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	<title>Comments on: Life and Death in Northern Europe</title>
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		<title>By: Phil</title>
		<link>http://www.frontpagemag.com/2014/bruce-bawer/life-and-death-in-northern-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-5375014</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Phil]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Feb 2014 20:45:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frontpagemag.com/?p=218962#comment-5375014</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Bruce, thanks for this article along with the many others that you publish here. I always make a point of reading your work.

I found the picture of the beautiful dead animal and the white-clad scientist in front of the zoo-going audience oddly disturbing, and have spent some time mulling it over. I think Holst&#039;s argument is weakest at the beginning, where he says that &quot;a giraffe is not a pet; it’s not like a dog or cat that becomes part of the family.&quot;

In college many years ago I had a summer job at the Bronx Zoo, and my favorite spot there was the lion house at feeding time in the afternoon, when Fred Martini, the keeper, in addition to feeding the big cats, stroked and petted them and generally &quot;loved them up.&quot; I would imagine that many of the larger animals at all zoos are somebody&#039;s pet, and this applies not only to the gentle animals but also--as in Mr. Martini&#039;s example--the not-so-gentle ones.

Somewhere in the zoo in Copenhagen there is an assistant keeper who had a relationship with Marius and was appalled by this needless taking of life, but this person has not come forward and has not been sought out by the media.

 I&#039;m quite sure that kids at the zoo, when they see a keeper in a cage or in a pen in close proximity to an exotic animal, wish they could have that job. So Holst--the biggest keeper of all--invites a group of kids to watch him kill a healthy young giraffe.


We can&#039;t see inside a man&#039;s heart but we can discern his strategy. I think Holst killed the giraffe because he could. He could get away with it. Some animals were off limits to him, even though the reasons he gave for killing Marius--his genes being well represented in the population, etc.--could be applied to any creature. Imagine if he had shot a wolf, or an orangutan--or an elephant! Had Holst killed a young elephant, I think he would have been relieved of his duties shortly after the &quot;demo.&quot;  But he could kill a giraffe now and give the world time to get used to the idea. The apes and elephants (and who knows what or who else) would come later.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bruce, thanks for this article along with the many others that you publish here. I always make a point of reading your work.</p>
<p>I found the picture of the beautiful dead animal and the white-clad scientist in front of the zoo-going audience oddly disturbing, and have spent some time mulling it over. I think Holst&#8217;s argument is weakest at the beginning, where he says that &#8220;a giraffe is not a pet; it’s not like a dog or cat that becomes part of the family.&#8221;</p>
<p>In college many years ago I had a summer job at the Bronx Zoo, and my favorite spot there was the lion house at feeding time in the afternoon, when Fred Martini, the keeper, in addition to feeding the big cats, stroked and petted them and generally &#8220;loved them up.&#8221; I would imagine that many of the larger animals at all zoos are somebody&#8217;s pet, and this applies not only to the gentle animals but also&#8211;as in Mr. Martini&#8217;s example&#8211;the not-so-gentle ones.</p>
<p>Somewhere in the zoo in Copenhagen there is an assistant keeper who had a relationship with Marius and was appalled by this needless taking of life, but this person has not come forward and has not been sought out by the media.</p>
<p> I&#8217;m quite sure that kids at the zoo, when they see a keeper in a cage or in a pen in close proximity to an exotic animal, wish they could have that job. So Holst&#8211;the biggest keeper of all&#8211;invites a group of kids to watch him kill a healthy young giraffe.</p>
<p>We can&#8217;t see inside a man&#8217;s heart but we can discern his strategy. I think Holst killed the giraffe because he could. He could get away with it. Some animals were off limits to him, even though the reasons he gave for killing Marius&#8211;his genes being well represented in the population, etc.&#8211;could be applied to any creature. Imagine if he had shot a wolf, or an orangutan&#8211;or an elephant! Had Holst killed a young elephant, I think he would have been relieved of his duties shortly after the &#8220;demo.&#8221;  But he could kill a giraffe now and give the world time to get used to the idea. The apes and elephants (and who knows what or who else) would come later.</p>
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		<title>By: Lorilu</title>
		<link>http://www.frontpagemag.com/2014/bruce-bawer/life-and-death-in-northern-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-5373674</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Lorilu]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 24 Feb 2014 06:34:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frontpagemag.com/?p=218962#comment-5373674</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Because abortion is the great moral evil of our time.  This article discusses the value of one individual animal&#039;s life, and the attitude of the people in that country.  There was a world-wide outcry against the killing of this inconvenient (for the zoo) giraffe.  Why not a world-wide outcry against the killing of the inconvenient (for the parents) child?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Because abortion is the great moral evil of our time.  This article discusses the value of one individual animal&#8217;s life, and the attitude of the people in that country.  There was a world-wide outcry against the killing of this inconvenient (for the zoo) giraffe.  Why not a world-wide outcry against the killing of the inconvenient (for the parents) child?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Sintram</title>
		<link>http://www.frontpagemag.com/2014/bruce-bawer/life-and-death-in-northern-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-5372434</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Sintram]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 21 Feb 2014 17:54:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frontpagemag.com/?p=218962#comment-5372434</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I&#039;m a native swede, and I think Sweden has turned into something of feminist, multiculturalist, &quot;antiracist&quot;, lefty madhouse.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m a native swede, and I think Sweden has turned into something of feminist, multiculturalist, &#8220;antiracist&#8221;, lefty madhouse.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Vivek</title>
		<link>http://www.frontpagemag.com/2014/bruce-bawer/life-and-death-in-northern-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-5372060</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Vivek]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 21 Feb 2014 04:31:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frontpagemag.com/?p=218962#comment-5372060</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Serves to reinforce the inferior position of animals in a society that seems to be increasingly losing the plot on animal rights. Already far too much of money, resources, time etc are being spent on animal welfare, especially in the west. These should be diverted for the use of people, who have a greater right on them than the four legged, winged, furred whatever.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Serves to reinforce the inferior position of animals in a society that seems to be increasingly losing the plot on animal rights. Already far too much of money, resources, time etc are being spent on animal welfare, especially in the west. These should be diverted for the use of people, who have a greater right on them than the four legged, winged, furred whatever.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Mo86</title>
		<link>http://www.frontpagemag.com/2014/bruce-bawer/life-and-death-in-northern-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-5371773</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Mo86]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Feb 2014 21:18:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frontpagemag.com/?p=218962#comment-5371773</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[This is true. At the same time, there is no reason to abuse them in this way. And why make it a public spectacle, even open to children? What kind of a parent thinks bringing their kid to see this is a fun family outing?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is true. At the same time, there is no reason to abuse them in this way. And why make it a public spectacle, even open to children? What kind of a parent thinks bringing their kid to see this is a fun family outing?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Mo86</title>
		<link>http://www.frontpagemag.com/2014/bruce-bawer/life-and-death-in-northern-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-5371754</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Mo86]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Feb 2014 20:54:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frontpagemag.com/?p=218962#comment-5371754</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[This was indeed a chilling article. 

And America&#039;s going down that same road. The story of Jahi McMath is proof of that. The mantra of &quot;Brain dead! Brain dead!&quot; were shrieked on every story. Nearly every single comment on the stories that I personally saw on her were demanding her death or calling her a corpse or worse. It was sickening.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This was indeed a chilling article. </p>
<p>And America&#8217;s going down that same road. The story of Jahi McMath is proof of that. The mantra of &#8220;Brain dead! Brain dead!&#8221; were shrieked on every story. Nearly every single comment on the stories that I personally saw on her were demanding her death or calling her a corpse or worse. It was sickening.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Mo86</title>
		<link>http://www.frontpagemag.com/2014/bruce-bawer/life-and-death-in-northern-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-5371587</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Mo86]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Feb 2014 15:13:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frontpagemag.com/?p=218962#comment-5371587</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Good grief, what&#039;s the big deal, if it&#039;s an indoor cat?


Now, anything to say on the article?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good grief, what&#8217;s the big deal, if it&#8217;s an indoor cat?</p>
<p>Now, anything to say on the article?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Tiberius</title>
		<link>http://www.frontpagemag.com/2014/bruce-bawer/life-and-death-in-northern-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-5371325</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Tiberius]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Feb 2014 22:48:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frontpagemag.com/?p=218962#comment-5371325</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I read the link and that movie does seem to represent the thinking of the medical elites and their government overlords who want to decide who lives and who dies. There is a movie that Javier Bardem did several years ago, called the Sea Inside.http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0369702/
From what I remember the movie made Javier Bardem&#039;s character as noble and the people wanting to help him die as heroic. The pro-life people were shown to be backwards or religious simpletons.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I read the link and that movie does seem to represent the thinking of the medical elites and their government overlords who want to decide who lives and who dies. There is a movie that Javier Bardem did several years ago, called the Sea Inside.<a href="http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0369702/" rel="nofollow">http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0369702/</a><br />
From what I remember the movie made Javier Bardem&#8217;s character as noble and the people wanting to help him die as heroic. The pro-life people were shown to be backwards or religious simpletons.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Tiberius</title>
		<link>http://www.frontpagemag.com/2014/bruce-bawer/life-and-death-in-northern-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-5371309</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Tiberius]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Feb 2014 22:23:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frontpagemag.com/?p=218962#comment-5371309</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[No different in the leftist sites when people start saying there should be limits in government assistance and immediately &quot;reproductive rights&quot; get thrown in the mix. Seems you do not notice that half.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>No different in the leftist sites when people start saying there should be limits in government assistance and immediately &#8220;reproductive rights&#8221; get thrown in the mix. Seems you do not notice that half.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Tiberius</title>
		<link>http://www.frontpagemag.com/2014/bruce-bawer/life-and-death-in-northern-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-5371308</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Tiberius]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Feb 2014 22:20:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frontpagemag.com/?p=218962#comment-5371308</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The reason I asked is that declawing is something people opt but the ones I have seen are pretty much indoor cats. The owners of these cats do take real good care in keeping them from the outside and having to face the dangers outdoor. I agree some people should not be pet owners but I have seen people take care of their pets as if they were their own children. If one is against declawing because of the &quot;it goes against its nature&quot; then one can say that about neutering and spaying since this is also a human invention.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The reason I asked is that declawing is something people opt but the ones I have seen are pretty much indoor cats. The owners of these cats do take real good care in keeping them from the outside and having to face the dangers outdoor. I agree some people should not be pet owners but I have seen people take care of their pets as if they were their own children. If one is against declawing because of the &#8220;it goes against its nature&#8221; then one can say that about neutering and spaying since this is also a human invention.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Western Canadian</title>
		<link>http://www.frontpagemag.com/2014/bruce-bawer/life-and-death-in-northern-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-5371298</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Western Canadian]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Feb 2014 21:39:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frontpagemag.com/?p=218962#comment-5371298</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[There is more than one procedure to declaw a cat, the intended result is the same in all cases:  the cat no longer has the use of it&#039;s claws.  A previously used method would leave the cat in pain for months, or permanently.  
If you declaw a cat, and it is outside of a safe home, it will be must more at risk of being killed by a predator:  climbing ability very much reduced, and ability to defend itself, reduced to the point that declawed cats, if outside a safe home, are very often killed.
Triming the nails, or trimming with rubber/plastic caps over the reduced nails, takes care of the problem, though it has to be kept up, the nails will grow back.  And again, stricty outdoor cats have a life-span of a few years, indoor/outdoor 6-9 years, indoor, 15-25 years.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There is more than one procedure to declaw a cat, the intended result is the same in all cases:  the cat no longer has the use of it&#8217;s claws.  A previously used method would leave the cat in pain for months, or permanently.<br />
If you declaw a cat, and it is outside of a safe home, it will be must more at risk of being killed by a predator:  climbing ability very much reduced, and ability to defend itself, reduced to the point that declawed cats, if outside a safe home, are very often killed.<br />
Triming the nails, or trimming with rubber/plastic caps over the reduced nails, takes care of the problem, though it has to be kept up, the nails will grow back.  And again, stricty outdoor cats have a life-span of a few years, indoor/outdoor 6-9 years, indoor, 15-25 years.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Western Canadian</title>
		<link>http://www.frontpagemag.com/2014/bruce-bawer/life-and-death-in-northern-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-5371275</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Western Canadian]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Feb 2014 21:07:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frontpagemag.com/?p=218962#comment-5371275</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[If you don&#039;t count little things like biting more as a problem, yes, they are right.  Stupid people should not own cats, dogs, etc. in the first place.  Behaviours can be modified, with very high success rates, even in cats. 
Spaying and neutering cuts the number of strays, abused and abandent animals, destroyed litters, agressive behaviour, and increases life span.  As does a proper indoor environment, with access to an enclosed run.  I have been in animal rescue for a long time now, so don&#039;t try to flimflam me via google.
As for fingertips or testicles, since you are still typing, we can guess which you chose.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If you don&#8217;t count little things like biting more as a problem, yes, they are right.  Stupid people should not own cats, dogs, etc. in the first place.  Behaviours can be modified, with very high success rates, even in cats.<br />
Spaying and neutering cuts the number of strays, abused and abandent animals, destroyed litters, agressive behaviour, and increases life span.  As does a proper indoor environment, with access to an enclosed run.  I have been in animal rescue for a long time now, so don&#8217;t try to flimflam me via google.<br />
As for fingertips or testicles, since you are still typing, we can guess which you chose.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Bob Sten</title>
		<link>http://www.frontpagemag.com/2014/bruce-bawer/life-and-death-in-northern-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-5371239</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Bob Sten]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Feb 2014 19:45:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frontpagemag.com/?p=218962#comment-5371239</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[ray,


Yes, western liberalism is rotten to the core.  Full of contradictions and hypocrisy.


It will destroy the west.  Mark my words.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>ray,</p>
<p>Yes, western liberalism is rotten to the core.  Full of contradictions and hypocrisy.</p>
<p>It will destroy the west.  Mark my words.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: SCREW SOCIALISM</title>
		<link>http://www.frontpagemag.com/2014/bruce-bawer/life-and-death-in-northern-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-5371210</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[SCREW SOCIALISM]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Feb 2014 18:52:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frontpagemag.com/?p=218962#comment-5371210</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Hassandnazi,

&quot;(Imagine someone flattening New York and murdering hundreds of thousands of civilians).&quot;

The al qada, taliban, muslim brotherhood playbook again?

Do you really think that 1.5 billion savages can defeat 6 billion Infidels?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hassandnazi,</p>
<p>&#8220;(Imagine someone flattening New York and murdering hundreds of thousands of civilians).&#8221;</p>
<p>The al qada, taliban, muslim brotherhood playbook again?</p>
<p>Do you really think that 1.5 billion savages can defeat 6 billion Infidels?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: SCREW SOCIALISM</title>
		<link>http://www.frontpagemag.com/2014/bruce-bawer/life-and-death-in-northern-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-5371203</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[SCREW SOCIALISM]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Feb 2014 18:46:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frontpagemag.com/?p=218962#comment-5371203</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[You left out the greatest wrong of SOCIALISM.


national SOCIALISM and Soviet SOCIALISM.


The decline and fall of Eurabia is an experiment whose outcome can already be seen.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You left out the greatest wrong of SOCIALISM.</p>
<p>national SOCIALISM and Soviet SOCIALISM.</p>
<p>The decline and fall of Eurabia is an experiment whose outcome can already be seen.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: SCREW SOCIALISM</title>
		<link>http://www.frontpagemag.com/2014/bruce-bawer/life-and-death-in-northern-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-5371199</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[SCREW SOCIALISM]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Feb 2014 18:42:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frontpagemag.com/?p=218962#comment-5371199</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Hassandnazi, your populations are old and killing your young.  See Syria to see modern Islam at work.


130,000+ dead - Arabs killing Arabs.


The day is coming when blowback is going to wipe mecca off the map and end the hajj for thousands of years.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hassandnazi, your populations are old and killing your young.  See Syria to see modern Islam at work.</p>
<p>130,000+ dead &#8211; Arabs killing Arabs.</p>
<p>The day is coming when blowback is going to wipe mecca off the map and end the hajj for thousands of years.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Rebecca</title>
		<link>http://www.frontpagemag.com/2014/bruce-bawer/life-and-death-in-northern-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-5371198</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Rebecca]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Feb 2014 18:40:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frontpagemag.com/?p=218962#comment-5371198</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I thought that the &quot;scientific&quot; problem of inbreeding had been proven to be much over rated, and that certain populations might be experiencing poor development due to weakening  from poor nutrition, or to other causes.  Having the wrong DNA is now an excuse for euthanasia.  I remember being told it would never happen again---because we know too much to let it happen....]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I thought that the &#8220;scientific&#8221; problem of inbreeding had been proven to be much over rated, and that certain populations might be experiencing poor development due to weakening  from poor nutrition, or to other causes.  Having the wrong DNA is now an excuse for euthanasia.  I remember being told it would never happen again&#8212;because we know too much to let it happen&#8230;.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: SCREW SOCIALISM</title>
		<link>http://www.frontpagemag.com/2014/bruce-bawer/life-and-death-in-northern-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-5371196</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[SCREW SOCIALISM]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Feb 2014 18:39:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frontpagemag.com/?p=218962#comment-5371196</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Hassandnazis Imam SHlTler declared War on the US four days after Imperial Japan bombed Pearl Harbor - Dec 11, 1941.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hassandnazis Imam SHlTler declared War on the US four days after Imperial Japan bombed Pearl Harbor &#8211; Dec 11, 1941.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: SCREW SOCIALISM</title>
		<link>http://www.frontpagemag.com/2014/bruce-bawer/life-and-death-in-northern-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-5371195</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[SCREW SOCIALISM]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Feb 2014 18:37:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frontpagemag.com/?p=218962#comment-5371195</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[YOUR fellow national SOCIALISTS murdered millions of people, innocents, women, children - much more than the Allies.


Seems like you are upset that your side LOST WW2.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>YOUR fellow national SOCIALISTS murdered millions of people, innocents, women, children &#8211; much more than the Allies.</p>
<p>Seems like you are upset that your side LOST WW2.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: SCREW SOCIALISM</title>
		<link>http://www.frontpagemag.com/2014/bruce-bawer/life-and-death-in-northern-europe/comment-page-1/#comment-5371194</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[SCREW SOCIALISM]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Feb 2014 18:35:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frontpagemag.com/?p=218962#comment-5371194</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Islamofascism reaps what it sows.

See Syria.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Islamofascism reaps what it sows.</p>
<p>See Syria.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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