Israel Faces the Cynical World

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Originally published in The Jerusalem Post.

This week a German doctor in Bavaria filed a criminal complaint against Rabbi David Goldberg.

Rabbi Goldberg’s “crime”? He performs ritual circumcisions on Jewish male infants in accordance with Jewish law.

The doctor’s complaint came shortly after a ruling by a court in Cologne outlawing the practice of male circumcision.

The Austrians and the Swiss also took the ruling to heart and have banned infant male circumcision in several hospitals in Switzerland as well as in the Austrian state of Vorarlberg. Denmark and Scandinavian governments are also considering limiting the practice of circumcision which has constituted one of the foundational rituals of Judaism for four thousand years.

Meanwhile, in Norway Dr. Anne Lindboe has come up with the perfect way out of the artificial crisis. Lindboe serves a Norway’s ombudsman for children’s rights. And she proposes that we Jews just change our religion to satisfy anti-Jewish sensitivities. She suggests we replace circumcision with “a symbolic, nonsurgical ritual.”

It’s worth mentioning that circumcision isn’t the only Jewish ritual these enlightened Europeans find objectionable. Sweden, Norway and Switzerland have already banned kosher slaughter.

Attacking circumcision isn’t just a European fetish. The urge to curb Jewish religious freedom has reached the US as well. Last year San Francisco’s Jewish Community Relations Council had to sue the city to strike a measure from last November’s ballot that would have banned circumcision if passed. The measure’s sponsor gathered the requisite 12,000 signatures to enter the proposition on the ballot. Circumcising males under the age of 18 would have been classified as a misdemeanor punishable by a $1,000 fine and up to a year in prison. Sponsors of the measure distributed anti-Semitic materials depicting rabbis performing circumcisions as villains.

The people involved in banning or attempting to ban circumcision are not on the political fringe of their societies. They are part of a leftist establishment. They are doctors and lawyers, judges and politicians. This doesn’t mean that all their fellow leftists are anti-Semites. But it does mean the political Left in the Western world feels comfortable keeping company with anti-Semites.

This state of affairs is even more striking in international affairs than in domestic politics. On the international level the Left’s readiness to rub elbows with anti-Semites has reached critical levels.

While the Europeans have long been happy to cater to the anti-Semitic whims of the Islamic world, the escalation of the West’s willingness to accept anti-Semitism as a governing axiom in international affairs is nowhere more apparent than in the Obama administration’s foreign policy.

And the American Left’s willingness – particularly the American Jewish Left’s willingness – to cover up the administration’s collusion with anti- Semitic regimes at Israel’s expense is higher today than ever before.

A clear-cut example of both the Obama administration’s willingness to adhere to anti- Semitic policies of anti-Semitic governments and the Left’s willingness to defend this bigoted behavior is the Obama administration’s decision not to invite Israel to participate in its new Global Counterterrorism Forum.

The GCTF was founded with the stated aim of fostering international cooperation in fighting terrorism. But for the Obama administration, it was more important to make Turkish Prime Minister Recep Erdogan, who supports the Hamas and Hezbollah terrorist groups, feel comfortable, than it was to invite Israel to participate.

Not only did the US exclude Israel, at the GCTF’s meeting last month in Spain, Maria Otero, the State Department’s under secretary for civilian security, democracy and human rights, seemed to embrace the Muslim world’s obscene claim that Israelis are not victims of terrorism because terrorism against Israel isn’t terrorism.

In her speech, titled “Victims of Terrorism,” Otero spoke of terror victims in Jordan, Turkey, Pakistan, Uganda, Colombia, Northern Ireland, Indonesia, India and the US. But she made no mention of Israeli terror victims.

Rather than criticize the administration for its decision to appease bigots at the expense of their victim, American Jewish leftists have defended the administration. Writing in The Atlantic, Zvika Kreiger, senior vice president of the far-left S. Daniel Abraham Center for Middle East Peace, wrote that allowing the Jewish state entry to the GCTF parley would have “undermined the whole endeavor.”

Kreiger sympathetically quoted a State Department official who explained that actually, by ostracizing Israel the administration was helping Israel.

The source “reasoned the progress made by the organization would ultimately better serve Israel’s interests (not to mention those of the United States) than would the symbolic benefits of including it in a group that likely wouldn’t accomplish anything. [Moreover]… once the organization was up and running, and its agenda was established, they could find ways to include Israel that would not be disruptive.”

So despite the fact that Israel is a major target of terrorism, and despite the fact that many of the states the US invited to its forum condone terrorism against Israel and support terrorist groups that murder Israeli Jews, Israel is better off being excluded, because the anti-Jewish governments invited by the Obama administration will somehow totally change their perspective on anti-Jewish terrorism as long as they don’t have to suffer the irritation of sitting in the same room as real-live representatives of the Jewish state.

The cynicism of the State Department official’s statement to Kreiger is only outpaced by Kreiger’s stubborn refusal to acknowledge that cynicism.

Kreiger’s behavior makes sense. If he acknowledges the bigoted nature of the Obama administration’s policies he will have to stop defending them.

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  • Nakba1948

    The Zionist entity should be ostracized by the civilized world until it ends its illegal occupation of Palestine, much in the same way that apartheid South Africa was progressively isolated in the 1980s. Disingenuously crying "anti-Semtiism" to suppress legitimate criticism of Zionist crimes is a stale tactic, and most people thankfully see through it now. You zealots diminish legitimate anti-Semitism by misappropriating the term to bolster your outmoded, racist political ideology. In any war between the civilized man and the Zionist, support the civilized man. Support Palestine. Defeat occupation!

    • Roger

      And should the Jews have stopped the illegal occupation of the gas chambers for Hitler?

      How can you blame the Jews for wanting to have their homeland, a place they can survive against the world and against all odds? The world has turned their back on the Jews over and over, they certainly can't trust people like you to 'allow' them to survive.

      • reRoger

        So you're blaming the Middle East for the holocaust—-a crime that Europeans committed?
        How typical!

        If you want to a Jewish homeland, then perhaps it should be in America, where they are far away from the Muslims you claim are so dangerous.


          reRoger, "Muslims are so dangerous" is a claim?

          – Arabs killing each other, 20,000 dead, in Syria
          – 9/11
          – 1993 bombing of WTC
          – 7/7/05 bombing of London transport system
          – 1988 bombing of passenger plane Pan Am 103
          – Saddam Husseins poison gas attack on the Kurds of Halabja Iraq – 5,000 died
          – Honor killing of girls, in the Islamofascist Ummah AND the West
          – Bali bombing
          – 8 year Iraq.Iran war – 1,000,000 killed
          – Assassination of Anwar Sadat
          – Murder of Coptic Christians in Egypt

          Just look at todays newspaper.

        • Drakken

          If you love the muslims so much, go live with the savages, you won't be missed.

    • Touchstone

      Ignorant, non-thinking Israel-bashers are always equating Israel with apartheid South Africa. The respective histories are so different that comparisons are ludicrous.

      Arabs and Muslims seek the destruction of Israel, regardless of its borders. Why were Arabs trying to destroy Israel before 1967? There was no occupation. Therefore, the cry to end the occupation is merely a weapon in the arsenal of the Arab, a tactic in his quest to completely obliterate the state called Israel. Once the tactic of ending the occupation has been achieved, Arabs can proceed to dismantle the rest of Israel.

      If the choice is between occupying a piece of land and suffering the various consequences, or relinquishing it to the hands of people who will use it to try and finish the job they started in 1948, it's no surprise why the land is still occupied. There was never any counterpart to that particular dilemma in South Africa.

      What's been dubbed the "Apartheid Wall" is similarly ludicrous. It's a security fence built to keep out suicide bombers, and it works. Comparisons to real apartheid are cheap, self-serving nonsense.

      Where do you get your talking points from? Who implants them in your brain? Why do you rarely if ever defend what you write? Are you incapable of independent thought? Are you a robot programmed to regurgitate propaganda on cue?

      If the best you're capable of is spewing one talking point after another, it's time to find some better ones.

      • reTouchstone

        "Why were Arabs trying to destroy Israel before 1967? There was no occupation."

        -Because the occupation took place before 1967. You yourself acknowledge this: "relinquishing it to the hands of people who will use it to try and finish the job they started in 1948."

        "Where do you get your talking points from?"
        -From the majority of reputable professors and scholars across the country — who support Palestinian struggle. From the heads of every non-European country. From former diplomats, former Presidents. From people who care about the well-being of others.



          Are you against illegal, brutal occupation?

          Then pack up your crap and get the F out of Native American land AKA North America.

          Supporting "palestine" is supporting FASCISM.

        • Roger

          Are you speaking out for the Copts too then?

        • Touchstone

          What disingenuous tripe. What a specious, cynical argument. Obviously, the "occupation" Nakba referred to (and the one which I was referring to as well) was the one that began in 1967. It's common knowledge that the "occupation" refers to the Israeli presence in the lands it began occupying after the war in 1967.

          You're distorting the common usage of the word "occupation" to mean "every square inch of land called Israel". To you, even the tiny, indefensible state defined by the 1949 armistice borders represents an "occupation", but you know very well that's not the occupation commonly referenced.

          "reputable professors and scholars" — Meaning, biased professors who stick to the party line of their respective academic departments, funded by gulf oil potentates.

          "the heads of every non-European country" — Meaning, the tyrannical despots who run the various Islamist police states blighting the globe and corrupting the UN to pursue their own agendas.

          "people who care about the well-being of others" — Meaning, people who care about putting a violent end to the well-being of Jews in their own country.

        • reader

          What occupation? The UN authorized the partition of the tiny remnants of the Mandate (80% had already gone to the Arabs when the Brits created Trans-Jordan). Between 1948 and 1967 Egypt occupied Gaza, and Jordan occupied the West Bank. Is this the occupation you are talking about? Or you don't know what you're talking about at all. Reputable professors? Right.

        • Drakken

          I wish those "repudable" professors and scholars would do us all a favor and go live with the muslims savages so we can get rid of these leftist/progressive anti western traitors, the muslims can have them.

      • Kufar Dawg

        For any muslo-fascist to accuse Israel of being an apartheid state is the height of hypocrisy, considering many islamic states are complete religious and gender apartheids and all of them are religious apartheids.

    • daniel weltlinger

      you stupid idiot… the problem is really simple and isn't with the 'zionist' entity but your damn koran and the completely uneducated religious zealots like yourself who follow it like blind sheep. Jews (and Christians) are dhimmi or second class citizens in the eyes of your mullahs and Israel as a Jewish country is an anomaly in the middle of a potential caliphate that is and has been faught over between Sunnis and Shiites for the past century since the fall of the Ottoman Empire. This large swathe of territory belonging to the potential caliphate also happens to contains 80% of the world's oil which even if there are many wealthy people (including Jews) equates to the real power running the world today. The language of Hebrew and the Jewish religion and people are much much older than Islam, the language of Hebrew is deeply embedded in the LAND of Israel and Jerusalem has been the holy city of Jewish people since before Islam or Christianity even existed and was and is the traditional centre of the four holy festivals of Passover, Sukkoth, Shavuot and Rosh Hashana. Your religion is at it's heart anti Jewish because as has happened time and time again throughout the history of the Jewish people the attempt to convert us out of our faith and culture failed abysmally and you can find this evidence in any koran you care to look at. You look up the word 'Jew' in a koran and you see the racist rubbish that will come up. MArk my words people in the world will soon find out the truth about what people like you represent and the truth will finally come out despite many people's attempts yet again to destroy the Jewish people…

      • hello

        "the problem is really simple and isn't with the 'zionist' entity but your damn koran and the completely uneducated religious zealots like yourself who follow it like blind sheep"

        -Still waging the Crusades, are we? Who's trying to destroy who? Can you honestly say that the American government (or even Israel) doesn't want to wipe Palestine off the map?

        "Jews are dhimmi or second class citizens in the eyes of your mullahs"

        -Actions speak for itself. America and UK have continually repressed the Muslim nations in the Middle East with the military and financial support of dictators (do you remember who funded Saddam, the Iranian revolution, or the Taliban?). The current "war" in Iraq has killed a half-million, innocent civilians.

        What exactly does the history of Hebrew or Judaism have anything to do with the justification of Israel's actions? Arabic culture existed well before Islam. By this analogy, perhaps Americans should give back the land they took from Native Americans–who had existed centuries before European arrived?

        • Roger

          The crusades were in the defense of fellow Christians against the pagan muslims.

          Why do you pretend that the muslim hordes were not an invading and brutal occupation force?

        • Drakken

          You haven't seen a real Crusades yet, but you will on steroids once you muslim savages push us infidels too far, our vengeance will make the Crusades of old pale in comparrison. I make no oppology for our western ancestors bringing modern civilization to you 3rd world savages.

    • Stern

      " In any war between the civilized man and the Zionist, support the civilized man. Support Palestine."

      Ah yes, the civilized Palestinians. That would be the folks who strap bombs into their children, who name public squares and summer camps after killers of women and children, who kill their own women and children in the name of "honour", whose snipers fire into the heads of infants, whose heroes murder toddlers and their mothers in their beds, whose "soldiers" fire rockets into kindergarterns. Such civilization!


        A "palestininan" assassinated US Senator Robert F. Kennedy in 1968.
        "palestinians" invaded the Olympics in 1972 and murdered athletes.

        "palestinians" respect NOTHING.
        "palestinians" are murderous savages.

      • Howard

        As opposed to the civilized American culture. That would be the folks that rape their children at Churches; whose kids are raped by football coaches and then try to cover it up to protect their "honor" and "integrity"; who kill a half-million, innocent Iraqi citizens and then hold a celebration saying that "Mission Accomplished!"; who commit genocide against Native Americans and then place them in concentration camps called "reservations"; who enslave blacks and then beat them and lynch them; who go around bombing and invading foreign countries; who give weapons and money to tyrants and puppet dictators to repress their people; whose soldiers set fire to sleeping women and children and then the American people cheer and chant, "USA! USA!"

        • Roger

          Hey, were not all liberal democrat racists like Senator Byrd you know.

        • reader

          Howard as in Howard Zinn, I take it, – the devoted stalinist whose book of lies has been elevated to be the required reading by marxists taking over the piss-poor american educational system to indocrinate children.

        • Drakken

          It seem you would be better served if you put your liberal mouth where your money is and go live with the 3rd world you love so much, and good bloody riddance.

        • Kufar Dawg

          Unlike in your islamic theocracies, rapists are punished for their crimes, and by rapists I mean the men doing the raping, not the victims of the rape. Molesting little boys is a time-honored tradition in Pakistain, Iran and Afghanistan, where no man is ever arrested for doing so. The genocide of infidels/kufars in the Sudan also included black Africans who were slaughtered and enslaved by Arabic muslimes (look up Janjaweed). A thousand women a year are murdered in Pakistain in honor killings. Little girls are regularly married away against their will to dirty old muslime men in Iran, Afghanistan and Yemen. In short get bent Ahmed.

    • rachaelamb

      Palestinian terrorists who brutally murder defenseless Jewish men,women,children,and infants in the most gruesome way and then go out in the streets and celebrate and hand out candy to their depraved,evil friends are ostracized by decent human beings everywhere,who unlike terrorist supporters like you know the difference between right and wrong.

      • lamb chops

        Do you know the difference between right and wrong?

        American terrorists who kill a half-million, innocent Iraqi citizens and then hold a celebration saying that "Mission Accomplished!"; who assassinate democratically-elected presidents and support puppet dictators (because USA loves democracy); whose soldiers set fire to sleeping women and children and then the American people cheer and chant, "USA! USA!"; who gave money to Saddam and the Taliban and
        Osama; who commit genocide against Native Americans and then place them in concentration camps called "reservations"; who enslave blacks and then beat them and lynch them; who go around bombing and invading foreign countries.

        That's probably why nearly every country in the world ostracizes USA. Even their so called European allies don't like them! How ironic! America has no friends. But apparently USA know the difference between right and wrong.

        • Roger

          What's wrong, don't have a name to stand for all the cut and paste talking points?


          Arab terrorists killed 1000,000 in the 8 year Iraq/Iran.

          If Arabs can't get along with fellow Muslims, how can they get along with non-Arabs/non-Muslims.

          The war cry of "allah akbar" just turns civilized people off.

          Checkpoints at every airport in the world are necessary to screen out islamofascist terrorists that resepct NOTHING. For example Islamofascists even bomb each others mosques.

          The real kicker is that self proclaimed "progressive" people DEFEND Islamism.

          No wonder that "socialism" is held in such low respect.

        • Drakken

          You moral compass is so f-cked up that I am surprised you can find the parking lot where you parked your car. No more nicetiess and pleasantries with you traitors of the left for you should be treated with contempt as the wretched traitors you are.

        • Kufar Dawg

          The majority of civilian deaths in Iraqistan were the result of muslime on muslime violence, not the actions of coalition forces. Your Al Taqiyya lies need more work.

    • Kufar Dawg

      Maybe the same can be said of the 57 states of the OIC, all of which are exclusively islamonazi in character.

    • Kufar Dawg

      Meanwhile, "Palestine" routinely persecutes the few Christians and women living under their thumb. Meanwhile, in any place controlled by the PA, there are no synagogues, because they were all destroyed by the muslo-fascists. Meanwhile, the charter of Hamas calls not only for the destruction of the state of Israel but a genocide of Jews. Get stuffed Abdullah.

    • PAthena

      Nakba is as ignorant of the history of the name "Palestine" as he is of that of Israel, the ancient land of the Jews. The name "Palestine" was given to Judea in 135 A.D. by the Roman Emperor Hadrian after he had defeated the last Jewish rebellion under Bar Kochba. He also outlawed Judaism and renamed Jerusalem "Aelia Capitolina," "Aelius" being his gens name. Since then the name "Palestine" was synonymous "the land of the Jews" and "Palestinian" synonymous with "Jew." That is why after World War I, Great Britain was awarded the "Palestine Mandate" to be "the homeland of the Jews."
      Calling Arabs "Palestinian" is a consequence of the invention of the "Palestine Liberation Organization" (P.L.O.) by Gamal Nasser, ruler of Egypt, and the Soviet Union, both haters of Jews, in Cairo in 1964. The group, and name, came to prominence when it murdered the Israeli athletes in Munich in 1972.



      May all your Jihads turn into Nakbas!

      Please relocate to Syria where you can be part of the fun. That fun is courtesy of "The Religion of Peace".

      Who are you rooting for? The Assad family dictatorship or the al qada/muslim brotherhood fascsts?

      I hope they continue killing each other.

      And as always…


      • nakba

        "I hope they continue killing each other."

        -I wonder if this is something Jesus would say?


          eternal nakba,

          It's something that the "prophet" mohammed did.

          Pillage and kill.

          That's what's going on today in Syria, Egypt, Yemen, Islamic Regime of Iran.

        • Drakken

          Jesus siad turn the other cheek, that time has come and gone and it is the time of the mailed fist.

        • Kufar Dawg

          If Yeshua were preaching his ideology in ANY of your islamofascist states today he would be murdered, full stop.



      All apartheid Islamofascist entities should be ostracized by the civilized world until it ends its illegal occupation of Israel, Europe, Americas and the Middle East, much in the same way that apartheid South Africa was progressively isolated in the 1980s. Disingenuously crying "Islamophobia" to suppress legitimate criticism of Islamofascist crimes is a stale tactic, and most people thankfully see through it now. Zealots diminish legitimate anti-Islam opinion by misappropriating the term to bolster your outmoded, racist political ideology. In any war between the civilized man and the Islamofascist, support the civilized man. Support Democracy! Support Freedom!. Defeat Islamofascism

    • Vermont Yid

      Uh, excuse me, but there is no such place as "palestine", therefore there is no such thing as a "palestinian." What you are referring to is land won by the country of Israel in the 1967 war. What you and others of your ilk refer to as "palestinians" are nothing more than the unwanted dregs of arab lands. It's a pity that anyone can be as ignorant as you appear to be.

      Oh yes, have a nice day.

    • Mike Villano

      Read this Jew hating dirt so you can recognize it when you see it.
      God bless the Jews and the state of Israel.

    • Ghostwriter

      I hope you can explain something to me,Nakba1948. Why should I,as an American,support the Palestinians,most of whom celebrated what happened on 9/11? Why should I support people who want me and other Americans dead merely for existing on this planet? The Israelis don't want me dead,the Palestinians do. The Israelis love life,the Palestinians love death. Do the math. I know who I'm going to support and it's not the Palestinians.


        A "paleswinian" savage assassinated US Senator Robert. F. Kennedy in 1968.

        • Kufar Dawg

          The official story on Sirhan Sirhan is that he's Christian. Personally I don't believe it.

    • Andy Lewis

      Blow it out yer azz.

  • Chezwick

    "Sweden, Norway and Switzerland have already banned kosher slaughter."

    Why do I suspect that Halal slaughter in NOT banned?

    • Touchstone

      Glick writes:

      "Everyone admits that given Iran’s open sponsorship of terrorism, it is a certainty that terror groups would use the Iranian nuclear umbrella to massively expand their terrorist war against Israel."

      She then goes on to argue that "the US is not interested in fulfilling its responsibility" to "prevent Iran from becoming a nuclear power".

      But protecting Israel from terrorists isn't why the USA would consider a nuclear Iran their own problem. The reason is that an Iranian nuke will trigger nuclear proliferation in the region. Will Obama and his generals sit back and watch as Turkey, Saudi Arabia and Egypt join the nuclear club? A Middle East brimming with nuclear weapons might very well be the legacy of today's world leaders. The result will be a cataclysm, and history will accord today's superpower decision-makers the same respect granted to Neville Chamberlain.

    • Touchstone

      Oops, I meant to post my message below…

  • Leonard Wessell

    I tried the ensuing reply in Jer. Post, but it did not come through. So, Glick is wrong on one essential point. The German antagonism to circumcision is not "cynical", rather "apodictic". Although accepted by theGerman Pariliment, 600+ doctors and jusrists have sought to define the"currrent" meaning of the German constitution's justified (after the Nazis) attempt to bind mutilation of others. These "scientists" hold "scientifically", accordingly, that circumcision is 1. a serious physical mutilation with 2. later sexual and psychological disturbances.PERIOD!!! In the light of such a defintion, the"600+" are trying to force a court decision against circumcision by anyone, e.g., Jews, Muslims andthose culturally motivated (e.g., a non-Jewish or non-Muslim American may not have his child circumcised as in America). What is the motivation behind the attack?

    The same secularistic drive as seen in the populistic crusades by atheists in America (though without the crude popuarlism proper to American culture) motivates the "scientists". In other words, the "600+" are seeking to define and realize in law ONLY what secularism allows re religioius practice. The importance of circumcision as a seal of the covenant is not allowed being judged an archaical violence–>explicit suggestions that Jews re-define Judaism so that circumcision takes place only by adults having so chosen. The"600+" has explicitly recommended that Jews (and Muslims) just simply and consciously accept a tabu of today which will become "normality" tomorrow. It should be noted that the Catholic and Protestant Churches have lent support to Jews and Muslims.

    What Glick has to say about the "cynical" (I would say "hostile") treatment of Israel strikes me as true. The problematic in Germany is not with Israel (German law has nothitng to say for Israel) and not per se with Jews, rather with Jewish (and Muslim) religious practices. For that matter, non-religious motivation for circumcision is being rejected. (I wonder if American doctors in military hospitals in Germany will be allowed to circumcise Americans born to a soldier family?) The motivational problematic is an all-embracing secularism that wishes to marginalized the religious consciousness and its practices. For more on the subject in Germany, I suggest looking up the recent article by David P. Goldman in PJ Media. Goldman knows his Germany very well.

    I note that I am American, have lived 30+ years in Germany, German is a second maternal language and I have doctoral titles in German language, literature and philosophy. I do not write from ignorance, though I do do so from sadness and concern. Prof. L. P. Wessell

    • franz von fear

      Germany's circumcision debate has nothing to do with anti-Semitism, atheism or secularism. It is a question of Constitutional Law,

      In Article 2. the German Constitution guarantees the right to phisical integrity. Circuscision of dependentscollides with this law. To accomodate for circumcision, German Constitution would have to be ammended by a 3/4 parliament vote in favour of religious tradition, opening the floodgates for all nature of religious practice, from female circumcision to polygamie and child brides. Scharia through the back door.

      • Leonard Wessell

        Formally you are correct, but materially a victim of secular self-delusion. Just read the statesments published by the "600". The apodictic assertion that circumcision constitutes 1. a serious mutilation with 2. deliterious sexual conseuqences in later life constitutes a DEFINIT'IONAL alteration as to what constitutes mutilation. Am I now to believe that, since the "Grundgesetz" that came into effect (post 1948), all Jewish, Muslim and secular circumcisions (forget not that I had my son secularly circumcised in Germany some 40 years ago) constitute(d) cases of serious mutilation of the male sexual organ??? Really, it was, historically viewed, the serious intent of the writers of the German consitution (whose words were all approved by the American occupational forces–in which some American Jews were present– or said words had no consitutional existence) to consider circumcision to be mutilation?????? Return to 1948 and beyond and your constitutional problem dissolves itself because the meaning of the words were different. Germany at that time was far more religious than today. Furthermore, I am seriously to believe that what even the Nazis allowed was consciously forbidden by the very men and women who were seeking to form a constitution (at the tutelage of Ameican occupational authorities) countering the rule that enabled the Nazi total mutilation of Jews in camps. (If you look up in internet, you will find stirring stories of Jewish mothers who did everything to personally cirucumcise their new born males before said children were to be murdered the next day–that is now, retroactively, mutilation?). And now the German constitution as intepreted by German "scientists" asserts that Jewish, Muslim and American cirucmcision is unconstitutional, indeed, is a serious mutilation! Change your defintion back to what the constitution originally was and your constitutional problem disappears. It is the NEW definition that makes the matter a function of modern secularism. i.e., the natural sciences define the reality in terms of which political and ritual existence is interprreted.

        In summary: Just change the secularizing definition of mutilation and the constitutional problem disappears!!! So your counter point is formally correct only if you materially alter the words of the "Grundgesetz"–words that up to now allowed what now is to be no more. Your difficulty is phoney and hides you belief that you want the practices stopped in accord to today's "scientific" value judgments. And that I assert is part of the process of secularization taking place in Germany.

        Finally, he who says "a", must say "b". Should not Germany in its new found purity formally take America to an International Court? For afterall, 70% of American males are cirucumcised–and not for religious reasons. If circumcision is mutilation in Germany, it must also be so in so in America, no? Question: Should American doctors in the American military on German terrritory be allowed to "mutilate" the male babies of an American soldier family? Last question: If German "scientists" should conclude that obligated celebacy is not healthy (= mutilation of sexual life), should the German consitution not lead to legal prohibition of such requirements for priesthood by the German Catholic Church? Where does this stop? Where the "scientists", the definers of a natural worldview, say so.

        • fran von fear

          Why is circumcision, a hitherto accepted practice, now suddenly high in the German legal spotlight?

          What we are experiencing is a logical consequence of the campainges against the supposed islamisation of political and legal life in Europe. The circumcision case was brought against Muslims. Judaism has become a collateral dammage as fear of Sharia has the population suspicious of anything that could put religion abover the secular rule of law.

          Germany is a mere forerunner in this debate. As fears of religious interference in secular law and constitution rise, the circumcision debate be held in all secular Christian societys with Muslim or Jewish minorities.

          • Leonard Wessell

            Alas–and I mean it sincerely–my experience of ongoing Germany shows that the gov. and tv are going out of the way to make Islam acceptable. Tonight in German tv I saw a show that claimed that Mohammed had liberated women, only the male followers have not caught on. New Mosques are popping up, big ones, much larger than any new Christian church building (there are none). The dangerous aspect of Islam is shoved off upon the Salafists (Brotherhood never mentined except as a welfare organization). Sharia is being made to sound o.k. The general German population is–I do not know as I know no such creature. I find little concern for Islam per se, only the "extremists" cause worry. What is going on in France, is unknonw in detail to me. I have read in the Jer. Post that French Jews are leaving France in large numbers. Let someone like Robert Spencer appear and he is called a populistitic defamer of Islam. By and large Islam is still "foreign", but becoming, let me say, "kosher". The circumcision pressure in Germany is in the press focused upon Jewish pratice.I repeat that the origins in Germany is the desire to have "scientists" define what is socially acceptable in religious rituals. The "scientists" are not anti-Jweish or anti-Muslim, they are anti-practices that do not meet their "scientific" value judgments. Secularization, viz., decline of Chruches began in the 19 th Century. Only the reaction to the Nazi period reversed things for awhile. What I claim can be backed up by statistics. Whatever! We must await what the Coourt decides! — Thanks for the discussion.

  • Mr. Polly

    Such primitive savage rituals as circumcision should certainly be banned by civilized societies. And what flagrant hypocrisy to complain about Jews being asked ro revise their religion to accomodate anti-Jewish sensitivities! Christians have long since considerably revised Christian doctrine to accomodate the anti-Christian sensitivities of Jews.

    • Leonard Wessell

      Thank your for proving my point. "Primitive savage rituals" you write. 70% of American men are circumcised.For totally non-religious reasons, E.g., I was circumcised and so was my father and my two sons. One son was circumcised in a GERMAN hospital by a GERMAN doctor. Time for the act was ca. 10 seconds. Reaction of child was discomfort for 10 seconds. The health advantages have been excellent. Sexual life of my father, me and my sons fully normal. So, your inflamatorily formulated SECULAR "value judgment" is yours to have qua private citizen. But your imperative is to "ban" with the police powers of the state religious praticies or non-religious practices of those who do not accept your evaluation of circumcision. That is dictatorship. Your views are "secular", aggressive and repressive AND prove my point about secularism. Thank you!

      What Christians may have defined and re-defined in the long history of doctrinal evolution (read Cardinal Newman's book on the nature of the development of dogma so that you may have an inkling of what you are blabbing about) is a matter for Christians to do or not to do in their own decisional context in civil society. There should be NO state derived mandate ordering or even suggesting doctrinal changes, specifically if the content of which comes from "sicentists" with secular views such as you manifest. If the order comes from the state, then only with the threat imprisonment!!! That is what you are pleading for, willy/nilly! In Germany a group of "scientific" (sic) secularists are DEFINING what is allowable religious practice and seeking to have their definition enforced by the state, which means at the point of a gun if need be. Let us go beyond Judaism (and Islam).

      What about the Catholic practice of infant baptism? The child has no free choice (just as the Jewish child has none)!. Should not the state forbid the Catholic Church from realizing infant baptism? Is not free choice only for adults? Many "scientists" say that celibacy is psychologically harmful. Should not the Catholic Church "be banned by civilized societies" from enforcing the rule re priests? Think about it. He who says "a", must say "b".

      So, for what it is worth, your reference to Christian efforts of re-defintion is a NON-statal act and, therefore, is totally irrelevant as a counter argument. Perhaps, I personally exhibit "flagrant hypocrisy", you definitely exhibit "flagarant secularism" at the point of a police gun. And that is a big difference between us, no????

      • poppakap

        Well said Dr. Wessell. Kudos.

    • JoJoJams

      And by the way…. Why don't you get the August issue of Science News – just came out. There's an article in there about how circumcision helps to prevent STDs by a pretty good margin. This, as well as the fact that Jews have been cutting the foreskin off all their males for millenia, and Christians for a few millenia themselves, all shows the fallacy inherent in the "scientific" pronouncements of "permanent sexual damage" etc. Heck, even a laymen can see that if, as we're TOLD….there is a lessening of sensation…that isn't necessarily a bad thing, if it means we can last longer and please our women better. Oh!! Maybe that's why all the outcry from the uncircumncised! Yes, I jest… but still – get the August issue of Science News. Circumncision is NOT the great evil some try to make it out to be, and is actually beneficial. Look at it this way:: We've evolved past the need for the appendix, have we not? And removing it causes no harm, and actually can be beneficial. Same thing with this animalistic foreskin that atheists are so proud of for some odd reason…

    • Ghostwriter

      What is it about this site that brings out people like Mr. Polly,who share their vile anti-semitism and not expect condemnation for it?

      • Mr. Polly

        It's the presence of so much vile anti-gentilism in the people who write for this site.

        • Ghostwriter

          Has anyone ever told you that you're an idiot,Mr. Polly. If not,let me be the first. You're an idiot.

    • Kufar Dawg

      "Christians have long since considerably revised Christian doctrine to accomodate the anti-Christian sensitivities of Jews." How would you know?

  • Wally

    Obama does not permit IL to participate in terror forum, and importantly, Bush did not allow IL to participate in the war against Salafi Islam in Iraq. There is little difference in these attitudes. Bush thought the Jews would spoil the war by focusing Moslem hate, but actually the opposite happened: the ignorant, non-Arabic-speaking, culturally non-comprehending Americans lost the war, plus the one in Afghanistan. They lost some blood but most importantly so much treasure that the USA will not be able to survive for much longer.

    • jemaasjr

      Well, I prefer accuracy to undifferentiated slander. We did not actually lose the war, we won that splendidly both on Afghanistan and Iraq. But then our culturally non=comprehending leadership did the usual thing, we lost the peace. Instead of the old sin of leaving too quickly, we did the new sin and stayed too long. As for spending us bankrupt, that was coming anyway, and on balance I think it just as well. Any money saved would just be squandered by the new leadership.

      It is enough to make you a little nuts. Here we are the most powerful country in the world, or would be if we got our act together. And yet we squander opportunities and waste resources to such an extent that about all we are producing is a splendid decline.

    • poppakap


  • Bamaguje

    Male circumcision has well documented health benefits. It's known to enhance genital hygeine and prevent cancer of penis.

    As for Iran's nuclear program, I think Obama may order military strike on Iran nuclear facilities, not because he loves Israel (he doesn't), but as a desperate last ditch effort to secure his reelection by portraying himself as a strong leader.
    Given Obama's abysmal failure to revive America's ailing economy and provide jobs after 4 wasted years, his chances of re-election are otherwise very slim.

  • Max67

    The same Libertard philosophy that opposes circumcision, advocates the immigration of the Musl-ims to Europe. The same is happening in the USA
    Europe is being taken over by the Muslims; in less than a century Europe will be a Mus-lim continent. So you better get used to the circumcised di_k!!!

  • Marty

    Israel cannot depend on countries that possess or are developing institutionalized anti-semitism. These include most of europe, in great part thanks to the islamic communities there refuse to work, live on welfare (since non-muslims are inferior and must provide for muslims), breed with their cousins, and have too much time on their hands. It needs allies, of course, but these should be cultivated where islam has already slaughtered or enslaved millions of people. India and Thailand would be good starts. Such societies have already been defending themselves against islamic imperialism for centuries and have ample experience dealing with the muslim menace.

    • Kufar Dawg

      I'd suggest Burma as well, perhaps Greece and Armenia.

  • Steven Schrier

    Has anyone noticed from the recent photos, whether Prince Harry was circumsised? Before the war, the British Royal Family’s men were all circumsised according the doctor that performed on me. The British press reported the German case but there was no further interest.

  • Moishe Pupick

    Monday, August 27, 2012 common era

    You haters of Zion should know that the current State of Israel constitutes only about 10% of The Promised Land. Israel stands alone; it has only G-d now.

  • Bert

    There is a saying that: "When all else fails read the instructions!"
    The solution to anti-Semitism is right in the bible which is the book that clever secular Jews always ignore.
    Try Deuteronomy Chapter 28 for starters.

  • andy I just got this news which affect Israel, too, and all the world. It's the best news since V.E. Day. Europe has finally stood up to Islam and we can expect not only changes in Europe but a domino effect to all free nations. Check the link to YouTube.

  • polnick

    Happy American workers are kept busy building tanks and planes thanks to violent organizations like Hezbollah. Arabs threats are needed to pull the US arms industry out of its recession. Nasrallah deserves a billion dollar bonus.

    • poppakap

      The most factually incorrect post I've read in weeks. Congrats on the $5 you got for posting here.

  • marios

    Historically first victims were Jews but soon all other had the same or worth. Stay with Israel as you will be next victim if one is indifferent now.

  • Mike Villano

    Caroline is right again.
    The Quislings in the US State Department in their headlong rush to appease the Mullahs in Iran and empower the Mo Bros regionally have set up Israel to take the blame if they do the job the Obama and the State Dept refuse to do.
    In terms of betrayal and sell out, Obama and the State Department are on the same page so even if Obama loses in November, Romney won't have the juice or clout to bring the career Jew-hating parasites at the State Department to heel so nothing will change in terms of misapplying US foreign policy.
    Appeasement and sell out will remain the twin centerpieces of US foreign policy.

  • flowerknife_us

    If Iran is known not to have a bomb. then there is no critical need to strike the facility that could produce it. Especially if it is well defended. Better to cripple the country's ability to function and respond. power grids and communication, current transportation stocks and refinery capabilities. various critical port facilities Cherry pick targets for ease of mission with the biggest bang for the Load. Timed as close as possible to magnify the physiologic impact.

    If the Israelis cannot penetrate the Nuclear facilities then they need to suffocate those inside it Plug the air intakes and glue the doors shut. Eventually the will open the door to send a bomb through or every one who knows how to run the machinery is dead.

    Just making the Iranians defend their own airspace 24/7 with their current Air Force is bound to open up more venues of Approach as time progresses.

    Israel needs to force Obama's hand just enough for aid but still denies him re-election. If Obama is reelected the rug will be pulled in a heart beat and God will surely dam the U.S.

  • watsa46

    It is a lot safer to attack the Jews than defend oneself against the Muslims.

  • Protea

    Just wondering… God said He would bring the Jews back to their land, the land He has given them. With all doors closing in the rest of the world for them, isn't prophesy being fulfilled? The Creator of all mankind sides with you … take courage! Even though the whole world is against you, you're still the apple of His eye! He is luring you back! Who cannot see that this is a spiritual battle?

  • Roger

    Multi part rants of lies and hate again?

    Wee, you small little man. And you haven't shown that any of this was on orders from Christ and His teachings.

    I can do that with mohammed. You hate filled bigot.


    WTE, Nice. Points from 1,500 years ago.

    Islamofascist Crimes Against Humanity happen TODAY.

  • Roger

    And you lie and can't show a single one.

    Always the hate filled bigot. Struggling to make your quota of propaganda today?

  • Kufar Dawg

    But 80 MILLION hindus were slaughtered or enslaved or forcibly converted to islam by muslimes in the Indian sub-continent. Tamerlane, the great muslime hero, bragged about how many Hindus he slaughtered and had towers made of their skulls.

  • Roger

    And still you can't show a single one of Christ's teachings that led to anything bad happening.

    Wee, you're just blinded by all the muslim friendly bigotry. Such a small little 'wee' man.

  • Roger

    Why do you keep circling with your muslim friendly hate so much over and over again?

    Well, with you it's obvious. You're just a 'wee' small little man.