Playing the Racism Card Like a Maestro

Bruce Bawer is a Shillman Journalism Fellow at the Freedom Center and the author of “While Europe Slept” and “Surrender.” His book "The Victims' Revolution: The Rise of Identity Studies and the Closing of the Liberal Mind" is just out from Broadside / Harper Collins.


fredEvery Friday night, in prime time, both Norwegian state television (NRK) and its Swedish counterpart, SVT, air a talk show called Skavlan, which is taped in Stockholm and hosted by a Norwegian fellow named Fredrik Skavlan. Part Letterman or Leno (without the monologue), part Charlie Rose or Larry King (although the closest equivalent I can think of at the moment is – if you’re old enough to remember it – the old David Susskind show), it has a certain degree of cultural and political impact in both countries. There are usually several guests per show – movie stars, pop stars, politicians, writers, and so on. They come on one at a time. Skavlan interviews them individually, but as they accumulate onstage he attempts to spark interaction among them. The conversations proceed in a mixture of Swedish and Norwegian, although quite often one of the guests is British or American, in which case everybody switches into English, some more comfortably than others.

Last Friday, the opening guest was Labor Party politician Jens Stoltenberg, who two days earlier had completed his eight-year term as prime minister of Norway, handing over the government to a non-socialist Conservative and Progress party coalition. Skavlan chatted with him for a quarter hour or so, after which they were joined by the three young stars of some Swedish teen flick, whom Skavlan interviewed, then forced into an awkward exchange with Stoltenberg. (Had Jens ever been bitten by the acting bug? Are you kids interested in politics?) Painful though it was, the worst was yet to come. For the next guest, it turned out, was a Kurdish-Swedish “political comic” named Özz Nûjen, who, Skavlan told us, “has taken the title of prime minister,” his pet joke apparently being that he’s the guy who should be in charge of Sweden.

From the start, Nûjen, whom I have never heard of, exuded a remarkable arrogance and abrasiveness. He said nothing remotely funny, and instead started pontificating about politics. He professed to admire Swedish prime minister Fredrik Reinfeldt for “his opposition to xenophobia,” but added, “I am always the opposition because of my color.” Sweden’s problem, he asserted, is that “there’s no opposition”: everybody pretty much agrees on everything. Besides, neither of the leading Swedish parties has a vision for the future. Only the Sweden Democrats do, but their vision is “racist” and “xenophobic” – exactly, he said, like that of Norway’s Progress Party.

Nûjen went on in that vein a bit more, after which Skavlan called on Stoltenberg to reply. Had the international news media been wrong to depict the Progress Party after the September 9 election as a gang of far-right bigots? If viewers experienced déjà vu, it was because Conservative Party leader Erna Solberg had been placed in essentially the same spot a few weeks earlier, when it became clear that she and Progress Party leader Siv Jensen would be governing Norway together. Over the decades, more than a few Conservatives have joined the socialists and their media marionettes (not least NRK) in slamming Siv & co. as Islamophobic yahoos, but now that Siv was entering the cabinet and the entire planet was being told that Norwegian voters had chosen racists to run their country, all the mud-slingers realized that, lest Norway’s image as the land of peace and love be forever destroyed, they needed to change their tune about the Progress Party pronto. Solberg was quick to embrace her old rival Jensen; now Stoltenberg did much the same, declaring that while he opposes the Progress Party’s views on immigration and other issues, the party isn’t racist. One can discuss immigration, he said, without calling people racists. If only he’d taken that position all along!

Nûjen, who didn’t hide his disgust at Stoltenberg’s remarks, told about the time he did his act in New York not long after 9/11. First, he maintained that since 9/11 it’s been hard to get into the U.S. “when you look like me.” (Yeah, right.) He also repeated a “joke” he’d told in New York that, he claimed, had resulted in his getting thrown offstage. Here’s the “joke”: “It’s nice to be here in New York, but I also have some bad memories from New York. Because one of my relatives died on 9/11. It was he who flew the plane.” (Here’s a video of him telling the “joke” to a New York audience – presumably on another occasion, because this time he gets a laugh.) Absolutely everything about this part of Skavlan was disgusting. The “joke” was disgusting; the audience’s applause for it was disgusting. It was disgusting for Skavlan to have invited onto his first show after the new Norwegian government’s installation a lousy comic who he must’ve known would trash the Progress Party. And it was disgusting that Skavlan, instead of challenging this creep’s assertions about the party, used them as an excuse to confront Stoltenberg on the subject.

But, it turned out, there was more. It soon emerged that NRK, but not SVT, had cut out the most inflammatory minute or two of the show, in which Nûjen lectured Stoltenberg, saying that “just because you say you’re not a racist, or claim not to be preaching racism or Nazism, it doesn’t mean that you don’t every day do racist things, express racist opinions.” He cited calls in Norway for the deportation of Romanian gypsies: if that’s not racist, he demanded, what is? (By my count, Nûjen used the word racist a total of ten times during his interview.) When Skavlan pointed out that nobody from the Progress Party was present to defend it, Nûjen shot back: “Well, neither am I when they speak.” The sheeple applauded lustily. There’s been an intense debate in the Norwegian media as to whether NRK should have clipped out that part of the show. The real debate should revolve around the fact that Skavlan invited this guy on in the first place – and that Norwegian voters are forced to pay a license fee for the privilege of hearing some no-talent Swedish Muslim comic call them racists.

As noted, it was a disgusting spectacle. But it was an instructive one, too. Nûjen, though witless, is no fool. Everything he does onstage is cunningly calculated. In his interview – and, to judge by the available online evidence, in his act, too – he establishes early on the terms of his relationship with the audience. He’s a victim; they’re oppressors. Period. So whatever he says, they’re obliged to laugh, and thus implicitly affirm his account of Swedish society. If they don’t laugh, if they grumble, if they give any sign of challenging his views or the terms he’s laid down for their relationship, then there’s no question: they’re racists. Never mind that no other society in history has ever done as much as the Swedes (and Norwegians) have done for so many foreigners who’ve come to their shores from so far away. No, these Swedes who’ve gladly provided countless people like Nûjen and his family with a country to call home, and with boatloads of benefits to boot, are compelled to sit there while he rants about their racism and xenophobia – a label he’s plainly ready to slap on anyone who’s concerned about the stratospheric levels of Muslim immigration to Europe. He “jokes” about 9/11, but otherwise doesn’t touch on the many very good reasons for Europeans to be concerned about that immigration – among them Sweden’s own unenviable distinction of having the world’s second-highest incidence of rape.

In fact, Nûjen may well be a kind of genius. There’s no white guilt like Swedish white guilt, and few entertainers have ever exploited it as masterfully as he does. He knows exactly how his audiences have been trained from infancy to react when they hear words like Islam, immigration, racism, and xenophobia – and he plays those poor saps like Itzhak Perlman playing a violin. He walks in front of an audience expecting dhimmitude – and he gets it. That spectacle on Friday night was stunning, actually: for decades, Norway’s Labor Party has been the prime mover behind mass Muslim immigration into that country – but Nûjen, instead of showing gratitude for eveything Stoltenberg and his crew have done for Muslims, addressed him with breathtaking condescension, and knew he’d get away with it. He demands respect for himself and “people who look like me” (as he puts it), but sitting there next to the man who, until just the other day, was prime minister of Norway, he was utterly incapable of mustering up even a semblance of respect for the office, which is tantamount to having no respect for the country itself. In short, Nûjen exuded the insolence and contemptuousness of an impatient mullah who can’t wait for the day when he’s the one who’ll be calling the shots. The Swedes in Skavlan’s audience had to know, on some level, that that day is coming – for them sooner than most. Yet they applauded Nûjen enthusiastically – displaying not a hint of resistance; already behaving, indeed, like obedient subjects of imported masters.

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  • Hass

    This article has just turned my nausea of progressives up another notch.

  • Marlin B. Newburn

    By indoctrination the Swedes and Norwegians are stricken with Masochistic Altruism. After all, per programming, they’re supposed to like everyone in the world, no matter what harm they do to their citizens and their social structure.

    This is a recipe for social insanity.

  • Louis B Knockel

    Awful but true. The native Scandinavians are paying for the rope with which they will be hanged, and they are even laughing sheepishly while they tighten the noose around their necks.

    • Alvaro

      Sweden is rotten to the core with Marxism, and the younger generation has been brainwashed beyond repair.

      Norway has moved to the right politically and will hopefully be more in line with Denmark’s more restrictive immigration policy in the years to come. We just got our first Right/Progress Party government. Thank goodness those leftist lunatics are out of office.

  • Lawrence of Suburbia

    Of course they should’ve invited him. Maybe the Scandies are ‘sheeple’ but the thinking among them should be exposed to this lest they believe that their shrouded neighbors are pretty much like themselves.

  • Jakareh

    I’m with Özz Nûjen on one thing: Swedes (other Europeans also, but Swedes in particular) don’t deserve to rule themselves. I only wish their overlords would be something like along the lines of the Knights of Malta, instead of those of Nûjen’s ilk.

  • Peter J

    Not much of what Bruce Bawer says here is even remotely correct.

    Since I´m from Sweden I saw the whole show. They were talking about politics in Norway and Sweden. Nujen (correctly) pointed out that there´s racist elements in the wright wing populist party that now will be included in the new Norwegian government. When asked for an example of this racism, Nujen referred to calls that “all gypsies should be thrown out of Norway”. “If not that´s not racism, what is?” Nujen said. He was asked to deliver some proof of the accusation, and he did.

    If in America, some wright wing populist would publicly state that all puertoricans or jews should be “thrown out of the country” it would without doubt be considered racist.

    Bruce Bawer i just doing he allways does, no matter the topic: bashing immigrants/muslims. The words he chooses says it all: “dhimmitude”, “white guilt” etc. It has nothing to do with Özz Nujen, who is an atheist (like most Swedes) and a citizen of Sweden. But his name, parents background and skin color, that´s all it takes to trigger Bruce Bawers key reflexes.

    • Paul Austin Murphy

      Peter, I the video which the writer links, Ozz Nujen describes HIMSELF as a Muslim. Just a small point. Perhaps it depends on his audience what he describes himself as.

      Do you need to be from Sweden to know the whole truth about affairs of Sweden, as you imply? What if the entire show is on video – as it is?

      Bruce Bawer talks about infantile and argument-free Leftists ‘playing the race card’. And then, guess what, Peter J goes right ahead and says:

      “But his name, parents background and skin color, that´s all it takes to trigger Bruce Bawers key reflexes.”

      I’ve got news for you, Peter. And no, I’m not Swedish. The rape jihad in Sweden has nothing to do with race. It is primarily to do with Islamic misogyny and the ancient Muslim hatred of the kuffar. Now, if you are obsessed by race, as many Leftists are, and see even this in those terms, that’s your problem, not mine.

      Your purist and pious anti-racism is claiming victims in Sweden, as it it is worldwide. Stop grandstanding your anti-racist purity and start seeing Islam for what it can be and what it very often is.Look at the Muslim world and read some history…. unless history itself is racist.

      Stop cocooning yourself from the realities of Islam in order to keep yourself pure and free from the taint of racism. The only people who benefit from this is yourself and Islamic supremacists.

      • Peter J

        Here, you can read about “the Rape Jihad” (ha ha ha, that word)

        http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-19592372

        What you and BB are peddling here is racism and I’ll explain why I think so and why you think you’re not peddling it.

        I understand that it´s hard to accept, but etymology and meaning changes over time. What was once acceptable, is today considered racist. It’s the same with sexism and homophobia. What was once acceptable norm some decades ago is not so anymore. You can like it or dislike it but it´s a fact of life. You can’t have the same view on homosexuals, blacks, women like many in my grandfathers generation had. Deal with it.

        The definition of racism isn´t what it used to be in the 1930s. Or in the 50s. The meaning of the word has expanded. The old pseudo-scientific “biological” racism is almost nonexistent. And I’m sure that You and BB are anti-racists in this old meaning (maybe even “pious” anti-racists).

        But for you and BB culture functions as a nature. For you guys, culture and religion can never change. Therefore, culture gets the same properties as nature. And if you are a muslim, you are first and foremost a bearer of certain properties that goes along with being a muslim. You are not an individual. Your arguments is just a way of locking individuals and groups a priori into a genealogy, into a determination that is immutable. A muslim is a muslim is a muslim. And this is not how it works in the real world.

        This is a kind of neo-racism and its dominant theme is not, as I said, biological heredity, but the insurmountability of cultural differences, a racism which, at first sight, does not postulate the superiority of certain groups or peoples in relation to others but ‘only’ the harmfulness of abolishing frontiers, the incompatibility of lifestyles and traditions.

        And sure. Killing your daughter for marrying the wrong guy, that IS incompatible with “scandinavian lifestyle”. But, I can assure you Paul, that the few cases where this have happened, there is an clear consensus of no acceptance. The criminal (both christian and muslims (from ME)) have been dealt with swiftly and harshly by the Swedish legal system.

        I am a leftist, more so than you can imagine. And I wouldn’t hesitate to argue against any misogyny including misogyny stemming from islamic conservatives. But I can grant you that some leftists drag their feet in this matter. They do so just because there exists neo-racists like BB. But generally speaking, this accusation is basically a straw man from wright wing bigotts. Multiculturalism is about blending food, folk dance and shit. Not blending habeas corpus with mob rule. No leftists (no one) accepts different laws depending on where you come from. I’ve seen this accusation many times, but it´s a red herring.

        So Paul, stop reading Counter-Jihad pages and go out in the real world. I’ve travelled and lived in many parts of the world. And, as far as I can see, inequality, poverty and a feeling of being left behind, has always been the driving force behind fascist elements, whether these elements are islamic or something else.

      • Peter J

        Here, you can read about “the Rape Jihad” (ha ha ha, that word)

        http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-19592372

        What you and BB are peddling here is racism and I’ll explain why I think so and why you think you’re not peddling it.

        I understand that it´s hard to accept, but etymology and meaning changes over time. What was once acceptable, is today considered racist. It’s the same with sexism and homophobia. What was once acceptable norm some decades ago is not so anymore. You can like it or dislike it but it´s a fact of life. You can’t have the same view on homosexuals, blacks, women like many in my grandfathers generation had. Deal with it.

        The definition of racism isn´t what it used to be in the 1930s. Or in the 50s. The meaning of the word has expanded. The old pseudo-scientific “biological” racism is almost nonexistent. And I’m sure that You and BB are anti-racists in this old meaning (maybe even “pious” anti-racists).

        But for you and BB culture functions as a nature. For you guys, culture and religion can never change. Therefore, culture gets the same properties as nature. And if you are a muslim, you are first and foremost a bearer of certain properties that goes along with being a muslim. You are not an individual. Your arguments is just a way of locking individuals and groups a priori into a genealogy, into a determination that is immutable. A muslim is a muslim is a muslim. And this is not how it works in the real world.

        This is a kind of neo-racism and its dominant theme is not, as I said, biological heredity, but the insurmountability of cultural differences, a racism which, at first sight, does not postulate the superiority of certain groups or peoples in relation to others but ‘only’ the harmfulness of abolishing frontiers, the incompatibility of lifestyles and traditions.

        And sure. Killing your daughter for marrying the wrong guy, that IS incompatible with “scandinavian lifestyle”. But, I can assure you Paul, that the few cases where this have happened, there is an clear consensus of no acceptance. The criminal (both christian and muslims (from ME)) have been dealt with swiftly and harshly by the Swedish legal system.

        • Peter J

          I am a leftist, more so than you can imagine. And I wouldn’t hesitate to argue against any misogyny including misogyny stemming from islamic conservatives. But I can grant you that some leftists drag their feet in this matter. They do so just because there exists neo-racists like BB. But generally speaking, this accusation is basically a straw man from wright wing bigotts. Multiculturalism is about blending food, folk dance and shit. Not blending habeas corpus with mob rule. No leftists (no one) accepts different laws depending on where you come from. I’ve seen this accusation many times, but it´s a red herring.

          So Paul, stop reading Counter-Jihad pages and go out in the real world. I’ve travelled and lived in many parts of the world. And, as far as I can see, inequality, poverty and a feeling of being left behind, has always been the driving force behind fascist elements, whether these elements are islamic or something else.

        • Peter J

          …continued…

          I am a leftist, more so than you can imagine. And I wouldn’t hesitate to argue against any misogyny including misogyny stemming from islamic conservatives. But I can grant you that some leftists drag their feet in this matter. They do so just because there exists neo-racists like BB. But generally speaking, this accusation is basically a straw man from wright wing bigotts. Multiculturalism is about blending food, folk dance and shit. Not blending habeas corpus with mob rule. No leftists (no one) accepts different laws depending on where you come from. I’ve seen this accusation many times, but it´s a red herring.

          So Paul, stop reading Counter-Jihad pages and go out in the real world. I’ve travelled and lived in many parts of the world. And, as far as I can see, inequality, poverty and a feeling of being left behind, has always been the driving force behind fascist elements, whether these elements are islamic or something else.

        • Paul Austin Murphy

          What makes you think I need to be lectured to about things I didn’t actually bring up in my post? Are you assuming that people who dare to disagree with you must be intellectual imbeciles? That is supreme and typical Leftist arrogance.

          “You can’t have the same view on homosexuals,
          blacks, women like many in my grandfathers generation had. Deal with it.”

          You smug disgusting person. What makes you think I have a problem with women, gays and blacks? I AM NOT A STRAW TARGET, you cheap Leftist automaton. Try tackling what I have actually said instead of building up a racist straw target which will be so easy to burn. You shallow little man.

          I don’t need professorial lectures on race either. Do you think you are talking to a gullible first-year student here?

          I find that Leftists or ‘progressives’ are the most racist of all. And I bet you are a good example of that. The Left is obsessed by race. Positive racism or inverted racism. You can hardly see a black or Muslim person without seeing ‘oppression’ and victimhood. .

          • Peter J

            Paul, you missunderstand me.

            I’m sure that you DON´T have a problem with gays or women. That was examples of how language and attitudes change, not meant as an accusation. But you DO have a problem with muslims.

            I tried to explain that you and I probably don´t have the same defenitions of racism. I’m arguing that the definition of racism isn´t the same as it was in the 50s. But I think you still clinging on to that old narrow biological definition?

            Example: If someone say “-Black culture in america is inferiour to white culture, I mean, look at the crime rates among blacks”. Would you consider that racist? I think most people would. Though, that person could counter with saying “_Hey, I’m no racist, I’m strictly talking about culture here!”. Most people would smirk. Bruce Bawer is doing EXACTLY that, but with muslims.

            “The Left is obsessed by race.”

            No, the Left is obsessed with social injustice. It is inequality, poverty and a feeling of being left behind, that has always been the driving force behind fascist elements, whether these elements are islamic or something else.

          • Drakken

            So in other words you think that our western civilization is inferior to those of the 3rd world and we should somehow bow before the alter of diversity? Social justice is just commi speak for making everyone equally miserable. Admit it, your a communist.

          • Peter J

            I qoute myself again:

            I am a leftist, more so than you can imagine. And I wouldn’t hesitate to argue against any misogyny including misogyny stemming from islamic conservatives. But I can grant you that some leftists drag their feet in this matter. They do so just because there exists neo-racists like BB. But generally speaking, this accusation is basically a straw man from wright-wing bigotts. Multiculturalism is about blending food, folk dance and shit. Not blending habeas corpus with mob rule. No leftists (no one) accepts different laws depending on where you come from. I’ve seen this accusation many times, but it´s a red herring

          • objectivefactsmatter

            “Multiculturalism is about blending food, folk dance and shit. Not blending habeas corpus with mob rule.”

            Unfortunately you are wrong. Cultural and ethnic diversity is about blending food, folk dance and shit. Multiculturalism is “blending” fundamental values and taking the position that we can’t be “judgmental” about anyone else’s “cultural context.” And in rape cases this is precisely what happens when it comes to investigations and sentencing. And other matters related to people who make religious arguments for dragging their incompatible values in to our sovereign nations. With the assistance of socialist psychopaths and traitors.

          • objectivefactsmatter

            “Multiculturalism is about blending food, folk dance and shit. Not blending habeas corpus with mob rule.”

            Unfortunately you are wrong. Cultural and ethnic diversity is about blending food, folk dance and shift. Multiculturalism is “blending” fundamental values and taking the position that we can’t be “judgmental” about anyone else’s “cultural context.” And in rape cases this is precisely what happens when it comes to investigations and sentencing. And other matters related to people who make religious arguments for dragging their incompatible values in to our sovereign nations. With the assistance of socialist psychopaths and traitors.

          • ziggy zoggy

            Americans don’t have a problem with islamopithecines. Islamopithecines have a problem with Americans – and everybody else on the planet. They consider themselves to be at war with us.

            You leftists are pathologically obsessed with race. You think all non-Whites are incompetent children who need handouts and guidance.

            And social injustice is a Marxist shibboleth.

            With arguments so stupid, it’s little wonder America surpassed Europe long ago.

        • Paul Austin Murphy

          Anyone who uses terms like ‘neo’ should be shot. Do you think that impresses people? Did you read that in Chomsky or something?

          You sound like a member of the herd. That “Leftist herd of independent minds” which populate our universities in the UK and have such a firm hold on, yes, Sweden.

          You are shallow but don’t know it. Using the word ‘neo’ doesn’t disguise that you think in soundbites. You argue against straw targets and accuse them of believing things they don’t believe. You cannot even comprehend or allow the possibility that people may have views on Islam that have nothing AT ALL to do with race. Your thinking really is that shallow.

          In fact, I’ve already wasted too much time on this paltry member of the Leftist Tribe of Independent Minds.

          • Peter J

            Paul, as I said, I’m sure that either you or Bawer are racist in the narrow “biological” sence of the word. I am also sure that Bawer does “have views on Islam that have nothing AT ALL to do with race.” I understand that. I really do.

            What I’m arguing for here is that Bawer are defines “culture” and “religion” as if they are unchangeble enteties, like biological race. Hence, there is no functional difference between culture and race in, in Bawers universe.

            I asked you a question:

            If Bill says: “-Black culture in america is inferiour to white culture, I mean, look at the crime rates among blacks”.

            Would you consider that racist?

            I think most people would. Though, Bill could counter with saying:”-Hey, I’m no racist, I’m strictly talking about culture here!”. I think most people would see through that and see that what Bill tries to do, is to intertwine black culture with criminal records/statistics.

            Bruce Bawer i doing EXACTLY that kind of thinking with muslims.

            “Anyone who uses terms like ‘neo’ should be shot.”

            I am sorry, english isn’t my native language. I’m not sure what offends you with that particular word and I wasn’t trying to “impresse people”. I used it in the same way as you say for instance Neo-platonism.

            http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neoplatonism

            Capishe?

          • Drakken

            You of the suicidal left really do amaze me with your twisting of euphemisms and words to suit your own agenda in the face of the bloody facts, liberalism truly is a mental disorder. How much do you want to bet that you don’t live in a cultural enriched area and that you live amongst your own fellow white Swedes?

          • Peter J

            I’m not a liberal, I’m a social democrat. Admittedly, that includes some liberal values, but also some socialism.

            The social democratic story of of Sweden is at large a success story of the last century. Sure there’s been setbacks and moments that no one should be proud of. But at large, Sweden is a good country to live in.
            Compared to most countries, and certainly the US, Sweden is better off. Better education, more percentage in universities, better health care, higher life expectancy, lower infant death rate and on and on.

            This is not “twisted euphemisms”. This is uncontroversial facts.

          • therealpm

            “Sweden is a good country to live in”

            Try telling that to all the Swedish women who have been raped by Muslim immigrants.

          • Drakken

            Your a bloody communist and it shows in your word and deeds, your success story is going broke, because you useful idiots of the left sooner or later run out of other peoples money.

          • objectivefactsmatter

            We’ve also accomplished a hell of a lot more, so the comparison is not informative. Just wait for your chickens to come home.

          • Paul Austin Murphy

            “I am a leftist, more so than you can imagine.” – Peter J

            “I’m not a liberal, I’m a social democrat. Admittedly, that includes some liberal values, but also some socialism.” – Peter J

            I’m sure you’ll wiggle your way out of that too by saying something sad and desperate such as ”Leftist’ means social democrat’.

            Does defeating the racist and fascist enemy include saying contradictory things, as well as defending the indefensible (as in Islam and the behaviour of Muslims)?

          • ziggy zoggy

            Sweden is a good country to get gang raped in. Soon it will be islamic and dirt poor. And Swedes don’t have better educations, health care and mortality rates than White and Asian Americans. But I guess you consider yourself superior to a Blacks and Mexicans in America.

            Racist.

          • David

            Drakken I picture you wearing jackboots and shouting at the screen when Obama comes on, while you chug another Budweiser and sharpen your machete. Is this accurate? But seriously….chill out- it’ll all be fine; the Muslims won’t eat you. Besides, you’re not even kosher.

          • ziggy zoggy

            The koranimals DO eat people like zombies. Do a quick web search.

            And the ones wearing jackboots in America are Obama and his goons – Homeland Security, the IRS, DOJ, EPA, ACORN, etc.

          • Drakken

            That is funny coming from a couch potato like you, as a matter of fact, I work in the ME and am there as we speak, I do the work prissy little puzzies like you can’t or won’t do and you would probably need years of therapy to get over what you would see. I drink Bourbon, not that garbage bud, and my education level is on pare with yours, so please spare me the condensation of utter stupidity and your precious feelings. Islam and the west are incompatible with our western civilization and if you knew any history, you would know that, instead of trying to fit a round peg into a square hole and calling it all good.

          • Paul Austin Murphy

            Peter,

            Did you know that Nazis are using exactly the same argument as you about the culture-race dichotomy? You are saying that talk about culture is code for talk about race. Nazis say more or less the same thing. That is, race determines culture therefore it all boils down to race. As usual, you Leftists and Nazis FUSE on race and on so much else, including Jews, ISRAEL, the evils of capitalism, the promise of a better society, pure leaders, class equality, etc.

            Maybe your obsession with race is a result that you think the same way as Nazis think, save the fact your race-obsession is inverted or positive. Marxist or Communist racism pre-dates National Socialism by about seventy years. Marx made a fatal connection between Jews and capitalism way back in the 1850s. The National Socialists picked up on that in the 1920s.

            You Leftists have been obsessed with race and the Jews since that time. You actually beat the Nazis with the fact your inverted racism doesn’t disguise it. And the Leftist monomania with Jews and capitalism, which pre-dates Nazism by decades, doesn’t help.

            Perhaps a bit of self-analysis and self-criticism would help take you off your self-righteous anti-racist pedestal.

          • Peter J

            Clearly, you are laughably desperate, calling me a Nazi, or at least trying to invoke that connection. I have written nothing of the sort and you know it.

            “You are saying that talk about culture is code for talk about race.”

            No, I’m saying that Bruce Bawers definition of “culture” makes the two fuse. Did you understand my question?

            I asked:

            If Bill says: “-Black culture in america is inferiour to white culture, I mean, look at the crime rates among blacks”.

            Would you consider that racist?

            The reason why I ask is that I can see that we have two very different definitions of what racism is. Could you at least admitt that? I have CLEARLY stated that either you or BB consider yourself racist by YOUR definition. Still you accuse me of accusing you for being racist.

            I am not “obsessed with race”. In the CONTRARY: I have beyond any doubt, as clearly as I can, stated, and I quote myself:

            “…inequality, poverty and a feeling of being left behind, has always been the driving force behind fascist elements, whether these elements are islamic or something else.”

            Do you understand that this means that I think social inequality is the important factor, not race? I’m not interested in race at all. But I do know a racist when I see one. I am also not interested of Rhinos, but I do know one when I see one. Then you can haggle about white rhinos, black rhinos, sumatran rhinos and what not. I don’t care and I’m not interested.

            But one thing is certain. Bawer doesnt allow muslims to be individuals. For him, if you are a muslim, you are first and foremost a bearer of ceartain defined characteristics that you personally have to answer for. That’s a kind of racism.

          • Warren Raymond

            “-Black culture in america is inferiour to white culture, I mean, look at the crime rates among blacks”.

            Would you consider that racist?

            No. Its a fact.

            It stands on its own. No amount of spin can change that.

          • Peter J

            At least you are honerable about it. Paul Austin Murphy ducked the question three times…

          • ziggy zoggy

            You are a racist for equating American Blacks with a separate culture. They speak the same language as Whites, eat the same foods, listen to the same music and share in all the things Whites share. They do not share a communal brain with identical opinions on every subject.

            High Black crime rates have nothing to do with culture or poverty.

          • ziggy zoggy

            Equating religion and culture with race is idiotic. Don’t accuse others of doing it, you hypocrite.

            Islamic culture and religion are demonstrably inferior to all others – except Marxism, which kills even more people than islam. It’s debatable which of those two failures is more destructive and stupid.

            Bawer is right. You lefties ALWAYS accuse everybody who disagrees with you of being racist. That is deranged behavior.

          • David

            Anyone who uses the phrase “x/y/z should be shot” doesn’t belong in a civilised society founded on the principles of free speech and the right to liberty of personal expression. Read some Voltaire and go buy an air rifle and get it out of your system, you Neanderthal. And as for your attempt to accuse Peter of being a pseud- take a closer look at the situation….the guy speaks English with greater erudition than you, a native speaker! I daresay he’s therefore a damned sight brighter than you.

          • Paul Austin Murphy

            You sad man! It was a joke. So it’s true. You people are so far up your own political arses that you no longer have a sense of humour…. Of course Peter J is more intelligent than me – he’s left-wing. That’s true by definition, isn’t it?

          • ziggy zoggy

            People who defend the atrocities of islamopithecines and attack conservative Americans don’t belong in a civilized society. Go buy a koran and a burka and submit, you dhimmie tool.

        • Drakken

          Take your race card and shove it where the sun don’t shine, that word has been used and abused to the point it has zero meaning anymore and can no longer be used as a bludgeon to silence dissent. Enjoy your diversity and multicultural nightmare while it lasts. Funny how you lefty lunatics deny that there is a rape epidemic from muslims and whistle past the graveyard. Darwin loves people like you.

          • Peter J

            There is no “rape epidemic”. That’s ridicolous.

            http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-19592372

            I could find the same “proof” about america in less than 5 sec:

            http://www.topix.com/forum/city/jacksonville-fl/T3VET66FM3JBN8BBC

          • Drakken

            You are either ignorant, or you are living in denial. In Sweden, that means you dumbazz, 1 in 4 women at this point in time will be raped by a foreign ingrate, those are facts. In America we have the 2rd Amendment to protect ours from harm, and we use it everyday here. Your justice system there is a bloody joke. Funny how communist like you scream of the virtues of multiculturalism, yet live in the lily white suburbs preaching to the rest of us how we should just accept the 3rd world living amongst us. Your Hypocracy knows no bounds.

          • therealpm

            I’m glad you think it’s funny. Now perhaps you’d like to explain why it’s so funny to all the Swedish women who have been raped.

            As I stated above, the BBC are very unreliable as a source as they habitually lie about Islam.

          • Peter J

            No, BBC is a quite reliable source in these matters. At least much more realiable than anynomous wright-wing blogs.

            More here:

            http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2011/03/denial-science-chris-mooney

          • therealpm

            The BBC is totally unreliable when it comes to Islam. They covered up the systematic gang rape of young girls by Pakistanis for years, while at the same time vilifying anyone who brought the issue into the limelight. To my mind that makes them complicit in those rapes.

            Needless to say, had it been Pakistani girls being raped by English gangs then the story would have been headline news on the BBC, and on all the other media.

          • Drakken

            Your so full of sh** your eyes are floating, your try at leftist propaganda is amazing that even someone as dumb as you tries to sell it to us who know better. Heres a hint dumbazz, nobody is buying what your selling commi.

          • ziggy zoggy

            You don’t even have the illusion of credibility when you link to Mother Jones. WTF?! The BBC isn’t noxious and phony enough?

            You’re a phony too. You’re about as Swedish as a steaming pile of camel dung.

          • ziggy zoggy

            The BBC lies about every subject under the sun. The world it describes on a daily basis is a fantasy. Dr Seuss books are more reliable.

          • ziggy zoggy

            Sweden has the second highest rape rate in the world, after South Africa. You are a lying reprobate.

          • David

            Hey Drakken,

            Sorry to be the one to tell you this but you’re related to every single Muslim, Jew, African, chinaman and Hindu on earth :) And you don’t even have to go back that far to find these cousins of yours: if you’re of any southern Spanish stock you’re almost 100% guaranteed to be a direct descendant of Mohammed!

            Irish? Oh well, you’re related to all those “awful” Russian “commies” by less than 22 generations.

            Got some German blood? Ah well you’re related very closely to every Swedish socialist on the planet.

            And, sadly for me, if you’re of white Northern European stock then I’m related route another racist book burner :-0

            Y’all have a nice day now and do some book readin’

          • ziggy zoggy

            So which book do you prefer? Das Kapital or the unholy koran? They are wholly incompatible but you think Europe can survive with both.

            And very, very few Americans have islamopithecines swinging from their family trees.

          • Drakken

            Obviously your educated beyond your capability and your arrogance offends me. I am 1st generation American of Prussian and Austrian stock. My book reading is just fine thank you very much as I don’t live in the south. Here let me help you with that book learning thingy. All people, cultures and religion are not all equal, period. Western Civilization has given you everything that you enjoy today, including that fancy edumacation you gots. I know this will offend those petty precious feelings of yours, but our culture is worth defending and encouraging. So before you throw out that race card , tell the Japanese that they are wrong for keeping their culture a mono culture. So why are we in the wrong for wanting the same thing?

        • Mathew

          “The thing is, the number of reported rapes has been going up in Sweden – it’s almost trebled in just the last seven years. In 2003, about 2,200 offences were reported by the police, compared to nearly 6,000 in 2010.

          So something’s going on.” – Sweden’s rape rate under the spotlight

          Poor, poor Peter J did not think we would read the whole article or get into the weeds.

          When dealing with the left , you have to go into the weeds with every subject. The left will talk airily in lofty terms like some aristocrat of yore. But us, realists, know that the devil is in the details.

          There was the recent report that 700 or so women & 300 children were raped by cultural enrichers.

          Are you a cultural enricher Peter J or a leftists Quisling?

          • Peter J

            Actually, the rate of rapes has been MORE than tripled.

            I could tell you why but I doubt you are interested to hear the reasons.

            “Are you a cultural enricher Peter J or a leftists Quisling?”

            I understand that for people like you its more important who you speak to than what the actual arguments are. You call me a traitor, just because I dont agree with you. Pathetic.

          • Mathew

            The same Peter J that trotted out the BBC article ( a news organization of fine repute, which PJ Media recently tore apart for its’ perfidy by omission and by inverting the normal pyramid of headline, nut graph and body), but now all the sudden Pete J cannot give any more reasons. His hands are too weak to type one more link.

          • Warren Raymond

            No. You have identified yourself as a traitor to your people, your culture and civilisation. You are aiding and abetting those who came to replace us with a mohammedan proletariat. That’s what makes you a traitor. That makes you a despicable worm.

          • ziggy zoggy

            Yes it does.

          • ziggy zoggy

            The rate of rapes has more than tripled? How many times have you been raped? Was it because you wore provocative clothing that wasn’t prophet approved?

        • Warren Raymond

          Turning reality inside out and changing words to mean what they don’t is a leftist obsession based on cynicism and the idea that the ends justify the means.

          I suggest you to live among blacks so you can learn what racism really means.

        • defcon 4

          Ha, ha, ha retard, read about the Love Jihad in Pakistain (and Bangladesh) being committed against Hindu women and wonder to yourself if it’s not all part of the same, twisted, sick theology of islam.

        • ziggy zoggy

          Racism is a social construct? Very original, moron. And as nonsensical today as it was the first time some dimwit made the same claim.

          Islam is a genocidal, totalitarian, racist, misogynistic, homophobic, slave loving, rape cult founded by a pedophile.

          Gang raping islamopithecines in Sweden get community service – even when they’re known to be repeat offenders. That may be a harsh punishment by Swedish standards, in which case you people are even more deranged than I thought.

        • Omar Sharbash

          Don’t bother, Peter.

          A majority of the people that comment on these pages visit only to flame their prejudices. See Zig-a-Zig-ah and Defecation 4.

          Your points are perfectly lucid. The nub of the matter is whether or not Islamic precepts can adapt to the pressures modernity exerts. I think it’s very likely a cultural production, which Islam is, will eventually yield in the areas necessary – and I can provide evidence it’s already happening – whereas the nutters here and elsewhere virulently promulgate a position stipulating, as you wrote, that ‘culture functions as a nature’.

          • ziggy zoggy

            Owmy Soreballs,

            The koran is supposedly the direct word of allah and Satan, so it must be followed to the letter and is incapable of reform. Islam hasn’t changed in 1400 years and cannot change. Any islamopithecine who tried would be an apostate and apostasy carries a death sentence in islam.

            You are defending a vile death cult that brutalizes women, children, gays and non-Whites.

          • Omar Sharbash

            Does interpretation mean nothing to you?

            I’ll give you a concrete example relating to punishment for apostasy in Islam. It used to be that nearly all Muslims held an apostate should be killed. More recent polls show a marked shift in favour of freedom of religion.

            Q: Why the change?
            A: A growing number of Muslim Islamic scholars have sought to contextualise the ostensible commands, repeated a handful of times in the canons of Hadith, decreeing capital punishment for apostates. The newer interpretation modifies the orthodox narrative, removing its absoluteness and replacing it with a dose of historical sensitivity: at the time of Muhammad, it was often the case an apostate would be committing treason. Given that that axiom no longer holds true today, capital punishment for apostasy falls away.

            Another question might be asked. Why now has the Muslim world decided to reinterpret this legislation? Simply put, because of the rest of the world. They realise their methods are no longer operational in an environment characterised by its smallness so are taking evasive action. I’m arguing that the same suite of pressures will force further changes.

            In conclusion, there’s been change of the sort you claim is impossible.

          • Drakken

            For every fatawa from a so called moderate reformed imam or religious leader, there are thousands from the so called fundamentalist that are not moderate, so who is going to win? I am not betting on you so called moderates because one of these days one of your more fundamentalist types is going to do something extremely egregious to us infidels that is going to make your point null and void, and were going to let allah sortem out. One way or another islam and west are on a collision course.

          • ziggy zoggy

            As I wrote, the koran is not allowed to be interpreted. It says so in black and white, and the ‘pithecines follow its literal instructions like the mindless savages they are.

            An unnamed and phony poll is not concrete evidence of anything but your dishonesty. The majority of islamopithecines support everything written in the koran. Islamic “scholars” are just flea bitten ignoramuses who chant the koran all day. They are about as learned as the village goats they share their communal toilets with.

          • Omar Sharbash

            Right on, dude. Just throw in a few insults and hope no one realises you’ve offered zilch as a counter argument. Nice, psychopath.

      • David

        It’s funny, Paul, but I’ve noticed of late that rightist doomsday reactionaries like yourself are getting a little bit lazy when it comes to this “race card” rubbish- the race card BS is abused by the Zionist right wing more than any other racial group in western politics and yet folk such as you are so often strangely silent on it. Dare to say anything about the horrific, abominable mass murder of kids in Palestinian and, lo and behold(!), someone on the right calls you an anti-Semite! Luckily I’m an Irish Catholic who grew up in a truly free city-state called London and therefore I say what I want, beholden to no corrupt agenda or clique. Race card my a_se.

        • Paul Austin Murphy

          David,

          How many soundbites and bits of jargon can you fit in one post? – ‘Rightist’, ‘reactionary’, ‘Zionist’, ‘mass murder’. When you take these away, what’s left? Nothing! You sound like Private Eye’s Dave Spart.

          When did I mention Israel? Which ‘doomsday’? Are you responding to what I’ve written, or to what you think I believe or to what you want me to have written?

          ‘Mass murder’ of kids in Israel? Really? Less than 60,000 have died in the Israel-Palestine conflict in the last 60 years (much from Muslim-on-Muslim violence). More people have died in Syria in the last two years due to Muslim-on-Muslim violence. In 15 years, the Sudanese Islamists killed and were responsible for the death of over two million – between the 1980s and 200s. The Turkish state has killed over 20,000 Kurdish villagers in the last twenty years. How many Palestinian kids have been killed in this ‘abominable mass murder’, exactly? I seen you stopped yourself using the word ‘genocide’. Such self-control.

          I suggest you stop using Leftist soundbites about Israel and everything else and start, well, thinking. Being a Leftist doesn’t automatically mean you are politically and morally sophisticated; though most Leftists think it does.

          Do the hard work for once and don’t rely on terms like ‘Zionist’ and ‘mass murder’. Oh, you forgot to mention ‘Israeli apartheid’. Shame on you.

          Yes, I too have used the term ‘Leftist’, but that’s based on what you have written and not on what I guess you believe, as you have done in my case.

        • ziggy zoggy

          Zionist right-wing? What is that? Moses and King David sitting on the right side of Heaven? Genocide of Psuedostinian terrorist kids? City state of Londonistan?

          You’re delusional.

        • Drakken

          There it is right there, Zionist right wing. You ignorant leftys really do reach don’t you? Oh yes and your sympathy and empathy for a bunch of bloody savages in Gaza who bring their misery upon themselves is most touching. Before you have a complete meltdown, I am Catholic as well and did go to a Catholic University, so I don’t know what kind of Marxist garbage they are teaching with no critical thinking skills today, but it must be say, you didn’t get your moneys worth.

    • KhidonNOR

      As a Norwegian I challenge you to identify and name any racist(s) in the Progressive Party.

      No, Norway is NOT talking about throwing the gypsies out. This is yet another lie propagandized from the Scandinavian hard left.

      We have around 500 gypsies in Norway with Norwegia citizenship. Costing Norwegian taxpayers around 10 million USD each year. Crimes excluded.

      A project from the 70s to 1991, trying to provide the gypsies with permanent job, housing and studies, costed around 1 trillion Norwegian Kroner (approx. 130 million USD). The project were defunded after a report concluded that no verifiable positive results could be seen. All houses were smashed and zero gypsies successfully in a permanent job or academic degree.

      Source:
      http://www.na24.no/article1167838.ece

      The group you are talking about are non-Norwegian citizens, staying illegally as professional beggars and/or criminals. Most of them happens to be gypsies.

      After years of providing them with various social welfare programs, we finally are talking about kicking some of them out.

      Only a racist, Swedish hypocrite like you, who ONLY see the skin color, can find that racist.

      Your claim that Özz Nujen is an atheist, is yet another lie from you. Mr. Nujen openly declares that he is a Muslim in his own op-ed. Jag är även muslim (I am even a Muslim).

      Source.
      http://www.da.se/home/da/home.nsf/unid/97DD73EEE770BC7BC125738B0031FFB5?OpenDocument

      This is what we have to deal with in Scandinavia. Pathological liars, like Peter J, from the hard left. Normally their lies will go unchallenged in the media and academia, or even “confirmed” by various leftist “experts”.

      • Peter J

        I tried to answer a long answer, but it was rejected.

        Your first source is an opinion peace, not facts. But I’m sure gypsies are more criminal than average. Social studies have shown this for decades.

        If the accusation about “throwing out all gypsies” is wrong, I my apologies. I didnt call Framskredspartiet (progress party) a racist party. I call them a anti-immigrant wright-wing populist party.

        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right-wing_populism

        Your second source, about Özz Nujen: he says “Im first of all a human being” and then he continues to say that i among other things are a muslim. You are right. But given the context, he means that his cultural background is muslim (and kurdish). I heard him on the radio say that he didnt believe in God.

        • KhidonNOR

          The source that I referred to is a news article, based on a longer article behind a pay wall, from Norway’s main business news magazine, Kapital. Primary sources are various Norwegian official government agencies. To state that the rebuttal of your lies is not based on facts, but opinions, is just absurd.

          I am not talking about gypsies in Norway being more criminal than the average Norwegians. I am talking about a group of more than 500 persons where NOT ONE is registered with a job. They are ALL either criminal and/or welfare recipients. Yet you call Norwegian for racists. If this was a sub group of indigenous Norwegians, it would never have been tolerated. The racism you are whining about is there, but clearly against Norwegians. Not gypsies.

          You claiming to have heard something on the radio, is not documentation. Himself stating openly that he is a Muslim in his own op-ed, is. Your accusations against Mr. Bawer is demonstrable false. I register that you couldn’t care less. Obviously you are used to smear people with your lies. Screaming racism at the drop of a hat. As a true Scandinavian leftie, guess that is the only kind of “argument” you are able to muster.

          • Peter J

            “You stated that there are racists elements in the Progress Party (Fremskrittspartiet). Again I must ask you. Where and who? Give me your documentation.”

            First we must establish a definition of what racism is. Did you read my (rather lengthy) answer to Paul Austin Murphy? I suspect you and I have different approaches.

            If one google “Fremskrittspartiet+rasism” (“Progress Party + racism”) you get 387 000 hits. Five out of the ten first is articles that describes The Progress Party as racist, or having racist elements. But something tells me you’re not satisfied with that… We all know how those political correct, pesky leftists control the media, right?… just a fellow leftist wrighting that article…

            Hmm…if I cite some academic sources that states there are racist bigotts within the Progress Party? No, we all know how They control the academic world…

            ‘Fact is, KhidonNOR, both you and I know, that you wouldnt accept ANY evidence that suggests racist elements within the Progress Party, ’cause by definition, anyone who accuses The Progress Party of racism, is a muslim-loving leftist who is not to be trusted.

            I for one DON’T think PP is racist to its core. I called them “a right-wing populist party”. But sure as hell there are racist elements nestling within the party, one must be dumb, deaf and num not to see that.

        • JVR

          Mr Peter J you state above that “But I’m sure gypsies are more criminal than average. Social studies have shown this for decades…” This kind of statement is racist to the core because it gives substance (as the Left would argue) to something which is a mere “social construct” (being Roma).

          BTW, the word “G*ps*” is racist, the proper term is “Roma” (and it is in any case, as any American Leftist will tell you, non-existent because it is only a social construct by your brain).

          I also observe that you would not dare citing “scientific studies” correlating other qualities, in addition to “criminality” to other social constructs (whose members are, in the West, holy objects).

          • Peter J

            You are just arguing against your own picture “social construction. Clearly, you are not interested of a fair debate.

          • JVR

            No Mr Peter J, you have to try harder.

            You are clearly not aware that in North America the Left argues that race is a social construct and not biological at all. You made a similar reference above somewhere in the dozens of reply’s you have posted. The European Left has a similar approach, arguing by implication, as you do, that there is not really any essential difference between different peoples. Greeks are the same as Swedish are the same as Egyptians are the same as Zulus. And absurd position, but then the Left has always been absurd.

            You cannot have it both ways. Either the Roma is real (physical) and not a figment of your imagination, or they are a social construct which is non-existent and only apparent because of our psychology.

            So next time you pass by a “Gypsy” family, you should consider whether they are really Gypsy, and if you decide they are, whether their existence makes it more likely that they will be criminals. If you should decide this, then you are guilty of racial profiling, something outlawed in some places. This is why we put 80-year old (white) grandmothers through scanners at airports, as if they have been blowing up planes.

            So go back to the Science, there are some interesting findings about humans which the Left ignores studiously (while they proclaim that they believe in Science because they believe in Climate Change — interestingly enough the data on Climate Change is far less secure than some other data).

          • Peter J

            I’m not sure I understand you correctly. A social construction could be “a marriage”. The fenomena of marriage is of course a social construction. It doesnt mean that marriges isn’t real. It becomes real because people accept marriages.

            Your dollar bills are just pieces of paper. Their value i socially constructed in the sence that when enough people recognize them as worthless, they become worthless.

            Of course we are biological beings. But the way we choose to divide in categories, that is a social construct.

            “This is why we put 80-year old (white) grandmothers through scanners at airports, as if they have been blowing up planes.”

            Oh, so we don’t put black grandmothers througt scanners?

            We put RANDOM people through scanners. The moment we start profiling, the terrorist/smuggler will adopt to our profiling. But you can’t outsmart randomness. That is why we have it.

          • JVR

            Oh yes, you can outsmart randomness by using information about it. It would be far more efficient to leave out 80 year old grand-mothers and only scan 22 year old males. That is profiling, but it will be far more efficient.

            So stop the bull.

            Sorry, you can tell by genetic tests to which casts someone in India belongs. That shows that casts are real, biological and the separation there is only about 1000 years. Other populations of humans have alleles which will tell you with 100% certainty the geographic admixture of a person, to many decimal places. The categories are not social constructs, unfortunately. B ut then the left only accepts science if it is about climate change, is it not?

            You ignored my Ps. What makes you think that you lot, who cannot even integrate the Roma in 1000 years, will integrate Malmo into Sweden?

            Let me predict… it is going to be a fail, and many Swedes, now lapsed Lutherans, will convert, rather than live in dhimmitude. (Of course, religion is a social construct, but as we saw with Nero and Constantine the Great, such social constructs can have lasting consequences).

            You demonstrate two things (1) how ill-educated the Swedish Left really is, and (2) how naive you lot are about the true nature of humans (I assure you that the Third World people you so love and admire, more than you love Sweden, are not Leftwingers like you).

            Ps. Actually, if you had any brains you would have realised by now that you are a neo-Marxist (you argue essentially that humans find their identity in their economic class, like Marxists do the world over).

          • Peter J

            I dont understand how a person would trick a random system. But beside that, I have no problem with profiling suspects in general. But at airports, its not cheaper. My source: “Liars and outliers”, by security expert Bruce Schneier. Book reviewed here: http://www.informationweek.com/personal-tech/science-technology/liars-and-outliers-by-bruce-schneier/232600022

            About the Indian casts. I’m not sure what you think you’re arguing against. There is no contradiction between recognizing biological traits (e.g. skin colour) among humans and recognizing that a lot of things in our societies are social constructions.

            Anyone argue against this, left-winger or wright-winger, they are crazy. But having that said, there is no way of describing a certain group in certatin psycological characteristics. Given any group of let’s say some hundred thousands, or a few millions, you will have the same normal distrubition of, for example introvert and extrovert characters.

            There might be some (leftists) who doesnt accept biology. But most do. I could recommend you “A Darwinian Left, by Peter Singer.

            “You ignored my Post-script. What makes you think that you lot, who cannot even integrate the Roma in 1000 years, will integrate Malmo into Sweden?”

            This proofs you lack basic historic knowledge. “Europe” haven´t tried to integrate Romas “for a thousand years” Thats a ridicolous statement in so many ways. On the contrary to integration, Romas have been outcasts, not allowed into the peasant societies of middle age Europe. They have been hunted, from village to village, country to country. Sub consequently, they have during the centuries developed a strong counter-culture against the surrounding society. This has served them, in the sence that they havent all been killed (where are the Hugenotts, Nestorians and many more today?) Not even the effective Nazi death machine killed them all, cause they werent documented properly, and they traveled around, unlike the more obedient jews. This is why a higher percentage of Romas survived the holocaust.

            It doesnt serve them well today, that´s for sure. Some changes are slow.

          • Peter J

            “You demonstrate two things: (1) how ill-educated the Swedish Left really is, and (2) how naive you lot are about the true nature of humans (I assure you that the Third World people you so love and admire, more than you love Sweden, are not Leftwingers like you).”

            1)You clearly dont know much about the left, and surely nothing about the Swedish left.

            2)you are very naive in that you think that I “love and admire” people in the third world. I do nothing o the sort. You are constantly attacking Straw men. I dont like anti-muslim bigotry, thats all. And, to point out the obvious: I dont aprove of ANY sort of bigotry, for instance muslims attacking christians just because they are christians, wich is happening today in present Syria. No bigotry or racism can be excused. At all.

            I have done military service in Sweden (compulsary untill some years back). I know why and how to kill people. I am by no means a pacifist.

            “Ps. Actually, if you had any brains you would have realized by now that you are a neo-Marxist (you argue essentially that humans find their identity in their economic class, like Marxists do the world over).”

            Yes, I self-identify with that. Economic classes does matter. But it’s not the only factor, though inportant. A middle class engineer from Sweden might very well have more in common with a french, peruvian, indian engineer, and so on. A 20 yo worker at McDonalds in the US might listen to the same Britney Speers as a Turkish McDonalds employee. And the upper class have never had that much of a problem getting along. Or do you think Lady Diana and Dodi al Fayed had a lot of religious clashes at the dinner table?

            Denying classes is like denying global warming: it is to deny reality.

          • Drakken

            Only a communist like you would fall for global warming ad a classless society.

          • ziggy zoggy

            You are bigoted against conservatives. You call them right-wingers. And claiming a person is defined by their economic “class” denies reality. Sweden is egalitarian and equal. Socialism guarantees that, right?

            You stupid Marxists don’t even know how contradictory your economic fantasies are. A rich Marxist college professor is every bit a stupid as an unemployed Occupy Wall St loser, a Chavista peon in Venezuela or a Swedish socialist.

            And islamopithecines hate all of you.

          • ziggy zoggy

            You are lying again. Poorly. You have argued that islamic culture is the same as an islamic race: in other words, a social structure.

            And old White Christian women are harassed at airports to avoid profiling islamopithecines. There is nothing random about it.

        • Drakken

          Ozz Nujen is a muslim first and foremost and is a 3rd world ingrate. Useful idiots of the leftist communist persuasion like you always buy into the false narrative that all cultures are all equal, when it is clear as day that the 3rd world is incompatible with our 1st world.

          • Peter J

            This is what I consider racism: to say that Ozz Nujen is “incompatible with our 1st world” because he comes from Kurdistan. Note also the word “our”, meaning not him. He cant belong to our” world ’cause he has a muslim cultural background.

          • objectivefactsmatter

            Those who can or will not assimilate should not immigrate. How’s that for you? That’s the objection.

          • Omar Sharbash

            To what extent have Jews assimilated into Western society?

          • ziggy zoggy

            Are you kidding? Have you ever seen a movie? Been to a Dr? Hired a lawyer? Unless a Jew is Hassidic or wearing a Yarmulke, you can’t even tell he is Jewish. Jews do not have neighborhoods full of roving gangs who attack unarmed Gentiles on the streets. They are not overwhelmingly on public welfare.

          • Omar Sharbash

            Integration is not the same as assimilation. I’m not doubting Jews are wonderfully integrated into society. But are they assimilated?

            I’m fixating on assimilation because that’s what OFM suggested as a metric to decide suitability of immigrants.

          • ziggy zoggy

            They are every bit as American as I am – unlike the islamopithecine scum who are misfits wherever they go.

          • objectivefactsmatter

            “I’m fixating on assimilation because that’s what OFM suggested as a metric to decide suitability of immigrants.”

            We can’t fixate on single words in isolation until we understand the full context. Obviously when talking about immigrants we’re not talking about having them assimilate as clones. Humans are not robots. Cultural assimilation is putting the focus on the immigrant’s need to adapt while integrating. Integration seems more neutral and could be understood as allowing that the receiving culture should bend as well.

            But I’m OK with either word because it’s up to the author to add clarity with context and then according to follow up questions and responses.

            Definition of ASSIMILATION

            1a : an act, process, or instance of assimilating

            b : the state of being assimilated

            2: the incorporation or conversion of nutrients into protoplasm that in animals follows digestion and absorption and in higher plants involves both photosynthesis and root absorption

            3: change of a sound in speech so that it becomes identical with or similar to a neighboring sound

            4: the process of receiving new facts or of responding to new situations in conformity with what is already available to consciousness

            Definition of: in·te·gra·tion noun ˌin-tə-ˈgrā-shən

            1: the act or process or an instance of integrating: as a : incorporation as equals into society or an organization of individuals of different groups (as races)
            b : coordination of mental processes into a normal effective personality or with the individual’s environment

          • Drakken

            They are of Western culture unlike you inbred 3rd world savages.

          • Omar Sharbash

            Are you actually gonna bring up the issue of inbreeding in a sub-discussion about Jews?!

          • objectivefactsmatter

            That’s an interesting question because they are often accused of this failure. I think that’s largely bogus.

            For one thing, this is a Judeo Christian society. We get most of our key values from their ancient texts. There are however distinctions and some choose to remain segregated in non-offensive ways, the way that many foreign nationals choose to remain among people they can relate to. But the salients are related to obeying laws and expectations about how to resolve conflicts.

            Jews don’t demand that non-Jews obey Jewish law or accommodate their cultural and religious expectations coercively. There are some exceptions, but those are trivial in my view. People can find anecdotes and complain about “the Jews,” and lack of assimilation is some times part of that. In the end, in spite of all the historical tensions, they’ve integrated far better than most subcultures. But if America is a melting pot, they are some times not even discernibly separate from the mainstream.

            And that’s not even the objective. The objective is to assimilate to the extent that you don’t offend our constitutional values.

          • Omar Sharbash

            Your final paragraph sums up my position and is also the criterion I assess immigrants by.

            Muslims, internally, subordinate to freedom of speech as much as anybody else. Is the complaint that they’re a bit too outspoken for your liking? That they eat Halal meat? That they are incontrovertibly against homosexuals adopting children?

            What specifically is the problem and is that problem immutable?

            Edit: your claim Muslims demand non-Muslims obey their laws or even that Shariah should be precedent over English common law is unfounded.

          • objectivefactsmatter

            “Muslims, internally, subordinate to freedom of speech as much as anybody else.”

            We’re not talking about collective punishment of citizens or residents (although some are talking about mass deportation), but most people are worried about a situation being forced on them. For example, if there are riots in America as there have been in Europe, it’s not clear how patient people will be to let the politically correct police handle it. Things have already gotten out of hand a few times and the law enforcement agencies have been leaning towards multiculturalism rather than the constitution of the USA.

            “What specifically is the problem and is that problem immutable?”

            The problem is that some organize around sharia and Islamic texts in order to pursue sharia for all, coercively. The texts call for that, although I’m aware that the earlier texts did not. And because there are justifications for deception, the problem is doubled. The feeling grows that non-Muslims who are aware of the supremacist doctrines realize or fear that they don’t know who they can trust.

            And we have already had incidents where not only are groups like CAIR acting against the interests of our nation, but there are signs that some agitators may start trying to foment “civil disobedience” riots and calling them “peaceful protests” like you see in “peaceful Palestine.”

            What to do about that? My hope is that if we get rid of this “Muslims as victims” fantasy (all collectivism while we’re at it) that we can all have candid conversations just as you are here. Once we work through those kinds of issues and we don’t have politicians making excuses for jihad and Islamic supremacist movements, I think tensions while dial down a lot. Not only that but those who do respect and value our constitution will probably be on the side of the loyal Americans and may even appreciate and love the US constitution even more as a result.

            The concern I think a lot of people have here and elsewhere is that given the trajectory of relations these days, that the left will never stop helping the jihadis foment violence and it will create a kind of global civil war, a transnational war between civilizations.

            “…your claim Muslims demand non-Muslims obey their laws or even that Shariah should be precedent over English common law is unfounded.”

            I realize that not all Muslims in the America and the UK believe that. Many do. Non-Muslims don’t know who to believe. And when leftists align with them, and when even many Republicans take significant funds from Saudi Arabia and become hyper-vigilant about “Muslim rights” (as opposed to plain old constitutional rights for everyone equally), it makes people who know the facts about the Muslim Brotherhood and similar organizations worry about who to trust. At times they feel they can’t actually trust any Muslims or any leftists, not even their supposed conservative elected leaders.

            In the end, those that are sincere about our values will be happy to get through these tensions just as most of us hope for. If you’re on our side, you will be welcomed.

          • Drakken

            The race card doesn’t play anymore Sparky, so that dog don’t hunt no more. Your buddy Ozz comes from the bloody 3rd world and thinks we owe him something, that is the god**mn problem you moron and the others of his ilk think just like him.

          • Omar Sharbash

            You’re a racist. That’s the problem.

          • ziggy zoggy

            You’re a moron. That’s the problem. This article is about scum like you accusing everybody you hate of racism.

            You prove his point.

          • Drakken

            I am a western culturalist, and your Islamic culture is incompatible with our way of life, we are headed for a long overdue clash and that much is for certain. Deo Volente.

          • Omar Sharbash

            What about Islam is incompatible with ‘our way of life’?

    • A Z

      Dude,
      Get a hold of yourself.

      Read
      -VladTepesblog dot com
      -BlazingCatFur @ blogspot
      -Islam vs Europe

      Or the English Papers

      We follow the events quite closely in Sweden, Norway and now unfortunately in Denmark.

      We were always told look at Nordic mixed economies and socialism for the answer. We are looking and it is not pretty.

      We see the events in Malmo. It reminds us of Detroit 40 years ago. I suggest that you stock up on marsh mellows so you can roast them over burning cars. Make sure the rioters know you are a Quisling and wear your PADS. Less scrapes and bruises that way.

      Do not even pretend to tell us the truth.

      • Peter J

        Like I said Paul, stop reading Counter-Jihad pages and go out in the real world. I’ve travelled and lived in many parts of the world. And, as far as I can see, inequality, poverty and a feeling of being left behind, has always been the driving force behind fascist elements, whether these elements are islamic or something else.

        • Drakken

          Spoken like a true effing communist. Your false narrative flies in the face reality, but hey you go ahead and keep believing the muslims won’t kill you in the end. Before you spew the standard line of go see some of these places, I do, I live and work in these 3rd world Islamic cesspools and see these savages for what they are, and dumbazz do gooders like you import them into your countries to bring their 3rd world shitholes with them. Then you wonder why people are objecting to it?

        • A Z

          I have lived in and visited around 30 countries. I have relatives on 3 continents. Unlike you I know what real world is like.

          • Peter J

            I have traveled the world for over 20 years, I’ve been in 54 different countries, but I have relatives only in Europe. One can learn a lot from travelling, I know I have, but it’s not necessary to travel in order to learn about the world.

          • objectivefactsmatter

            “I have traveled the world for over 20 years, I’ve been in 54 different countries, but I have relatives only in Europe. ”

            Travelling as a tourist can actually take you further away from understanding the world.

            “One can learn a lot from travelling, I know I have, but it’s not necessary to travel in order to learn about the world.”

            It’s also possible to fall deeper in to the webs of deception. Living somewhere and working extensively with people when you have an open mind and ability to think rationally, well that is your best bet for success in understanding. Even that is no guarantee.

            Yeah, it’s possible to learn a lot without travel too. The key is objectivity, but adding mobility and relevant hands-on experience helps.

          • Warren Raymond

            I bet you anything I have traveled more than you did and I learned a few tricks more too. And I came to exactly the opposite conclusions. Now why might that be?

          • ziggy zoggy

            It is necessary to pull your head out of your @$$ if you want to learn about the world.

        • A Z

          “as far as I can see, inequality, poverty and a feeling of being left behind, has always been the driving force behind fascist elements”

          You obviously cannot see very well

          Osama – millionaire
          Zawahiri – Doctor

          So on and so forth.

          • Peter J

            Good point. But Osamas followers are rarely millionaires. Though I admitt that radicalization into jihadists is somewhat a middle class problem. Hence the term “a feeling of being left behind”, or abandoned. It was the same with the argentinian fascist junta in the 70s.

            Zawahiri was in egyptian prison for many years. He was tortured there with incredible cruelty. It’s of course possible that he would have become radicalized anyway but something tells me that that years of the most heinous torture makes you see things in black and white.

            I hope everyone here can see that I consider jihadists my enemy. I have no problem killing Al-Qaida-type persons. I could easily shoot them myself. But I’m against general anti-muslim bigotry. It’s not a difficult distinction.

          • Drakken

            The Egyptian military I hope learned their lesson from Zawahiri, eliminate them all and let allah sortem out, because the only good muslim brotherhood jihadist is a dead muslim brotherhood jihadist.

          • A Z

            Al Qutb is one of the intellectual grandfather of the Muslim Brotherhood

            Al Qatb was radicalized before he was ever imprisoned. Qutb

            AL Qutb would not work with the Egyptian Government. They offered him a high or fairly position in education or something like that. He refused. He wanted his way or the highway.

            So of the poor followers of Osama you speak of might have gone a different rout if they had not been propagandized or financed by someone like a spoiled multi billionaire’s son (Osama). Maybe they would have been a Nasserite (socialist) or something.

            ZarQawi came from a middle class family. The architect
            of 911 and his nephew came form middle class families.

            If falling behind is a reason to attack people then I suppose my spouse should have attacked me instead of marrying me. After all they at one point lived in a re-education camp practising farming for which they had little training or tradition. They lived in a hut with a single bare light bulb and no running water.

            You might see Thomas Sowell or Walter Williams contribute pieced to FPM. They were poor but they are not blowing up buildings. Instead they got educated and are doing fine.

            You stated that the stupid comic was Muslim culturally but was an avowed atheist. I’ll take that with a grain of salt. It could be taqiyya.Even if it is not so what. For him to get in people’s faces about them not accepting his culture is BS. Personally I told my kids when it comes to cultures, I told them to pick and choose. I did not say that their other parent’s culture was crap. I told them to pick what works a la carte.

            I also told them if they are under the thumb of an evil culture to go along until such time they can get out from under its’ thumb (much like Robert Heinlein wrote).

          • Peter J

            I’m not sure of how to make myself clearer than I’ve already done.

            I’m an ardent atheist and I fight religious beliefs where ever I find them. This includes by all means muslims, high and low, extremists and moderates. I wouldn’t hesitate to shoot an islamic jihadist point blank in the face.

            Islamic extremists today is one of the worst proponents misogyny and mindless violence. Their victims are mainly other muslims.

            This is what’s so sad. People from ME, who might see them selfs as muslims, and flee (for instance from jihadists in Syria), are here in Europe being attacked and called “stealth jihadists” and “a demographic threat”, by people like Bawer. They are not treated as individuals, but as bearers of certain collective properties.

            And to deny that there exists anti-muslim bigotry in the discourse of today, is ludicrous.
            ———————–
            If I say that poor people have a shorter life span than rich, you don’t disprove that thesis by pointing to your poor 108-year old relative.

            What I’m saying is that if you live a happy, secure life, chances are much lower that you end up as an extremist of some sort. If people call me “a marxist” or a “commy bastard” for that, ok, then so be it. Im not so interested in labels.

          • Warren Raymond

            “Zawahiri was in egyptian prison for many years. He was tortured there with incredible cruelty. It’s of course possible that he would have become radicalized anyway….”

            Stop putting the horse behind the cart, fool!

            Zawahiri was imprisoned because he wanted to overthrow the government. At least get your basic facts right!

          • Drakken

            Islam is islam dumbazz and wherever islam goes, the blood always flows without exception.

          • defcon 4

            What about the rabid bigotry against Jews that is part and parcel of islam? Do you have any problems with that?

          • Omar Sharbash

            The Holocaust.

          • ziggy zoggy

            Every one of Osamas 911 hijackers and regional leaders have been educated and affluent.

            You are extremely stupid.

        • defcon 4

          Islam is fascism. Fool.

        • objectivefactsmatter

          “I’ve travelled and lived in many parts of the world. And, as far as I can see, inequality, poverty and a feeling of being left behind, has always been the driving force behind fascist elements, whether these elements are islamic or something else.”

          Through your red-tinted glasses. You’re truly gullible if you believe that can explain Islamic colonialism.

        • Simon

          Brunei has just announced it plans to enforce savage sharia penalties. Brunei has one of the worlds highest per capita GDP’s and does not have a bad colonial history either. So the usual excuses don’t apply for Brunei’s behaviour so what else is left but Islamofascism.

        • ziggy zoggy

          You can’t even travel to an islamic neighborhood in your own country without getting attacked, and the majority of terrorists and fascists are anything but poor and disadvantaged.

    • Mikey

      Peter,

      You wonderful person. You posted lies. If you had not, I would have simply read Bawer’s essay and maybe saved it for future reference.

      However reading comments can at times provide a great deal of insight & documentation of historical fact.

      For instance we have KhidonNOR’s post. I did not know about the events he posted.

      Now I can see how false the historiography that you and other like you peddle.

      So since you have done such good work wittingly or unwittingly reward yourself at the bar or by taking a hit of whatever you smoke or inject.

    • Mark

      “Bruce Bawer [i] just doing he [allways] does, no matter the topic: bashing immigrants/muslims.”

      My spouse is an immigrant, an east Asian. They could be further removed from Caucasian features by having bigger lips, kinky hair and somewhat darker skin. But frankly speaking they are just about as far removed from European looking as is possible. Further they are not Christian; they are Buddhist with a little Confuscism thrown in for good measure

      I mention these facts because I would be quite upset if I though Bawer was a racist or bashed people because they were non-Christian.

      What I see is that Bawer speaks the truth and you speak lies.

    • Race_Dissident

      Actually, it’s a shame that Sweden and Norway have so few white racists. Those racists might actually save their countries. Alas, rampant anti-racism–which is really anti-white racism–is the coin of the realm and civilizational death is the future.

      • Drakken

        You haven’t seen anything yet, but then backlash begins the leftards and 3rd worlders in their midst will rue the day they brought us to that point.

    • Drakken

      Your groveling in the face of blatant muslim aggression and making excuses for left wing lunacy is disgusting, if you cannot see that your country is headed to a Balkans on steroids, I say you deserve your fate and good bloody riddance. Your friend Ozz is not Swedish period, he is a muslim from a foreign muslim country, enjoying your leftist self hatred and white guilt and rubbing your noses in diversity. Quisilings like you will soon rue the day you sided with your enemies.

      • Warren Raymond

        Scandinavians are revolutionary romantics. They are the most deluded fools I ever met. In the early seventies I picked up some Swedish hitch hikers who raved about the Bader-Meinhof gang as if it was the latest fashion fad. After doing two tours of Scandinavia shortly after I was gobsmacked about the absolute mental flatliners that inhabit that part of the world.

        • Drakken

          I have had the same experience as you had, I enjoy traveling to the scandihoovian countries, and it is absolutely a hoot to watch them have a meltdown when you point out the obvious flaws in their open borders argument. Also ask them where the money is going to come from to take care of all these imported savages that live on their dime when everybody is poor?

    • defcon 4

      Your stupidity and ignorance don’t come naturally do they?

    • Warren Raymond

      My dear Peter J:

      There is no such thing as a “wright wing populist”. Bruce Bawer is not “bashing immigrants/muslims”, he is trying to alert Swedes about the suicidal stupidity people like you display for aiding and abetting your own demise.

      If Özz Nujen is a Muslim he is not an ‘atheist’, because he comes with the mental baggage of a Muslim. Being a citizen of Sweden doesn’t make him a Swede.

      Your last sentence “his name, parents background and skin color, that´s all it takes to trigger Bruce Bawers key reflexes” tells me all about what triggers your reflexes. Your cheap, below the belt accusations are based on ignorance and typical leftist stupidity. You have no argument, so you resort to the lowest kind of ad hominem attack.

      I regret wasting my time responding to you.

      • Peter J

        No, you have no arguments and you are just writing ad hominem. I, actually rather lengthy, have argued for my views.

    • ziggy zoggy

      Nujen is a racist hypocrite and islamic supremacist. He claims that everybody except people who look like him are racist. What a ridiculous little $hit stain he is.

      And there are no right-wingers in America, much less ones calling to expel all Jews and Puerto Ricans.

      You’re a clown.

  • EamonnDublin

    Not only Sweden ……….but the rest of Europe also. Civilizations are never conquered – they commit suicide. All is not yet totally lost, but time is getting seriously short. It’s time for the “masses” to let their governments see that it is they, the people, who are ultimately in charge, NOT the pathetic politicians. Otherwise – if we fail to take control – we WILL commit suicide and hand it all over to Islam. I wonder how our granddaughters will thank us for that lasting gift? Éamonn, Dublin, Ireland.

    • David

      Get a grip Eamonn- all us Celts are foreigners in Western Europe; you sound ridiculous. You should read up on the Know Nothing Party and get a mirror- you sound just like them.

      We’re all born onto this planet as equals; seeking to find extremist jargon to deal with exceptionally minor issues is crass and abhorrent- use the law and use your vote instead of running a flag up the pole of fascism.

      • EamonnDublin

        David, Are you not listening? Do you not hear them? Every day, Islamists tell us very clearly that they will conquer the world and subject Western civilization to Shari’a Law. People such as your good self are simply enablers and facilitators. Fortunately, there are sufficient wide awake people to stand up and say “Thus far shalt thou come and no further” (Charles Stewart Parnell).

        Éamonn, Dublin

        • Drakken

          Sorry Eamonn, the only way your going to get that commi’s attention is with a bloody 2 by 4. Now lets watch as little Davy has a complete meltdown calling us mean and fascist.

      • ziggy zoggy

        No islamopithecine is my equal, and every European of Celtish descent belongs there. The islamopithecines don’t.

        • Omar Sharbash

          LoL.

      • Drakken

        Spoken like a true dyed in the wool communist, get bent, all cultures are all not equal, when you import the 3rd world , you become the 3rd world, so your going to have to pardon me if I don’t commit cultural suicide like useful idiot leftist like you want to.

  • Pedro

    Has Peter J seen the “Hippie dipsh_ts in Norway” video?

    It shows how a pair of Oslo parents, who want to live in the international district, so their son can grow up with the right attitudes is shunned and bullied by Muslim kids.

    They persist for 1/2 a year or a year even though their son is under extreme psychological stress.

    As much as those parents abused their son Peter J abuses his fellow Swedes and Norwegians.

    • Peter J

      I’m not really interested in anecdotes.

      I say my opinions, yes. If someone is offended (“abused”), it’s their problem. Not mine.

      • Pedro

        It is cutesy to call the problems real life individuals as anecdotes. It is the refuge of scoundrels and worse.

        If you see a number of cases or anecdotes, the euphemism that like to use, that is smoke. A wise person would check to see if their is a fire.

        Those would be called statistics. the crime statistics and welfare statistics bear out the suspicion of something was wrong when we “saw” smoke.

        For example the rape statistics in the Nordic countries are Horrible.

        Do you hang your head when you learn that Sweden is #2 in the number of rapes and vow that you will be #1.

        I think you are Muslim. That can’t be your real picture by your post name.

        • Peter J

          Pedro, third time I post this link:

          http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-19592372

          Educate youself.

          “I think you are Muslim. That can’t be your real picture by your post name.”

          Anyone, even with a limited knowlegde in the humanities, sees that the picture shows Bertrand Russel.

          • Pedro

            I already saw the link and read the story. Apparently you did not read the whole story.

            1/2 way down there was a paragraph that said the “trend was not your friend”

            So rapes are increasing sharply from 2000 at the same time immigration is increasing and Peter J does not see the correlation and think might it not be causal. May we not investigate?

            Also i heard today of how England keeps their gun crime stats down. If a person does of gunshot but no one is convicted they do not count it as a gun crime. But hey they are to the left. Maybe not as much as Sweden but still to the left. We will find similar skull duggery in the Swedish stats you cling to.

          • Pedro

            Bertrand Russel I know by reputation. He has a bad one in many quarters. Among Muslims I think he has no reputation whatsoever. As they would so he comes from the ignorant times before the coming of Islam to your country (before Islamic law was implemented).

            Besides I judge people by their work ethic and not by whether they have a pretty face or part of the in group. I have sen a picture of his taken when he was about 30. Unlike you I do not have shrine to him in my domicile.

          • Pedro

            The excerpt below is what a country rule by Labour/socialists look like. It is what your country looks like.
            You vote to the left.You support this.

            “Despite the increased pressure and violent threats Deeyah’s family continued to support her. After being attacked on stage at her own concert and sustained intimidation she subsequently moved to London at the age of 17 to live and work.”

            http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deeyah

            http://frontpagemag.com/2013/bruce-bawer/documentary-shines-a-light-on-honor-killing/

          • Peter J

            “You vote to the left.You support this.”

            Yes, I support her coming here, if fleeing from abuse. You wore against immigration. So, by your logic, you want her to die.

            Seriously, get a grip. We are all grown ups here. Don’t make a fool of yourself.

          • reader

            This is a trivial bait and switch, Peter. The problem with illegal immigration is that it favors law-breakers over people who have legitimate reasons for being admitted to this country. In other words, you’ve just used the cheapest form of demagoguery to argue your point. By the way, Swedish healthcare sucks. I know that first hand.

      • objectivefactsmatter

        “I say my opinions, yes. If someone is offended (“abused”), it’s their problem. Not mine.”

        The policies you advocate are abusive whether or not anyone feels offended by your opinions.

  • Larry

    There is a funeral for a person killed in work place shooting along with several others. A man attends a funeral, who is not a relative friend or coworker of the deceased. One of the bereaved asks him why he is there. He responds that he is there too because he is also sad. He lost a brother. his brother was the shooter.

    Someone could rework it and tell it better than I. But what I wrote is as funny or not funny as what the jerk Nûjen says.

  • mtnhikerdude

    Scandanistan !

    • objectivefactsmatter

      Scandalistan.

  • Peter J

    -:REPLY TO PAUL AUSTEN MURPHY:-

    Here, you can read about “the Rape Jihad” (ha ha ha, that word)

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-19592372

    What you and BB are peddling here is racism and I’ll explain why I think so and why you think you’re not peddling it.

    I understand that it´s hard to accept, but etymology and meaning changes over time. What was once acceptable, is today considered racist. It’s the same with sexism and homophobia. What was once acceptable norm some decades ago is not so anymore. You can like it or dislike it but it´s a fact of life. You can’t have the same view on homosexuals, blacks, women like many in my grandfathers generation had. Deal with it.

    The definition of racism isn´t what it used to be in the 1930s. Or in the 50s. The meaning of the word has expanded. The old pseudo-scientific “biological” racism is almost nonexistent. And I’m sure that You and BB are anti-racists in this old meaning (maybe even “pious” anti-racists).

    But for you and BB culture functions as a nature. For you guys, culture and religion can never change. Therefore, culture gets the same properties as nature. And if you are a muslim, you are first and foremost a bearer of certain properties that goes along with being a muslim. You are not an individual. Your arguments is just a way of locking individuals and groups a priori into a genealogy, into a determination that is immutable. A muslim is a muslim is a muslim. And this is not how it works in the real world.

    This is a kind of neo-racism and its dominant theme is not, as I said, biological heredity, but the insurmountability of cultural differences, a racism which, at first sight, does not postulate the superiority of certain groups or peoples in relation to others but ‘only’ the harmfulness of abolishing frontiers, the incompatibility of lifestyles and traditions.

    And sure. Killing your daughter for marrying the wrong guy, that IS incompatible with “scandinavian lifestyle”. But, I can assure you Paul, that the few cases where this have happened, there is an clear consensus of no acceptance. The criminal (both christian and muslims (from ME)) have been dealt with swiftly and harshly by the Swedish legal system.

    I am a leftist, more so than you can imagine. And I wouldn’t hesitate to argue against any misogyny including misogyny stemming from islamic conservatives. But I can grant you that some leftists drag their feet in this matter. They do so just because there exists neo-racists like BB. But generally speaking, this accusation is basically a straw man from wright wing bigotts. Multiculturalism is about blending food, folk dance and shit. Not blending habeas corpus with mob rule. No leftists (no one) accepts different laws depending on where you come from. I’ve seen this accusation many times, but it´s a red herring.

    So Paul, stop reading Counter-Jihad pages and go out in the real world. I’ve travelled and lived in many parts of the world. And, as far as I can see, inequality, poverty and a feeling of being left behind, has always been the driving force behind fascist elements, whether these elements are islamic or something else.

    • defcon 4

      Islam isn’t a race retard. You seem to be re-hashing the same talking points, over and over again.

  • Drakken

    You haven’t seen a backlash against your communist views yet, but you soon will. Poverty and all those idiotic feelings you leftards have is nothing compared to the 3rd world Islamic way. So you go ahead and suck up to them in the hopes that they will eliminate you last.

  • Drakken

    Your a god forsaken communist. No matter how many times you red bastards try communism, it always ends up with stacks of dead bodies.

    • Peter J

      Drakken, stop hating, stop attacking straw men.

      But I am an atheist, so in that sence I’m “god forsaken”.

      • defcon 4

        You’re a cowardly, apathetic pig. You deserve to be ruled by islam0nazis.

        • Peter J

          “You’re a cowardly, apathetic pig. You deserve to be ruled by islam0nazis”

          Yes, that is a statement that a jihadist would call me (a pig, coward etc). But why do you call me that?

          • not a Quisling

            Because you walk like a duck and quack like a duck.

            If I were in a bad situation, like say a foxhole, i would rather have some unknown person from some random country than to be in the same foxhole as you. You are that trustworthy.

          • ziggy zoggy

            Do you disagree with the description? I know pigs are useful animals but surely you think you’re useful too, for a coward.

      • Drakken

        Straw men? Hating? I despise and loath of you weak minded and weak willed Quislings who are selling out their childrens futures out of a sense of fairness called communism, and bowing and scraping before 3rd world savages, well screw you and yours, you’ll hang with the savages in your midst soon enough, and I’ll be one of thousands cheering it.

      • ziggy zoggy

        Your islamopithecine pals won’t allow you to remain an atheist.

  • Drakken

    All cultures are not all equal and never have been, no matter how much you commi bastards try, import the 3rd world, you become the 3rd world.

    • Peter J

      I agree completely that not all ways of life is equal. I have also stated that most people on the left think so. It’s a straw man argument.

      • defcon 4

        Is straw man argument your big word for the day? Somehow, I don’t think you are who you pretend to be.

  • herb benty

    I’d pay for just a few Vikings to show up in the studio. PC for all it’s glory on display. Down with Orwellian political correctness, call a spade a spade.

  • Drakken

    You repeat the same lines and lies in the vain hope that people will actually believe your communist viewpoint, you could not be more wrong. The Balkans on steroids is coming, and Quislings like you who sold their people out for a few coins will be paying the price.

    • objectivefactsmatter

      “Here, you can read about “the Rape Jihad” (ha ha ha, that word)”

      Which word makes you laugh more? Rape or Jihad?

      • Drakken

        This guy Pete is typical of the scandihoovian mindset these days, they figure nothing is wrong and to bring up such unpleasant facts just upsets people and heaven forbid we upset anyone today. Reality is going to be an extremely painful thing, but a necessary thing.

        • objectivefactsmatter

          I guess we’re “quaint” to care.

  • therealpm

    Peter J’s comments typify everything that is wrong with Swedish society today and why the country has become such a dangerous place for its indigenous people. He is utterly obsessed with fascism and racism, seeing everything through this prism. He thinks it is racist to say that black culture is inferior, yet jokes about rape jihad and quotes the BBC as a source.

    Well speaking as an Englishwoman, Peter, I can tell you that the BBC are the very last people I would trust to tell the truth about such an issue. They are utterly steeped in dhimmitude and constantly portray an obsequious attitude towards Islam. For years they, and the rest of the mainstream media, denied the rape jihad that was occurring in Britain whereby young girls were being systematically gang raped by Muslim sex slavers.

    I truly pity the Swedish people because Peter J’s opinions seem to be the same as those of the politicians governing the country. Is it any wonder that it has become the rape capital of Europe, or that Jews can no longer safely walk down the streets of Swedish towns? Just a few months ago we saw Muslim immigrants burning down Swedish cities while the police stood watching them, no doubt paralysed by the thought that people like Peter J might call them racist if they actually did their job and put a stop to the mayhem.

  • therealpm

    Duplicate post

  • defcon 4

    Why don’t you go live in the real world. The real world of:
    Pakistain, Bangladesh, Somalia, Iraq, Iran, Syria, Libya, Morocco.

  • Peter J

    therealpm, read article, at least I give source when asked. What, more specifically, (I want numbers) are wrong with this article?

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-19592372

    Stop moaning about BBC, it’s quite a better source than anynomous dudes with conspiracy theories.

    “He is utterly obsessed with fascism and racism, seeing everything through this prism.”

    Actually, I’m not. But I do know a racist when I see one. It is you that is obsessed with muslims, and seeing everything through this prism.

    About riots. Its been riots since Spartacus. In india, China, France Los Angeles, Rio de Janero, London. Every time in history has its reasons. Here is a good analysis of the London riots some years ago:

    http://www.social-europe.eu/2011/08/the-london-riots-on-consumerism-coming-home-to-roost/

    • objectivefactsmatter

      According to the socialists it can’t ever be a reaction to constant socialist-communist agitation propaganda.

    • objectivefactsmatter

      “Actually, I’m not . But I do know a racist when I see one. It is you that is obsessed with muslims, and seeing everything through this prism.”

      Dummy: Muslims are followers of beliefs. Nothing to do with genealogy other than parents coercing their offspring and wives to claim submission to these beliefs. All of the objections “Muslims” collectively are related to the ideas that bind them, not the unfortunate coercion and coincidental racial connections that develop among some of the communities within the larger group of believers.

      Calling it racism is the height of ignorance. It’s typical of crypto-communists too. Funny thing about that.

    • David

      Peter you really shouldn’t waste your time on these cave dwellers. I learned years ago that seeking to educate online racists veiling their rhetoric as centre-right is a total waste of time. You’re dealing with an entire demographic not of human politics but of human abnormal psychology; these people get an emotional stimulus reward from venting belligerent, illiterate nonsense of the hateful kind. These people aren’t concerned for their nation, not worried for their society, nor fearful of their children’s future; they’re just hateful. I treat more rigid, right-wing types in my work as a psychotherapist than lefty liberals by a magnitude of about five times, if not higher. But don’t take my word for it- stats on rightist politics and lower mental health are easy to find via Google. They’ll never, ever listen to a word you say- you represent their fears; you threaten their illusions with facts…and for this they can never forgive you.

      • ziggy zoggy

        You’re a fraud peddling weak left-wing claptrap. Your ad hominem diatribe didn’t even address the issue under discussion. Crawl back under your bridge, trolltard.

      • Omar Sharbash

        Amen. I’m learning the same thing now.

        • ziggy zoggy

          You’re humping somebody’s leg right now.

      • Drakken

        The fact that you are a psychotherapist and you treat people should alarm the hell out of people. The problem with useful idiot like you is that you don’t know or understand human nature, and that will come back to bite you.

    • ziggy zoggy

      The BBC is worse than worthless as a source of information. It is deliberately malicious and inaccurate in its story telling.

      Hatred for totalitarian islam is not racist, though islam itself is fundamentally racist, misogynist and violent.

      Comparing islamic riots to other riots that were motivated by completely different reasons is specious argumentation. Islamopithecines cause violence and squalor wherever they are. Their moon god cult demands it.

  • objectivefactsmatter

    “I understand that it´s hard to accept, but etymology and meaning changes over time. What was once acceptable, is today considered racist. It’s the same with sexism and homophobia. What was once acceptable norm some decades ago is not so anymore. You can like it or dislike it but it´s a fact of life. You can’t have the same view on homosexuals, blacks, women like many in my grandfathers generation had. Deal with it.”

    It seems hard for you to understand that there are far more than 2 views on racism and the politics of sexual attraction and “sexual identity.”

  • objectivefactsmatter

    “But for you and BB culture functions as a nature. For you guys, culture and religion can never change.”

    Of course things change, but there are also logical limits. Up can’t change in to down, except to socialists. Social justice can’t be just for individuals who pay the price for mere allegations about someone else or some communist contrived class of “oppressors.” Therefore your “social justice” is injustice. Up is still up.

    Gravity is mostly unchanged since you geniuses arrived on the scene. You can’t just change what you want. You have to work within the realm of the possible.

  • objectivefactsmatter

    “But for you and BB culture functions as a nature. For you guys, culture and religion can never change.”

    Of course they can. But the change must occur outside of the imagination of the left for it to be recognized elsewhere. And you can’t demand change from people unless you can justify your demands rationally.

    But here you are justifying the support of Jihadis and the destruction of Judeo Christianity. You tend to invert so many things.

  • objectivefactsmatter

    “Therefore, culture gets the same properties as nature. And if you are a muslim, you are first and foremost a bearer of certain properties that goes along with being a muslim.”

    That’s a fallacy of the left. The left is all about collectivism to such a degree that you project this on to the entire discourse whenever you think it shores up your deranged arguments.

  • objectivefactsmatter

    “This is a kind of neo-racism and its dominant theme is not, as I said, biological heredity, but the insurmountability of cultural differences, a racism which, at first sight, does not postulate the superiority of certain groups or peoples in relation to others but ‘only’ the harmfulness of abolishing frontiers, the incompatibility of lifestyles and traditions.”

    Criticism of culture is not necessarily driven by racism. Usually it isn’t. In fact a lot of racism is caused by people that don’t understand their objections are actually due to cultural differences that are totally legitimate to criticize as such.

    But the bottom line is that explicit criticism of culture is not racism. It’s what you call racism when you want to stifle criticism with your hateful shaming tactics.

  • objectivefactsmatter

    ” I wouldn’t hesitate to argue against any misogyny including misogyny stemming from islamic conservatives. But I can grant you that some leftists drag their feet in this matter. They do so just because there exists neo-racists like BB.”

    Sure. Blame it on critics of Islam. Islam-o-phobia has been wreaking havoc for almost 14 centuries.

  • KhidonNOR

    In your answer to Paul Austin Murphy you advocate that doctoring of the classic and common definition of racism to be so wide and include so much that the term is meaningless.

    I asked for documentation and got some rant from you about all the Google hits you got. This is the pseudo-academic gibberish I am used to, when I try to reason with you hard left multiculturalism.

    Apparently through some psychic powers you are able to see that I will never be satisfied with your “documentation” regarding your absurd claim about racism in the Progress Party (I am not a member).

  • Paul Austin Murphy

    “I am not “obsessed with race”. In the CONTRARY: I
    have beyond any doubt, as clearly as I can, stated, and I quote myself: “…inequality, poverty and a feeling of being left behind, has always been the driving force behind fascist elements, whether these elements are islamic or something else.” – Peter J

    The traditional leftist catechism on racism. You haven’t shown that you aren’t obsessed by race with that quote. You’ve simply offered the classic but tired Marxist account of what causes racism and fascism. That’s a non sequitur on your part. You have a position on what causes racism – how does that stop you being obsessed with other people’s supposed racism and your own pure self being the opposite of ‘colour-blind’? Just because you see only good in brown Muslims, or their endless victimhood or oppression, how does that stop you being race-obsessed? Is it because you deem your racism to be positive and therefore not racism at all?

    “But one thing is certain. Bawer doesnt allow muslims to be individuals.”

    Never once does Bawer mention all Muslims. He doesn’t need to. He mentions specific Muslims and Islam. It’s you who assumes that anyone who criticises Islam or individual Muslims is targeting ALL Muslims, not Bawer. Some Muslims are fine. Usually because they are not strict Muslims. The more they follow Islam, the more they are likely to be misogynists, Islamic supremacists, enforcers and demanders of sharia law in non-Muslim countries, people who carry out female genital
    mutilation and ‘honour killings’, bombings, riots, the persecution of non-Muslims in Muslim countries, the rape of kuffar women in Oslo or Sweden for not wearing the veil, etc.

    No matter how many ‘race-awareness workshops’ you’ve been to, or Leftist soundbites you come out with, as well as your fluffy, pretentious and insincere talk about ‘allowing Muslims to be individuals’, none of that takes away the harsh Islamic reality around you.

    Is it really all worth it just so you can feel self-righteous? Is it all about you feeling and thinking yourself superior to all us bigoted racists? Is that what all this is really about – you feeling good about yourself?

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Paul-Marks/1266358046 Paul Marks

    The real problem is not that there is leftist television in Sweden and Norway (they have a right to express their, vile, opinions), the real problems are that it is taxpayer subsidised – and that no anti leftist television stations are allowed.

  • Drakken

    Your a leftist, more so than you can imagine, therefore a bloody communist, nice play at words shortbus. Funny how your laws over there coddle and encourage the 3rd world savage in your midst and punish your natives for objecting to their own demise.

  • JVR

    “I dont understand how a person would trick a random system…”

    As I said Mr Peter J, the education of the Swedish Left is not very good. Let me give you an example — cards dealt at a black jack table comes in random order, but the table can be beaten by someone counting cards. This is common knowledge — a random system is beaten by an algorithm. Good card counters are so effective at beating the (total) randomness of dealt cards that casinos ban them.

    Ps. The Huguenots are my ancestors, and I am in many ways religiously and culturally exactly what they were.

    As for integrating the Roma it is not for want of trying. Cultures which are compatible generally integrate spontaneously, eg ancient Latins and Estruscans in Italy, or whites in modern America. Sometimes an integrated society spontaneously dissemble, eg India — genetic studies show that the cast system is not old, maybe on the low end a 1000 years (but already genetically verifiable). Yet it is also more firmly established than the division between Europeans and Roma.

    Generally culture evolves by displacement. Eg, first few Muslims arrived in Constantinople. Later more, eventually so many that their armies overrun and then *displaced* the Byzantines. Today we do barely remember the Byzantines, but they were, before being displaced, the center of the known world for a 1000 years. What part of this do you not understand?

    If the Roma were a people compatible with Swedes then they would integrate over a few generations.

    BTW it is not their fault that they failed to integrate, it is the white Swedes who are spontaneously rejecting them and marginalizing them, and they will continue to reject them.

    As for the Muslims, they will stay Muslim, while many of you lapsed Lutherans convert. Eventually their numbers will be so large that they will displace you.

    Take off your neo-Marxist spectacles and perhaps you will realize that a Muslim Sweden will be as different from a Lutheran Sweden as the Ottomans were from Byzantium. Same landscape, very different peoples.

    I know you celebrate the untergang of your kind, but dancing around that bonfire does not make the decadence any less real.

  • JVR

    Pps Mr Peter J you write above “Given any group of let’s say some hundred thousands, or a few millions,
    you will have the same normal distrubition of, for example introvert and
    extrovert characters…”

    This is demonstrably false. There are regional variations amongst humans, something humans talk about all they time, eg the Dutch are tall, the Swedes are blond, etc etc. Of course, such physical variations are not limited to appearance, but also to other factors, such as “Northern Europeans are lactase persistent”, or “Black Americans get diabetes more frequently (that whites)”. Europeans are somewhat resistant to the plaque, more so than many other peoples, and this list goes on and on, ….psychologists have established a very dirty little secret about this all, but I am sure you reject that kind of science. You should really take off those Marxist glasses, they blind you, and then you write stupid statements such as “Given any group of let’s say some hundred thousands, or a few millions, you will have the same normal distrubition…”

  • ziggy zoggy

    Multiculturalism is about tolerating everybody else’s intolerances. It is about destroying the culture of a host nation. It is KGB inspired sedition meant to destroy the West and replace it with Marxism.

    The only diversity that matters is diversity of opinion, which the left lacks. You support islamopithecines colonizing Europe but you would oppose any Europeans colonizing Islamic HeIIholes. You are a depraved excuse for a human being and the policies you promote are inimical to civilization.

  • ziggy zoggy

    Inequality and poverty have nothing to do with islamic doctrine and savagery. Terrorists have enormous wealth at their disposal.

    Islamopithecines consider themselves to be defined by characteristics that they have to answer for – to their fictional moon deity allah. Who are you to tell them they aren’t practicing their phony religion properly? They define themselves by the koran, “hadith” and “surah.” And although they come in different races, the majority of them are White.

  • ziggy zoggy

    Poverty causes fascism? Mussolini wasn’t poor. Neither were Hitler, Lenin, Stalin, Mao, Franco, Pol Pot, Bin Laden or your cultural buddy Mohammad. Mugabe, Castro, lil’ Kim Jung Un and the House of Saud are all rich.

    As if socialists desire anything but totalitarian control by the elites over the proles.

  • ziggy zoggy

    Stoop pasting the same idiotic spam. Islam is practiced by different races. Nobody here hates islam because they hate all the races who practice it, you hopeless ret@rd.

  • ziggy zoggy

    Yes, the Progressive Party has so many racists in it that you can’t even name one. And racism has more than one definition.

    Racism is the belief in the superiority of a particular race or races. Islam is not a race.

    Your lies are ridiculous.

  • ziggy zoggy

    So the Gypsies refused to assimilate for a thousand years but now they will? They won’t even work or contribute to society! They scorn the very notion! And they hate all non-gypsies.

  • ziggy zoggy

    So why are so many pampered Europeans left-wing extremists? Why don’t islamopithecines assimilate to the countries they colonize? How is hatred for the thoroughly evil death cult of islam bigotry?

  • ziggy zoggy

    Spam doesn’t become more effective just because you keep pasting it over and over.