-Semitic diatribe against Israel in your first post? Proven wrong on that, you fall back on other, irrelevant stuff to prove to yourself that whatever the Joos do, it has to be bad. Why don't you go back to The Guardian, Mr. Annable. You'll find posting there a lot more comfortable.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/aspacia aspacia

      You claims are well documented in Hareetz, Jerusalem Post, Artuz Sheva, and most Israeli media. You see, Israelis are reflective, thinking human beings. Now, review Arab media, have you? There is very little self-reflection, mostly the government controlled journalists play the victim game, and blame every other land, especially Israel for their poverty in spite of their oil wealth.

      BTW: many Haradi and Askanazi were recently arrested and jailed for their intolerant, bigoted behavior toward their brethren.

    • Jeff

      Why aren't you concerned about the tribal warfare among Muslims? In Iraq alone thousands of Muslims are being shot and blown up by fellow Muslims, what about trial war in Yemen or in Afghanistan and Pakistan (which ironically has an area known as the tribal region)!

      You are extremely selective in pointing the finger of blame at people aren't you! Let me put it another way, how would you like it if I were to track you down, hire a private investigator and find out all the dirt on you! Would you like it if I then created a website that was devoted to everyone girl you dumped and had her say in what a creep you are! Then as my website got more popular, more and more rumors both true and fiction would be published; thousands of people who come to hate you personally just because what I published on my website. That's what anti-Semites and Muslims are doing to Israel and Judaism, it's people like you that read this crap and believe this shit!

      So grow the hell up and stop reading and indulging in other people's hatred of Jews!

      • Asma

        Half a million Muslims have been killed by American forces in Iraq and Afghanistan in the last decade. some of you justify it as collateral damage. Surely more Muslims have been killed by non Muslims than vice versa in any year,month,decade,century or millennium. Most of the Muslims who died when daisy cutters were rained on them in Afghanistan were innocent civilians. Most of the people dying as a result of the unprecedented drone attacks on the sovereign areas of Pakistan are civilians.
        What is the fundamental teaching of all the three great Monotheist religions,apart from the belief in one God? It is the preciousness of all Life. Our three blessed prophets did not teach us to murder indiscriminately,Steal lands, drive human beings into sub human conditions, to think other religions or their followers as inferior and show intolerance towards them. I am sure all the three prophets are sitting together in heavens and despairing on our pathetic behaviour.

  • Robert Annable

    I love how immediatlly if one doesn't agree with Israel they are "driven by Jew- hatred" or anti-semitism. For a long time I supported Israel but can no longer. In college my best friend was Neil Rothman and dated Susan Rubinstein. I was in love with Susan and moved to NYC to be close to her. On weekends, we would go out to Brighton Beach to see her parents . Initially the were very welcoming and I received a great education in Judaism. As Susan and my relationship grew things began to change. When we visited Susan's mom wasn't as welcoming and her father wouldn't acknowledge my existence and spent his whole time praying and reading the Torah during my visit. Susan finally told me that her father was praying for my disappearance. Anti-Gentilism at it's best. Stop religious intolerance!

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/aspacia aspacia

      Oh, so Daddy didn't like you. Wa! So many individuals I dated who my mother dislikes. She even dislikes my mate of 23 years. So TFW. Read up regarding Christian intolerance to religious intermarriage. I believe the Bible states it will not recognize a marriage between a Christian and nonChristian; this would be adultery.

    • cochavi1

      Well, that makes sense. A nation of seven million should commit suicide, be flooded with pseudorefugees and more because your intermarriage didn't work out and Susan's daddy was a bigot.

      If I applied the same logic to the US based on the anti-Semitic gentiles I have met, oops, can't do that….

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/WildJew WildJew

      R. Annnable: "I used to love Jews. I used to support Israel, etc. That was before I read the Bible. It was before I read the book of Deuteronomy (chapter 7) that the Israelites may not intermarry with non-Jews, that if I want to marry a Jewish woman, I would have to convert to Judaism – I would have to join the Jewish nation. Now I hate every Jew in the world. I hate the God of the Jews. I hate Israel. I hate everything Jewish!"

    • Stern

      Why is it that whenever you point out somebody's anti-Semitism, their immediate response is "But some of my best friends are Jewish"?

    • Kimosabe

      Robert Disagreeable writes: "Susan finally told me that her father was praying for my disappearance." I can only way that I wish that Susan's father had tried harder. By the way, Robert, don't take it personally, some of my best friends are gentile.

      • Kimosabe

        "…can only way…" -> "…can only say …"

    • ajnn

      "Some of my best friends are….". The anthem of the racist.

      After they got to know you the parents did not like you. Isn't that the opposite of racism? They got to know you as a persona and an individual and THEN decided on whether or not they liked you.

    • Jeff

      That's nothing! How many Muslim girls in Western nations attempt to date non-Muslim boys without being killed by a male family member (father, brother, cousin) via an honor killing!

      You might not have liked that fact that Susan's father was praying for her disappearance but if this was a Muslim family, Susan would have been killed by her father! At that point would you be saying I used to like Muslims but now I hate all Muslims?

      • Asma

        No that is not true. I know so many Muslim Boys and girls who are marrying Jewish girls and boys in the west. I have not heard of any murders in this respect. I think this phenomenon is going to increase due to their some what common culture and values system whether we like it or not.
        As far as Islam is concerned ,it is permissible for a Muslim man to marry a Christian or a Muslim woman, but Islam does not allow a Muslim woman to marry a Christian or a Jewish man.

        • Asma

          correction; In Islam it is permissible for a Muslim man to marry a Christian or a Jewish woman as Islam considers them to be people of the book.

    • Carole

      What a shame , that`s really sad!
      It can be like that for christians as we are told not to be unequally yoked, because it can cause all sorts of problems once you`re married.
      I became a christian a few years after marriage and my husband couldn`t get his head around it, so occasionally there was friction but we still stayed together.

  • gracie

    There was a good reason the Jews were told not to marry non-Jews. If you did read the whole Bible, you would have noticed that every time they went out of their faith and mingled and married non-Jews, their faith became corrupted and they started worshiping pagan gods again. Those same pagan gods that participated in child sacrifice, orgies, everythng that went against the Torah. The entire Old Testament is about the Jews time and again defying G-d's orders and time and again being forgiven. If the whole world only followed what the Bible said, we would be in much better shape today. I am not a Jew, but I am a supporter of Israel.

  • Robert Annable

    My how the posters on here love victimhood. Sorry it's not going to work anymore . The world is seeing through it as the similarities between Nazism and Zionism are increasing. Collective punishment, stealing land, war crimes, inequal justice, racism and an extreme arrogance of being better than others. I would love to see Israel's continued existence but now it's down three options ;existence as an aparthied, unjust, entity despised in the world or from Nazi playbook drive all the Palestinians into the sea. Of course they could end settlement building, stop stealing land and try for peace. Right now with the mood of Israel I expect number 2 is the most likely. I guess there is a fourth
    option that is using nucleur weapons against Arab states to get their land. Unless Israel
    wants peace "never again" becomes all over again with Israel the oppressor.

    • logdon

      Try for peace? And how may they go about that, genius? Give up Gaza? Whoops they already did that and look what happened.

      Idiot!

    • mentzer

      Before you speak on similarities between Zionism and Nazism maybe you should do a little bit of research on how the Arab propaganda closely resembles the propaganda used by Nazis, also how the Arab countries teach their kids from pampers age to hate Jews and the rest of the world. Do a little bit of research before you speak on matters such as 'similatirites between Nazism and Zionism are increasing'

    • New Yorker

      You are a complete moron – it's a pathology. You can't be helped.

      Yes, in the next war, which is drawing closer with each passing day, all these "palestinian" neanderthals will be driven out for good – enough of this fraud and crocodile tears, savages should either learn civilized ways of be repulsed and expelled. Their time of learning is over. Time for punishment. You are welcome to join them in their stupid predicament.

    • Stern

      See, Robert, this post is exactly why you've been accused of anti-Semitism. You are an ignorant pig, probably something to do with the fact that your childhood sweetheart saw right through you, leaving you with an eternal hatred of anything Jewish.

    • Brett

      Robert….why dont you try to get a seat on the next blockade runner that the religion of peace tries to run through the Israeli blockade. There may be like minded people on that cruise for you to bond with. Then when you reach Gaza & are boarded you will get a crack at em!

      Of course they may just sink them this time but please dont let that stop you.

    • Robert Annable

      Logdon- If not peace what other of my options do you chose? You could have left out "idiot" to keep the discourse civil. mentzer I do not condone Arab propaganda towards Jews or Israeli's but fear Israel is beginning to do the samething. I heard
      Meir Kahane speak on two occasions and I view him as a true Nazi. Although his party, Kach, is allegedly banned ,the settlers are his believers and they are increasingly taking it out on Palestinians. Thanks for no namecalling. New Yorker- Thanks for the perfect example. Palestinians are neanderthals and savages and should be repulsed and expelled. Good collective punishment. Jews have long noses and steal people's money so send them to concentration camps? I had hopes more moderate US and European Jews could try to bring Israel back from the abbyss they are headed for. You sure aren't one of them! Stern- How long did it take you to come up with "ignorant pig"? I saw Susan many years later and I still adore her. She opened my eyes to many things in the world none of which was Jewish hatred.
      Do all off you so blindly stand by Israel and feel it can do no wrong?

      • New Yorker

        Yes – collective savagery should be punished in the collective way. The Germans and the Japanese have apparently learned that lesson. Don't need hypocritical comparisons from your kind.

      • Asma

        Mr Annable, I totally agree with what you re saying. I was reading an article on child battering and was stunned to read that mothers who were battered as children are more likely to batter their children as this becomes entrenched in their psyche.
        I think the same has happened with the Jews.They were victims and now they are victimising. Victimisation has become entrenched in their Psyche. They were considered as nothing in the past by likes of Hitler and his group, so they have every right to think of Palestinians as nothing. If they cant get their hands on Hitler and his atrocious friends, they can extend the punishment to the Palestinians who resist the Israeli occupation of Palestinian land.

    • Jeff

      Collective punishment? Hmmm..how about all the blood libels across Europe where entire community of Jews were killed for missing Christian children? Stealing land? Europeans continually threw Jews out of their countries and stole all the land Jews were living on! War crimes? How about the Holocaust! Unequal justice? How about Europeans forbidding Jews from most occupations, living in certain areas and moving around freely (Jews had to wear special labels or hats, etc. to specifically know who was a Jew)! Do you want me to go on?

      There's no such thing as an Arab Palestinian! Again, research it! Hundred years after Jesus' death, the last major Jewish rebellion against the Roman occupation of Judea (led by Bar Kochba) ended up in defeat! The Roman Emperor Hadrian wanted to erase the history of the Jewish people, he renamed Judea to Syria-Palaestina and renamed Jerusalem to Aelia Capitolina! The Arabs are occupying Jewish land! Once again, you've gotten all your information from Islamic propaganda! Just remember the basic true(ism) which is that whatever the Arabs say about the Jews, it's the reverse!

    • Carole

      You have this entirely back to front as all the things you`re saying applies to Hamas and palestinians, not Israel!
      The so-called settlements are not settlements at all but homes and apartments on the land that always belonged to Israel!
      There are so many lies and deceptions and being economical with the truth which is why Israel is demonised so much. Go to "Honest Reporting" website which has the real truth!

      • Carole

        Above post for Robert Annable

  • http://crplanet.forumotions.com/forum.htm TNM

    Between 1942 and 1948 the Zionists went from town to town in Palestine, lined up in three separate lines women, children and men. They shot each man in order, and then raped the kids while the women watched. Sometimes for good measure they raped the kids first and then shot the men. They then shot each kid in order. They then raped the women and then shot them. They are sick, sick f%cks. what the Zionists in charge of . I am *not* a Nazi supporter, but the Zionists have rewritten history completely to cover up all the reasons the Germans were getting the ZIONISTS out of their country.

    • New Yorker

      They did not shoot you – that's something. Where have you been hiding all this time?

      • http://intensedebate.com/people/ihateretards TNM

        I am full blooded American and not a senior citizen. To bad they didn't eliminate your gene pool

        • New Yorker

          Why don't you go ahead and fix that mistake.

          • http://crplanet.forumotions.com/forum.htm TNM

            If they had open season on idiots I would.

          • cochavi1

            You pretty much define 'idiot.' You're a Nazi wannabe with a Holocaust denier's sensibility. Go bleep yourself.

          • http://intensedebate.com/people/ihateretards TNM

            I would say with all the blantant racism on the board defines most of you as idiots

          • MixMike

            And your blatant antisemitism doesn't define you as an idiot also?

          • http://intensedebate.com/people/ihateretards TNM

            The Holocaust did happen and it was a terrible thing. The murders done by hitler and his group of thugs was horrible. So take your bleep and stick up your a$$, I am sure you like it that way anyway

        • trickyblain

          What the hell is a "full blooded American"? Are you Native American? Is your Indian name "Head Up Hitler's Ass"?

          • cochavi1

            You have some wonderful lines, tricky. Of course all the massacres – I mean that anyone can prove – were carried out on Jews by Arabs, often with the British looking the other way. Sarah Honig in the J Post has written some very good articles on the slaughters of Israelis and the politically correct efforts of leadership (in Israel) to sweep these beneath the rug.

          • http://intensedebate.com/people/ihateretards TNM

            Yeah that was wonderfuly written by a 7 year old

          • http://intensedebate.com/people/ihateretards TNM

            Another uneducated comment by an uneductaed loser that knows nothing about history.

          • trickyblain

            Although my emphasis was on the American Revolution and the Enlightenment, and not eugenics, I confess to being ignorant to the meaning of "full blooded American" (insert obligatory quip about the state of university education). Perhaps you can tell us what a "full blooded American" is, instead of dodging every question that asks you to clarify your position?

          • http://crplanet.forumotions.com/forum.htm TNM

            Well it is nice to know that I am 100% American and not a racist POS like most of you on this board. I think it would be best if you all went home and ate bullets. The USA has no room for people like yourselves who spread the word of hate all day long.

          • MixMike

            Please try taking some of your own advice.

    • ajnn

      "the Zionists have rewritten history completely to cover up all the reasons the Germans were getting the ZIONISTS out of their country"

      Please do not delete this because it is offensive. We need to see that jew-hatred continues to be a force in this world.

      • http://intensedebate.com/people/ihateretards TNM

        I don't hate jews. Just posting facts

        • New Yorker

          Straight from Julius Streicher's manual.

    • abc

      Filthy. Nazi. Liar.

      • http://intensedebate.com/people/ihateretards TNM

        Low life piece of shit

    • trickyblain

      Tell us about all of those "historical" reasons that you feel justify the German actions of the 1930s and '40s.

      How did the Zionists rewrite the history?

      • http://intensedebate.com/people/ihateretards TNM

        I am niot justifying the murder of the jews. Are you people really that dense on this board. If someone diasgrees with you they are automatically a nazi. You are all a bunch of bigots. I disagree with the Israel government not the people.

        • trickyblain

          Who am I bigoted against? It's news to everyone on this board, save yourself, that I agree with them on a regular basis – many falsely call me a "leftist" but few call me a Nazi. I wonder why. But I digress, you didn't answer the question. How did the "Zionists" rewrite the history of Nazi-era Germany?

          "Zionists have rewritten history completely to cover up all the reasons the Germans were getting the ZIONISTS out of their country"

    • MixMike

      Did you make those lies up all by yourself or did you use a neo-Nazi website to help you?

    • Jeff

      Where the FUCK did you get that information? No such thing every happened but Muslims did that to Jews! And that is a fact!

      Let me make it easy on you because (retarded) people like you don't like to read lots of books, I'll suggest just one book for you to read:

      ISRAEL a History by Martin Gilbert.

      Before you make any more fucking war crimes accusations just read this one book and then and THEN ONLY GET BACK TO ME!!!!!!!!!!!

      • http://crplanet.forumotions.com/forum.htm TNM

        I have that book and it if full of lies. Nice language that shows your education level.
        BTW I have over 2,000 books in my home. Who's the retard?

        • Jeff

          I don't believe it anything you say! You can't have the book by Martin Gibert and call that full of lies while at the same time be a an absorbent mind sponge to all the propaganda spewed out by anti-Semites and Muslims! This makes no logically sense that’s why it’s impossible to believe anything you say!

          By the way, you know that crap you just repeated about Jews going town to town lining up Arabs..etc., it’s all lies against the Jews created by Muslims and they have one common trait—generality! There’s no facts, just generality, no specifics—that’s the essence of lies and conspiracy theories they prey on the ignorant like people such as yourself! Martin Gilbert has nothing but facts, people, dates, locations, eyewitness testimony, etc. Muslims lie and give generality of massacres by Jews against Arabs! The 1929 Hebron massacre and riots led by Arabs was solely based on a blood libel of generality that a rumour was told that a group of Jews had killed some Arabs—it never happened but that set off the waves of riots of Arabs against Jews! I could go on and on with facts but to you—these facts are all lies, yet you believe the blood libellous generalities of Muslim propaganda against Jews!

          That’s why I say GO FUCK OFF!!! You and all your fictitious 2000 books! You’re a fucking liar, retard and a brain dead believer of anti-Semitic blood libels! If you had any guts at all you’d go on the Internet and show everyone what your apartment (because you’re not a successful person—nobody could be with the type of personality you possess) looks like and show us your so-called collection of books! And you’ve taken a page from Muslim propaganda; you generalize (i.e. 2000 books, no titles, no authors, etc.)! SO FUCK OFF!!!!!

    • Carole

      Lies! Lies! Lies!

  • Robert Annable

    Stop the settlements for a starter. If not peace what of the other options do you choose?__By the way, since I have been called so many names on here, a drop of information. I grew up nominally Christian but my mother's view was you go to the church closest to home so I've been a Mennonite, Christian Scientist, Catholic, and a Methodist. I now disavow all organized religions and don't buy any of the crap in the Bible, Torah, Koran etc. Man invents religions. It starts with magic, moves to myths and on to religion. All religions think that their God is better than the other's God or they are the chosen people.__The crimes done in religion's name continue unabated. I am concerned that Israeli religious fanatics have taken over Israel and it's all downhill from here unless more moderate Jews in the US and Europe can pull them back from the abbyss.

    • abba

      No one cares about your thoughts, child, religious or otherwise. Now, hold your breath. Stay that way.

      • http://intensedebate.com/people/ihateretards TNM

        I do. His comments are well though out and written

        • New Yorker

          Well thought out for a moron.

          • http://intensedebate.com/people/ihateretards TNM

            Well that was an educated comment

        • TNM = 1/infty

          The fact that a Nazi like you (your posted comment: "the Zionists have rewritten history completely to cover up all the reasons the Germans were getting the ZIONISTS out of their country" needs to be forever kept in escrow on your behalf in case you forget to pay your Nazi party membership fees some year)
          likes Unable's thoughts speaks volumes about both of you.

          • http://crplanet.forumotions.com/forum.htm TNM

            Nazi like me? You're an idiot. You know nothing about me. I do like how you want to be like me though. Do you stalk others like this?

      • Asma

        I agree with his comments about Israeli religious fanatics taking over Israel. Israel by it arrogant and 'suffocating the Palestinian' policies is fast loosing support of even its most ardent supporters. Please watch Sir Gerald Kaufman's speech in the British parliament (Feb,2009) on the U tube.

    • MixMike

      "All religions think that their God is better than the other's God or they are the chosen people."

      Mr. Annable, the term "chosen people" for the Jews is not a delcaration of supreme awesomeness. It merely means that for Jews are chosen to follow gds laws. For Jews to be considered righteous before gd they must follow 500+ laws in the Torah. For non-Jews to be considered righteous before gd they have to follow merely 7 Noahide laws (part of 10 commandments).

      • Asma

        MixMike the fanatics of all three religions believe that they are the chosen people. My Jewish friends tell me that they are the chosen people,while I have heard similar claims from many Christians and Muslims.

        • MixMike

          I am sure you are right that all three religions believe they are god's chosen people. I am merely pointing out to Mr. Annable how Jews define the term chosen. As mentioned above, for Jews "chosen" means chosen to follow gds laws (all 500+ in the Torah). Some scholars have suggested that the term chosen for Jews is in fact more of a burden than a badge of honor. I'm not saying I agree with them necessarily, but it is an interesting take.

    • Jeff

      As I've posted this reply to another anti-Semite:

      Let me make it easy on you because (retarded) people like you don't like to read lots of books, I'll suggest just one book for you to read:

      ISRAEL a History by Martin Gilbert.

      Before you make any more fucking accusations just read this one book and then and THEN ONLY GET BACK TO ME!!!!!!!!!!!

    • Jeff

      BULLSHIT!! If you disavow all organized religions why the FUCK do you just concentrate on demonizing the Jews? Why the FUCK don't you put the damn Muslims and their moon god believing prophet in their place? This is a people who bow down 5 times a day to a meteor that's housed in a tent!

      You're a fucking hypocritical anti-Semite plain and simple! There's absolutely no fucking excuse for your behaviour! You don't want any religion in your life–fine but stop demonizing the Jews by believing the damn blood libels of the Muslims against the Jewish people and Israel! As far as I'm concerned you're a Muslim telling lies on this website; I can believe that far easier than you being an extreme atheist who has a selective hard-on for hating Jews!

      • Carole

        Could we have less bad language on here, please!

      • Asma

        I am sure Blessed Prophet Moses (peace be upon him) will not approve of your abusive language.

  • John

    The clearest way for Obama to show his true colors is to first reward Israel for caving in to pressure, and at the same time ignore the blatant influx of provocations by anti-Western terrorist –supporting states. This he does!

    Our president is thereby giving tacit approval to the instigation of warlike behavior – in effect becoming a promoter of conflict in the Middle East. Is it coincidence that he gets a Nobel Peace Prize and Robinson gets a Medal of Freedom for helping promote the exact opposite? By not attacking those who are inciting conflict, when he has duty to do so, he is in effect causing it to happen through criminal negligence.

    • New Yorker

      Our president is an arrogant nobody. The world will be paying a high price indeed for his foolishness.

  • Billy

    This entire Flotilla story is a chapter in the ongoing disinformation campaign being successfully waged for public opinion over the 'palestinian' issue & the existence of Israel. The 'why', 'who' and origins of this propaganda effort are not clearly discernable.
    What is clear is that history is being rewritten in this effort by those with a distant familiarity with the truth, such as Mr. Annable above.

  • Billy

    Comparisons of Israeli defense policies to South African apartheid and Nazism tactically serve to cloud impressions of generations who've never heard of Buchenwald
    or Josef Goebbels. Those who make these shameful comparisons in advancing the 'palestinian' cause/ demise of Israel should be ashamed–but they are not, in perpetuating this fraud. The 'palestinians' are Arab pawns, who could have been assimilated 30 years ago by their fellow Arab neighbors; their plight has been perpetuated not by Israel but by the greater Arab world agenda from Syria to now Iran, the Persians. Let's be honest: the Arab world's leaders are not interested in a palestinian state—they and the radical Islamists want Israel to cease.

    • Robert Annable

      "The Palestinians could have been assimilated 30 years ago by their Arab neighbors. The US took and assiimilated Jews after the war, why couldn't Israel have done the same? Was it racism or religious superiority?

      • New Yorker

        Because one does not assimilate one's sworn enemy.

      • ein marak bishvilcha

        Israel has a large population of Arab citizens, both Christian and Muslim. Your point is entirely vacuous. Oh, and on your next trip to Riyadh, be sure and take the tour of the many, thriving Jewish neighbourhoods to be found there.

      • Stern

        Robert, the reason I came up with "ignorant pig" is because you seem intent on displaying your ignorance, and by your comments, you are a clearly not a very nice person. Once again, a perfect example. Do yourself a favour and read up on the Jewish refugees from Iraq, Egypt, Morocco, Tunisia, etc. etc. You may be surprised to discover that close to 1 million Jews were kicked out of their Arab homes – homes they'd owned for centuries – and that Israel (yes, ISRAEL) absorbed most of them. Now go cry me a river about what a Jew-lover you are.

    • Ron Grant

      "The 'palestinians' are Arab pawns, who could have been assimilated 30 years ago by their fellow Arab neighbors;"

      And the Jews could have been assimilated by the Europeans over the past hundreds of years.So? Muchiboy

  • Billy

    The United States and the West made a terrible error in the 40s by looking the other way, attempts to appease the rewriters of history in Nazi Berlin. This, Mr Annable, is what must 'Never happen again.' As you & your ilk generate your disinformation to undermine Israel's legitimate rights of self-defense and Hamas refuses to recognize her very right to exist, please understand that as handmaidens to this century's bookburners, you are all collaborators. I urge all of the rest on this post to join me in standing with & defending Israel. Billy

    • Robert Annable

      Billy, I want Israel to continue to exist but not as the pariah state it is becoming. I am only calling for moderate Jews not to blindly support anything Israel does. Would Israel be better off if they didn't invade Lebanon? How about Gaza? How about the assassination in Dubai? How about the flotilla massacre? Israel is isolating itself more and more and much of it is due to the extreme right-wing. I came remember when Israeli's could travel to very few countries and that is going to be happening again. Do you support it getting to the point where Israel drives the Palestinians into the sea?. Does the Torah say that it would be justified?

      • MixMike

        "Do you support it getting to the point where Israel drives the Palestinians into the sea?"

        No, and neither does Israel, that is why it pulled out of Gaza and has allowed the W. Bank to remain somewhat autonomous. To be fair, it is Hamas and similar Palestinian terror groups that are calling for ISRAEL to be driven into the sea.

        "Does the Torah say that it would be justified?"

        No, the Torah says that when the Messiah comes the Jews will be gathered in Israel and the world will be at peace. Non-Jews can go about their business as usual but the world will be at Peace. I suppose if you are one for Chaos this might be a frightening prospect.

  • Stern

    You just can't stop, can you. Lebanon? What would you have a country do after it has been attacked and its soldiers kidnapped? Gaza? What would you have a country do after it has been bombarded with close to 10,000 rockets? The flotilla "massacre"? I won't even stoop to answer that. Look at the videos. Look at the pictures of the really nice Jew-lovers who came on the Mavi Marmara, bearing knives and swearing to die as martyrs. And wtf is your continued refrain about "driving Palestinians into the sea", if it isn't a case of a very sick person projecting his wishes onto the other sides (it's a known psychological trait)? After all, this is what the Arab side has been openly threatening to do to the Jews ever since the turn of the 19th/20th century. Do yourself a favour, Robert, you do not belong on this site, where your garbage will be challenged and refuted with facts. Go to a site where you'll free more comfortable, among the other pigs and haters of the world.

  • WilliamJamesWard

    Stern this Troll Annable and his cohort TNM have derailed this entire post.
    Screw them, they are anti Israel and pro Jihadist. My message to them is
    they are X'd in the head and not worth the time of day. The Jewish girl and her parents probably saw him for the looser he is and cast him aside, but not far enough,
    I can think of some good places for them but I am sure they will get their just
    deserts.

    Israel should ask where the International investigation was for Russian murder in
    Georgia, North Korean murder at sea and for that matter why has Obama not
    been supporting Israel and funding terrorists, having the American military train
    terrorists, Israel needs to open its eyes and get its head screwed on right or it will
    have to suffer needless pain. As and American I support Israel, its just position
    against terrorist agressors and the fine record Israel has in helping those in need.
    November will make all of the difference, I would go back into uniform to support
    Israel and defend the right…….and there are millions of Americans like me..
    Regards, ………………………….William

    • cochavi1

      Thanks, William. True words.

  • Stern

    Thanks William, that's really encouraging.

  • Tom

    Isn't it amazing that there are over 50 nations in the OIC , Organization of Islamiic
    States , yet not a word about the fact that besides Turky and Iran no Jews are
    allowed to live in those countries . In 1967 Egypt , Syria , Iraq , Jordan announced
    that tey will wipe out Israel. Could anyone mention one country that is expected
    to return territory after winning a war that was started by the losers.